Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Saturday, October 12, 2019

My discomfort in the last few years, first with Russiagate and now with Ukrainegate and impeachment, stems from the belief that the people pushing hardest for Trump's early removal are more dangerous than Trump. Many Americans don't see this because they're not used to waking up in a country where you're not sure who the president will be by nightfall. They don't understand that this predicament is worse than having a bad president. But a parallel story was ignored. Leaks from the intelligence community most often pertain to foreign policy. The leak of the January, 2017 "meeting" between the four chiefs and Trump " which without question damaged both the presidency and America's standing abroad " was an unprecedented act of insubordination.

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Interesting perspective....

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You're such a screecher. You have no real idea what goes on in the world around you do you??

#1 | Posted by LauraMohr at 2019-10-12 04:12 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

I read this last night.

So AndreaMackris subscribes to progressive writer Matt Taibbi!

And Matt Taibbi has been questioning and debunking Russiagate, and Muellergate, and now Ukrainegate ... each one from their beginnings.

Question: who else other than Matt Taibbi has also been debunking all this nonsense?

Answer: the progressive comedian Jimmy Dore ... drudge.com

Hey Mackris, I give credit where credit is due -- it's about time you posted something that wasn't hacktastic!

Great thread!

#2 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2019-10-12 04:16 PM | Reply

geeez pinch how much are you getting paid? its getting tiresome

#3 | Posted by truthhurts at 2019-10-12 04:19 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"Answer: the progressive comedian Jimmy Dore ... drudge.com
Hey Mackris, I give credit where credit is due -- it's about time you posted something that wasn't hacktastic!
Great thread!
#2 | POSTED BY PINCHALOAF "

"Everyone come look at me and link to my thread! Look, look, look! If you can't get enough of me on this post, link to my threads!"

#4 | Posted by goatman at 2019-10-12 04:22 PM | Reply

Per the article ...

Here's Taibbi punchline ...

I don't believe most Americans have thought through what a successful campaign to oust Donald Trump would look like.

Most casual news consumers can only think of it in terms of Mike Pence becoming president.

The real problem would be the precedent of a de facto intelligence community veto over elections, using the lunatic ---------- brand of politics that has dominated the last three years of anti-Trump agitation.

CIA/FBI-backed impeachment could also be a self-fulfilling prophecy.

If Donald Trump thinks he's going to be jailed upon leaving office, he'll sooner or later figure out that his only real move is to start acting like the "dictator" MSNBC and CNN keep insisting he is.

Why give up the White House and wait to be arrested, when he still has theoretical authority to send Special Forces troops rappelling through the windows of every last Russiagate/Ukrainegate leaker?

That would be the endgame in a third world country, and it's where we're headed, unless someone calls off this craziness.

Welcome to the Permanent Power Struggle.


Both political parties are corrupt.

That said, the Dems getting in bed with the intel-community who have been aiming their tools and ---------- trade-craft domestically the last 3 years poses real dangers as to where all this is heading, as Taibbi is RIGHTFULLY pointing out.

#5 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2019-10-12 04:29 PM | Reply

FTA

Trump, at least insofar as we know, has not used section 702 of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act to monitor political rivals. He hasn't deployed human counterintelligence "informants" to follow the likes of Hunter Biden. He hasn't maneuvered to secure Special Counsel probes of Democrats.

insofar as we know, but likely

#6 | Posted by truthhurts at 2019-10-12 04:30 PM | Reply

Everyone come look at me

#4POSTED BY GOATMAN AT 2019-10-12 04:23 PM

Boy I don't understand, that's not what I said, I don't parse or scramble words or pretend that my superior intellect will discombobulate others

I mean bless my heart

#7 | Posted by bruceaz at 2019-10-12 04:35 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Hey Mackris, I give credit where credit is due -- it's about time you posted something that wasn't hacktastic!

Screw you! ;-)

#8 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2019-10-12 04:38 PM | Reply

"#7 | POSTED BY BRUCEAZ "

Profound

#9 | Posted by goatman at 2019-10-12 04:39 PM | Reply

#4 | POSTED BY GOATMAN

Whatever gets word out that RabidLiberals are bent on the destruction of the country, to destroy one man.

To believe that all things pass, so long as you don't make it worse.

#10 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2019-10-12 04:40 PM | Reply

FTA

Trump, at least insofar as we know, has not used section 702 of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act to monitor political rivals. He hasn't deployed human counterintelligence "informants" to follow the likes of Hunter Biden. He hasn't maneuvered to secure Special Counsel probes of Democrats.

insofar as we know, but likely

#6 | POSTED BY TRUTHHURTS

See, I agree wholeheartedly.

But this is only because the Democratic Party, run by the same Democrats who are corrupt with Russia and Ukraine, are pushing Trump in that direction.

All this doesn't excuse Trump from being unfit for the office of president, Trump should be impeached -- but impeaching Trump on flimsy Ukraine when the Dems are probably more corrupt -- it's all going to backfire on Democrats, and who knows where this all leads ... political violence in America's streets? Who knows.

And it NEVER had to be this way -- Democrats have PLENTY of legit issues to impeach Trump on or be in opposition over -- but it's all a big pile of crap now, and it will all come out as such if impeachment over Ukraine continues to it's full conclusion.

#11 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2019-10-12 04:41 PM | Reply

"Answer: the progressive comedian Jimmy Dore ... drudge.com
Hey Mackris, I give credit where credit is due -- it's about time you posted something that wasn't hacktastic!
Great thread!
#2 | POSTED BY PINCHALOAF "
"Everyone come look at me and link to my thread! Look, look, look! If you can't get enough of me on this post, link to my threads!"
#4 | POSTED BY GOATMAN

Shut up Danni. But hey, thanks for following me.

POSTED BY GRACIEAMAZED

#12 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2019-10-12 04:42 PM | Reply

Screw you! ;-)

#8 | POSTED BY ANDREAMACKRIS

QFT !

#13 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2019-10-12 04:42 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

Everyone come look at me

#4POSTED BY GOATMAN AT 2019-10-12 04:23 PM

Boy I don't understand, that's not what I said, I don't parse or scramble words or pretend that my superior intellect will discombobulate others

I mean bless my heart

#7 | POSTED BY BRUCEAZ

Yeah, I hear you, Bruce.

Goat-Troll is nothing but a troll who insists on polluting every thread with troll posts ... like a troll wanting to pee on every thread to mark their troll territory -- like a rabid-cockroach spreading it's roach turds.

#14 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2019-10-12 04:46 PM | Reply

insofar as we know, but likely

This is why we are in a "permanent" coup...... You have no idea, but claim the government is completely corrupt .... in which case ...

FTA:
I don't believe most Americans have thought through what a successful campaign to oust Donald Trump would look like. Most casual news consumers can only think of it in terms of Mike Pence becoming president. The real problem would be the precedent of a de facto intelligence community veto over elections, using the lunatic ---------- brand of politics that has dominated the last three years of anti-Trump agitation.

CIA/FBI-backed impeachment could also be a self-fulfilling prophecy. If Donald Trump thinks he's going to be jailed upon leaving office, he'll sooner or later figure out that his only real move is to start acting like the "dictator" MSNBC and CNN keep insisting he is. Why give up the White House and wait to be arrested, when he still has theoretical authority to send Special Forces troops rappelling through the windows of every last Russiagate/Ukrainegate leaker? That would be the endgame in a third world country, and it's where we're headed, unless someone calls off this craziness. Welcome to the Permanent Power Struggle.

If you are going to accuse him of being a "dictator" he might as well act like one.

#15 | Posted by AndreaMackris at 2019-10-12 04:47 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#9

Thank you

#16 | Posted by bruceaz at 2019-10-12 04:47 PM | Reply

"Goat-Troll is nothing but a troll who insists on polluting every thread with troll posts ... like a troll wanting to pee on every thread to mark their troll territory -- like a rabid-cockroach spreading it's roach turds.

#14 | POSTED BY PINCHALOAF "

LOL

Says the guy who pollutes every thread with Jimmy Dore links and links to his own threads. You and Tremain are the only two people I've ever seen link to their own threads. If that doesn't scream "Look at me!" I don't know what does.

Seriously, how can you not see yourself in your own post? There is no way you can be that blind. A little introspection is in order.

You're a hoot, dude.

#17 | Posted by goatman at 2019-10-12 04:52 PM | Reply

If you are going to accuse him of being a "dictator" he might as well act like one.

#15 | POSTED BY ANDREAMACKRIS

I agree -- see post # 5

#18 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2019-10-12 04:53 PM | Reply

"Everyone come look at me and link to my thread! Look, look, look! If you can't get enough of me on this post, link to my threads!"

#4 | POSTED BY GOATMAN

GOATMAN doesn't have any business talking about attention seeking.

Out of curiosity the other day, I counted GOATMAN's posts out of the 100 posts that loaded on the Comments page. 36 were GOATMAN's. 36% of all posts.

It's sad. He's intelligent, but rarely wants to talk about the topic of a thread. He's more about making any thread he shows up on all about him and his idiotic semantics games with other posters. Pretty much the textbook definition of an attention whore.

#19 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY at 2019-10-12 04:58 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"I agree -- see post # 5

#18 | POSTED BY PINCHALOAF "

QFT

#20 | Posted by goatman at 2019-10-12 04:59 PM | Reply

Goatmano

Are you senile
Or just a dick?

I'll answer your questions if you ever answer mine

What are you talking about , which incidence are you referring to blah blah blah

#21 | Posted by bruceaz at 2019-10-12 04:59 PM | Reply

Says the guy who pollutes every thread with Jimmy Dore links and links to his own threads. You and Tremain are the only two people I've ever seen link to their own threads. If that doesn't scream "Look at me!" I don't know what does.

Seriously, how can you not see yourself in your own post? There is no way you can be that blind. A little introspection is in order.

#17 | POSTED BY GOATMAN

Wrong

Troll, you pollute EVERY thread.

I post only in threads that interest me.

But you're an expert on EVERYTHING, Troll.

And looking at your blog entries, you're also an expert on choking your chicken ... drudge.com

So when you're spanking your monkey with your troll-hooves, is your troll-spunk white or black?

Judging by your thread title, I'd guess black -- ain't that right Troll?

#22 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2019-10-12 05:00 PM | Reply

"Pretty much the textbook definition of an attention whore.

#19 | POSTED BY AMERICANUNITY "

What is the textbook definition of someone who says they have you plonked, but keeps talking about you anyway?

Obsessed, maybe?

#23 | Posted by goatman at 2019-10-12 05:01 PM | Reply

QFT

#20 | POSTED BY GOATMAN

Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

Now quote-for-truth me, bitch.

And go get your shine-box while you're at it, Troll.

#24 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2019-10-12 05:02 PM | Reply

"Troll, you pollute EVERY thread.
I post only in threads that interest me.
But you're an expert on EVERYTHING, Troll.
And looking at your blog entries, you're also an expert on choking your chicken ... drudge.com
So when you're spanking your monkey with your troll-hooves, is your troll-spunk white or black?
Judging by your thread title, I'd guess black -- ain't that right Troll?

#22 | POSTED BY PINCHALOAF "

Actually, you post doesn't address mine at all. It's a deflection. And I am 100% correct, as are all the others who complain about your spamming of Jimmy Dore and you linking to your own threads and posts. You and Tremain are the only ones who do that. I am correct about this in spite of your weak deflection.

#25 | Posted by goatman at 2019-10-12 05:03 PM | Reply

Whoa,shinebox, careful dude, he could be Joe Pesci as far as we know

#26 | Posted by bruceaz at 2019-10-12 05:06 PM | Reply

Actually

#25 | POSTED BY GOATMAN

Actually, you forgot to quote-for-truth me, bitch.

Now go spank your monkey and make your dark troll-spunk.

And get your shine-box while you're at it, Troll.

#27 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2019-10-12 05:07 PM | Reply

"And go get your shine-box while you're at it, Troll.

#24 | POSTED BY PINCHALOAF "

I explained to you yesterday I threw it away decades ago. I guess when your head is consumed with Jimmy Dore, you don't have room for anything else. LOL

#28 | Posted by goatman at 2019-10-12 05:07 PM | Reply

#24 | POSTED BY PINCHALOAF "

Anyway, keep talking about me. I'm bowing out. And please don't try to beat the stalking record you set last night when you followed me around to 6 different threads, obsessed one.

Thanks!

#29 | Posted by goatman at 2019-10-12 05:10 PM | Reply

Anyway, keep talking about me. I'm bowing out.

#29 | POSTED BY GOATMAN

Don't worry, we won't.

Just leave, Troll.

#30 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2019-10-12 05:14 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

"What is the textbook definition of someone who says they have you plonked, but keeps talking about you anyway?"

QFT

#31 | Posted by nullifidian at 2019-10-12 05:18 PM | Reply

Well what is it Nullify

Bless your heart

#32 | Posted by bruceaz at 2019-10-12 05:22 PM | Reply

#31 | POSTED BY NULLIFIDIAN

For seemingly forever, you've been posting about Hollywood elites and you've railed about Democratic elites at Martha's Vineyard, etc ...

Well, I get it now -- I totally get it.

The other day I told Laura how she was totally right about Hillary and voting for her in the 2016 general election was a waste of time. I voted for Hillary, and Laura didn't -- I was wrong and Laura was right -- and I said so.

Now I'm saying the same thing to you about the Democratic Party -- be it The Clintons, Obama, and all those both in the DNC and the media who are part of the Neoliberalism order that has been a big part of America's decline the last 40 years ...

So, you were right about all this and I was wrong -- the Democrats are terrible and they are corrupt.

The only difference, and it's a big difference, is that I'm not ever going to cheerlead Trump or the Republicans -- both parties are corrupt, and it's only one's idea of what's worse, that's the deciding factor between the parties.

I just thought I'd get that out of the way -- as I did with Laura.

And I credit Thomas Frank for bringing me clarity to all this.

#33 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2019-10-12 05:36 PM | Reply | Funny: 1 | Newsworthy 1

What garbage.

Republicans elect an absolute schittheap of a POTUS with a long history of cons, lies and scams but are surprised when the conman ends up under investigation for repeated lies, cons and schemes that are clearly aimed at using the office of POTUS to enrich themselves and to ensure the continued enrichment by using our machinations of government to go after political rivals.

You want a sense of normalcy, repubs, then stop supporting the human waste pile you've put in the WH.

YOU have built this. YOU have placed our country within the tumultuous times we're in. YOU continue to prolong them by refusing to admit your mistake and correct it.

YOU are the problem.

And no, the rest of us won't shut up and sit idly by because you'll show yourselves to be the whiny ------- you are when we point out the above. Suck it up, you've earned it.

#34 | Posted by jpw at 2019-10-13 12:04 PM | Reply

What garbage.

Republicans elect an absolute schittheap of a POTUS with a long history of cons, lies and scams but are surprised when the conman ends up under investigation for repeated lies, cons and schemes that are clearly aimed at using the office of POTUS to enrich themselves and to ensure the continued enrichment by using our machinations of government to go after political rivals.

You want a sense of normalcy, repubs, then stop supporting the human waste pile you've put in the WH.

YOU have built this. YOU have placed our country within the tumultuous times we're in. YOU continue to prolong them by refusing to admit your mistake and correct it.

YOU are the problem.

And no, the rest of us won't shut up and sit idly by because you'll show yourselves to be the whiny ------- you are when we point out the above.

Suck it up, you've earned it.

#34 | POSTED BY JPW

Neoliberalism brought us what we have today, a nation that's the richest in the world with half of the population (80% of working Americans) that's unable to afford a $400 emergency expense.

As Thomas Frank has pointed out ...

The Republican Party = the party of the 1% = the Plutocrats

The Democratic Party = the party of the 10% = the Professional Class

As Taibbi points out, Democrats are as corrupt as Trump, and if Dems use impeachment over Ukraine to it's conclusion, political violence will be the result.

You built that -- deal with it.

#35 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2019-10-13 12:31 PM | Reply

"stems from the belief that the people pushing hardest for Trump's early removal are more dangerous than Trump."

Thank you for your opinion on this vital matter, President Putin.

#36 | Posted by snoofy at 2019-10-13 02:20 PM | Reply

F$&& you pinch.

You've gone so far off the deep end you've met the Repubs on the backside of lala land.

#37 | Posted by jpw at 2019-10-13 03:26 PM | Reply

F$&& you pinch.

You've gone so far off the deep end you've met the Repubs on the backside of lala land.

#37 | POSTED BY JPW

Thomas Frank's new book 'The People, No: The War on Populism and the Fight for Democracy', comes out June 2020.

I'll send you an autographed copy next year -- you're welcome.

Frank is a liberal who also wrote the following ...

'Rendezvous with Oblivion: Reports from a Sinking Society'

'Listen, Liberal: Or, What Ever Happened to the Party of the People?'

'What's the Matter with Kansas?: How Conservatives Won the Heart of America'

And if those books don't interest you, you can click on the below link where Frank explains why Dems lose ...

Frank: "Trump won because Clinton and the Democrats dismissed the concerns of working people"
www.youtube.com
[11:42]

QFT

#38 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2019-10-13 04:54 PM | Reply

You keep presenting other people's ideas in place of your own.

Also, you seem to be under the impression that you and only you are for the Dems trying to do more for middle America.

And that's your primary problem because you're far from it nor are you a rational, well thought out voice for it.

#39 | Posted by jpw at 2019-10-13 05:25 PM | Reply

Frank: "Trump won because Clinton and the Democrats dismissed the concerns of working people"

Possibly. But the actual numbers show that black American voting participation dropped 7 percentage points in 2016 compared to 2012, dropping for the first time in 20 years.

The 7-percentage-point decline from the previous presidential election is the largest on record for blacks. (It's also the largest percentage-point decline among any racial or ethnic group since white voter turnout dropped from 70.2% in 1992 to 60.7% in 1996.) The number of black voters also declined, falling by about 765,000 to 16.4 million in 2016, representing a sharp reversal from 2012. With Barack Obama on the ballot that year, the black voter turnout rate surpassed that of whites for the first time. Among whites, the 65.3% turnout rate in 2016 represented a slight increase from 64.1% in 2012.

www.pewresearch.org

Now, compare this fact to both the Mueller report and the Senate Intel committee report from last week which documents
the Internet Research Agency, which has been called a "troll farm" by U.S. officials, targeted black voters with groups urging them not to vote for Hillary Clinton, not to vote at all, or to instead vote for the Green Party's Jill Stein.

(N)o single group of Americans was targeted by IRA information operatives more than African Americans," the report stated. "By far, race and related issues were the preferred target of the information warfare campaign designed to divide the country in 2016."

Russian Facebook pages and Instagram accounts looked to stoke racial tensions, it found, confirming the findings of private researchers.

www.cnbc.com

So I disagree with any conclusions that do not take into account
In two critical states that swung to Trump"Michigan and Wisconsin"black turnout dropped by just more than 12 points. Declines were less dramatic but significant in other swing states Trump carried: Ohio (down 7.5 points), Florida (4.2), and Pennsylvania (2.1). White turnout declined modestly in each of those swing states but Florida and Pennsylvania, where it increased by 3.5 points and 5.2 points respectively. Clinton lost each of those swing states but Ohio by a margin of less than 2 points.

A lack of enthusiasm played an important role in depressing black turnout in Wisconsin and elsewhere. Sabrina Tavernise paid a visit to Milwaukee's majority-black District 15, where turnout declined by almost 20 percent from 2012:

At Upper Cutz, a bustling barbershop in a green-trimmed wooden house, talk of politics inevitably comes back to one man: Barack Obama. [ ... ] All four barbers had voted for Mr. Obama. But only two could muster the enthusiasm to vote this time. And even then, it was a sort of protest. One wrote in Mrs. Clinton's Democratic opponent, Senator Bernie Sanders of Vermont. The other wrote in himself.
Barber Jahn Toney told Tavernise that no president in his lifetime, including Obama, had significantly improved the lives of black people. "It's like I should have known this would happen," he said. "We're worse off than before." Toney wrote in Bernie Sanders.

slate.com

Wonder where they got that idea?

Black Americans vote for the Democratic nominee about 90% of the time. There is no doubt that Hillary would have won had the voting percentages stayed in their historical trendlines regardless of what white working class voters did or did not do on their own.

QFT

#40 | Posted by tonyroma at 2019-10-13 05:30 PM | Reply

You keep presenting other people's ideas in place of your own.

Also, you seem to be under the impression that you and only you are for the Dems trying to do more for middle America.

And that's your primary problem because you're far from it nor are you a rational, well thought out voice for it.

#39 | POSTED BYJPW

If I presented other people's ideas as my own, I wouldn't provide sources as often as I do -- I'd simply lift Thomas Frank's words and present them as my own.

The centrist Democrats response to labor and minorities since Bill Clinton's time is that people like me (working and middle-class voter) had no where else to go ...

How well did that work in 2016 in PA, OH, WI, IA, MI?

All were flipped and went for Trump ...

www.nytimes.com

Thomas Frank has continously pointed for years that Democrats fail to offer anything to working and middle-class voters but high-minded platitudes about education.

And you can see by the 2016 map result that those working and middle-class voters DID have somewhere else to go -- they voted for Trump.

This is because the Democratic Party has become the party that caters to the professional class, and governs that way and threw working and middle-class voters overboard as they embraced neoliberalism.

I'll never vote for Trump, but I also won't vote for a Democratic presidential candidate unless it's Bernie, Yang, Tulsi, Warren (maybe).

#41 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2019-10-13 08:04 PM | Reply

I'm not a fan of zion don but it should be obvious to anyone who isn't a screeching leftist that he's been under constant, nearly-overwhelming attack from the very beginning. It was supposed to be Her Turn and Blumpf's opponents were never going to capitulate, so what do you expect? There's a lot to criticize about this administration but leftists, in their petulant childlike manner, have glommed onto the most spurious claims because this man has blasted their minds into fragments. An enemy of my enemy is not necessarily my friend, but I do commend the man on how he's caused leftists to drop their veil and go full-bore insane.

#42 | Posted by berserkone at 2019-10-14 01:39 AM | Reply

ALso, Glumpf's presidency has moved the Overton window pretty far to the right, relatively speaking, which is a victory because the default has been moving left at breakneck speed since WWII.

#43 | Posted by berserkone at 2019-10-14 01:46 AM | Reply

Even if he wins reelection in 2020 you leftists can enjoy the fact that, due to demographic changes pushed by leftists, there will likely never be another conservative president (s)elected in this country. It's kinda cheating that you leftist atheist bugpeople can just bring in more people who reliably vote left instead of having babies, but the leftist ideology is self-terminating in the absence of replacement voters. Be glad for that - you'll get your revenge, you zero-summers, unless the world ends because of muh climate change before then.

#44 | Posted by berserkone at 2019-10-14 01:53 AM | Reply

#34 | POSTED BY JPW AT 2019-10-13 12:04 PM | REPLY | FLAG: Didn't read the embedded op-ed

I don't have a problem with Democrats acting like an opposition party.

I DO have a huge problem with the bureaucracy acting like an opposition party.

#45 | Posted by JeffJ at 2019-10-14 10:51 AM | Reply

I DO have a huge problem with the bureaucracy acting like an opposition party.

#45 | Posted by JeffJ at

At a certain point, crises like this one devolve into a division of patriots versus fiends.

#46 | Posted by Zed at 2019-10-14 11:29 AM | Reply

At a certain point, crises like this one devolve into a division of patriots versus fiends.

#46 | POSTED BY ZED

Trump by himself wasn't a crisis -- he was legitimately elected.

And wile Trump deserves impeaching for legit reasons, Democrats impeaching Trump over Ukraine IS creating a crisis -- because the Dems are also corrupt on Ukraine.

As it stands now, Dems will impeach their way into Trump winning a second term.

#47 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2019-10-14 11:40 AM | Reply

Trump by himself wasn't a crisis

#47 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2019-

Trump himself is a crisis.

#48 | Posted by Zed at 2019-10-14 11:47 AM | Reply

Democrats impeaching Trump over Ukraine IS creating a crisis -- because the Dems are also corrupt on Ukraine.

As it stands now, Dems will impeach their way into Trump winning a second term.

#47 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2019-10-14 11:40 AM | Reply | Flag

Weird. Very weird.

1) What Trump did with Ukraine is treasonous. Independent of any other treasonous act.

2) You arguments are a propaganda meme arising from the Usual Suspects. This is related to #3 below-

3) The "crimes" I've heard some Democratic Senators accused of in regards to Ukraine (if this is what you speak of) are a willful distortion of events. Lies, in the ancient tongue.

#49 | Posted by Zed at 2019-10-14 11:51 AM | Reply

Trump himself is a crisis.

#48 | POSTED BY ZED

You're wrong, Trump was elected legitimately.

And so was Obama, which right-wingers still argue over.

See what's going on?

These sort of arguments is why Dems lose more often than they win -- and why working and middle-class voters no longer line up behind Democrats.

#50 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2019-10-14 11:55 AM | Reply

Trump himself is a crisis.

#48 | POSTED BY ZED

Here's the correct answer to your mistaken belief ...

The Real Cover-Up - Putting Trump's Impeachment in Context
drudge.com

Centrist Elites Want Trump Impeached for Their Own Political Gain / Many of elites demanding accountability for Ukrainegate were reluctant to do the same for the architects of the Iraq War and the Great Recession.

The same people telling you Trump is a crisis, are they themselves corrupt.

Understand?

#51 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2019-10-14 12:11 PM | Reply

#45 How corrupt does Trump have to be for career bureaucrats to risk their career by reporting illegal corruption?

Many are Trump appointees.

Trump is forcing out anyone that honors their oath and is a patriot.

#52 | Posted by bored at 2019-10-14 12:22 PM | Reply

It's interesting that a few liberals are starting to make this case.

#53 | Posted by JeffJ at 2019-10-14 12:55 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

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