Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Saturday, October 12, 2019

President Trump's surprise acquiescence to a Turkish incursion into northern Syria this week has shaken American allies, and not just because it was a betrayal of a loyal partner. What alarmed them even more was his sheer unpredictability. His inconsistent and rapidly shifting positions in the Middle East have injected a new element of chaos into an already volatile region and have left allies guessing where the United States stands and for how long. ... "If you are someone that is a rival on the other side -- you're Iranian, Russian, Turkish, ISIS, Hezbollah -- you understand that this is the time for gain," argued Shimrit Meir, columnist for the Israeli newspaper Yediot Ahronot.

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Good. Maybe the NATO members who have been leaning on the US since NATO's inception will finally pay their promised 2% of their GDP. Yes, I know Trump has gotten a few of them to chip in a bit more, but most are way behind on their dues.

Besides, why should they be worried? Most of them dislike the US anyway except for the ---- we give them. If they are worried they are admitting their defenses need to be ramped up and not depend on Uncle Sugar to swoop in save them from every little border skirmish.

#1 | Posted by goatman at 2019-10-12 07:35 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

It's one thing to call yourself an ally of the US. It's another to expect the US to do all your heavy lifting when it comes to defense.

Yes. Be afraid. Be very afraid.

It's about time the honeymoon ends.

#2 | Posted by goatman at 2019-10-12 07:37 PM | Reply

Yeah. The US word is worth nothing at this point. It's a shame really. I hear all his sycophants, including the above poster, would like 4 more years of this lame duck liar.

#3 | Posted by BruceBanner at 2019-10-12 07:41 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

We have an unhinged idiot in the Whitehouse. The world has been on edge since the Electoral College put him in office.

#4 | Posted by hamburglar at 2019-10-12 07:43 PM | Reply

" I hear all his sycophants, including the above poster, would like 4 more years of this lame duck liar.

#3 | POSTED BY BRUCEBANNER "

I didn't vote for him the first time. Why do you think I'd vote for him again.

If you have to make ---- up to make a point, it's best to just keep you fingers off the keyboard. Everytime you delve into fantasy posting, you diminish whatever value your word has a little more each time.

#5 | Posted by goatman at 2019-10-12 07:48 PM | Reply

"I didn't vote for him the first time. Why do you think I'd vote for him again."

the number of verifiable falsehoods you have spewed here over the years really discredit you.

now you log in every day and minute by minute you post lies in support of trump.

that's worth at least your vote and many more.

so you did vote for trump and you're his constant campaigner here.

#6 | Posted by BruceBanner at 2019-10-12 08:15 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

People are saying Europe is just going to rent some rooms like Saudi did.

NATO's 2% target is to be reached by 2024.
They are around 1.8% of GDP now, and they are going into a recession. Should be easy to meet.

#7 | Posted by bored at 2019-10-12 08:16 PM | Reply

Having lived outside of my mother's basement unlike some around here, in Europe and elsewhere, interacting with our military and their counterparts from NATO, your viewpoints ring of horsepucky. Why not have one, just one original thought for perhaps the first time rather than what has been fed to you via your favourite flavour of media? All I read is the regurgitation of some hacks talking points. Think for yourself for a change. A challenge, but there ya go.

I try not to be insulting, but really, your points are ridiculous.

#8 | Posted by DMTDust at 2019-10-12 08:17 PM | Reply

It's all bul--hit
. My lady is into the cat catch spay and release program which is cool because no bunches of kittens around the property any more. But certain cats need to be in charge.
Just like the US ,whine and bitch about the costs but we love being 7n charge. Oh world's police, yeah right we love that. We spend way more on our military and way more on our prisons than anywhere else and we like it. Face the facts and stfu

#9 | Posted by bruceaz at 2019-10-12 08:17 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Turkish state-backed media hails a "successful operation" to "neutralize" an unarmed 35-year old woman working to unite Arabs, Christians, and Kurds in NE Syria. Ms. Hevrin Khalef was reportedly dragged from a vehicle and shot to death. That's a war crime. https://t.co/O5hEVQ28jt pic.twitter.com/dn6cl7VUZr

Brett McGurk (@brett_mcgurk) October 12, 2019

Brett McGurk is Trump's former ISIS envoy
Turkey's conflict in Syria took a major turn today. First alleged atrocities by Turkish-backed Arab militias, executing Kurds. US military officials tell me it's true, and they are DEEPLY concerned it opens the door to BOTH ethnic cleansing of Kurds and return of ISIS/Al-Qaeda

Richard Engel (@RichardEngel) October 12, 2019
The Turkish militias and ISIS are killing Kurds and Christians.

#10 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY at 2019-10-12 08:18 PM | Reply

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Trump's plan to pull our special forces out of Syria was the reason behind the resignations of Gen. Mattis and Director of National Intelligence, Dan Coats and his Deputy Director.

#11 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY at 2019-10-12 08:32 PM | Reply

"It's one thing to call yourself an ally of the US. It's another to expect the US to do all your heavy lifting when it comes to defense.
Yes. Be afraid. Be very afraid.
You mean like the Kurds doing the heavy lifting in fighting ISIS for the USA?

#12 | Posted by tknees at 2019-10-12 11:45 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

The Turkish militias and ISIS are killing Kurds and Christians.

#10 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY

And yet the Trump sycophants will utter not even a whimper about this, which was supposedly a major concern during the Arab Spring days under Obama.

#13 | Posted by jpw at 2019-10-13 01:37 AM | Reply

"Besides, why should they be worried? Most of them dislike the US anyway except for the ---- we give them."

I had always heard that too, and maybe it's true. But I don't think so. I remember being in Qatar, and seeing women in the full get-up; the only thing visible was their feet. I remember a lady wearing high heeled Stars and stripes shoes.

My kids went shopping the other day, and asked me why all the clothes were in some way tied to the US? They had the names of famous US cities on them.

A few hours ago I was at a little bar out in the middle of nowhere. There were a few old German people there. One lady had on an American flag shirt.

I'm not going to comment on what it does or doesn't mean, but I do know that no one in my family owns an American flag shirt, or any article of clothing that could be considered distinctly American. And I am from the US.

#14 | Posted by madbomber at 2019-10-13 02:56 PM | Reply

"And yet the Trump sycophants will utter not even a whimper about this, which was supposedly a major concern during the Arab Spring days under Obama."

Well, it's not like you can let give the Democrats and advantage.

Party uber alles. Even when the party is an abject ------- dumpster fire.

#15 | Posted by madbomber at 2019-10-13 02:58 PM | Reply

"#14 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER "

I understand what you are saying. I have differing stories, but admiitedly they are anecdotal like yours.

A biggy is the US Navy. When I was in the service (1975-1981) American ships were welcome almost every where (Soviet bloc countries exclused, of course) and we had port of calls in all sorts of places in the Middle East ,North Atlantic Med, Caribbean, Indian Ocean, and Western Pacific. I went to 55 different ports in 33 different countries in 6 years. That's not counting American ports, of course. I understand now that Navy ship's ports of call are very limited due to dislike of Americans and that sailors spend a lot more time at sea than they used to and visiit far fewer ports.

A lot of this could be that WW2 was only 30 years earlier and people remember the USA's participation. That might explain the old German lady you described. But whatever the reason, the US Navy is no longer as welcome as they used to be. And from what I hear and experience from my won travels, I feel Americans are not as well liked -- except as I said barring the stuff we give them monetarily and mmilitarily.

#16 | Posted by goatman at 2019-10-13 03:10 PM | Reply

"That might explain the old German lady you described. But whatever the reason, the US Navy is no longer as welcome as they used to be."

I'll disagree.

I started off enlisted in the Navy. When I was in, US warships could not port in Australia. It was a nuke thing.

Now we routinely position bombers in Australia.

I'm no longer in the Navy...and I'm sure there are places the Navy used to that they don't any more (Hong Kong maybe), but I think you'd find there are far more countries where they are or would be welcome. I'm guessing you never ported in Croatia, but the USS Abraham Lincoln did. And the Romanian Navy goes out of it's way to integrate with US forces. Many of those old Communist Countries jump at any opportunity to train with US forces.

And if you're an American, you'll never need to buy a beer in southern Belgium.

#17 | Posted by madbomber at 2019-10-13 03:47 PM | Reply

"I started off enlisted in the Navy. When I was in, US warships could not port in Australia. It was a nuke thing."

When were you active duty?

Japan had the same nuclear restrictions, (big surprise, huh?) but since the official policy was "can't confirm nor deny the presence of nukes" we were allowed in. Since my ship is long decommissioned, I can say that we did have nuclear depth charges (we were Knox class frigate, strictly ASW)

"but I think you'd find there are far more countries where they are or would be welcome.

That's not what I'm hearing from my cousin's son. Granted he's still a fresh butter bar, so he may be hearing from more seasoned officers. But I read the same in Stars and Stripes.

"And if you're an American, you'll never need to buy a beer in southern Belgium.

#17 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER "

Or on the train from Kingston on the Hull to East Anglia via Petersborough. LOL Don't have time to go into that story. Same with French, Swede or Brit ships. They'll keep you plied! At least back in the '70s

When were your in? Rate? Ship and home port? I was a Sonar Tech, PO2 when I got out, on the USS Holt out of Pearl Harbor and USS Montgomery out of Mayport, FL. In fact the Montgomery had a four day ship's reunion here in San Antonio last weekend. I saw some shipmates I hadn't seen in 40 years. It was great.

#18 | Posted by goatman at 2019-10-13 04:03 PM | Reply

" Since my ship is long decommissioned, I can say that we did have nuclear depth charges (we were Knox class frigate, strictly ASW)"

For those who are thinking depth charges are the things they roll off the ship as in WW2 movies and wondering, "nukes?", no, it's nothing like that. They are rocket thrown via an ASROC (Anti Submarine ROCket) missile.

Yeah, it would be kind of self-defeating to roll one of those off of the back of the ship. LOL

#19 | Posted by goatman at 2019-10-13 04:10 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

"When were you active duty?"

1994-1998

"When were your in? Rate? Ship and home port?"

I was last an AT3 assigned to VF-31. I stared out at NAS Miramar. Tow years there before moving to Oceana in 1996. I was first on the Carl Vinson, and later on the Abraham Lincoln.

When I separated, I had no interest in anything military, but was offered an AFROTC scholarship and took it.

You'll be pained to know that our allies no longer open the bars while at sea. But they can smoke pot now. At least the Canadians can.

The French, Belgians, Poles, and Italians have still not submitted to US totalitarianism in the desert...still no limit on what they can and can't do. But the Aussies and the Canadians are actually more restrictive. I would have never thought our colonial cousins would wind up being bigger prudes than us.

#20 | Posted by madbomber at 2019-10-13 04:59 PM | Reply

After commissioning I went through Navigators school before going to be a B-52 WSO. I did that full time up until 2013, when I went to staff. I was technically current and qualified through June 2019, but there is no good reason to let the old people fly. It takes a lot of effort to stay current. Now I'm mostly engaged in multi-domain integration and the next fight. Which suits me fine, because I have no interest in pre-flighting jets when it's 120F on the ramp. That's what we have O-3's for.

#21 | Posted by madbomber at 2019-10-13 05:04 PM | Reply

"#20 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER "

Thanks for the info. Good thing you aren't on the Lincoln today!

"Miramar": Good duty in San Diego. I went to my B/EE and C schools for 12 months at FLTASWTRACENPAC (across the infamous bridge from NTC/RTC) and 1 month at Miramar for a hydraulic school. (My sonar, the 35 VDS was hydraulically controlled) I love San Diego. I lived in Ocean Beach those 13 months. It was still the '60s there when I lived there, but 1976 every where else. Loved it. I'd live there now if it wasn't so expensive.

#22 | Posted by goatman at 2019-10-13 05:12 PM | Reply

Thank God Trump wasn't President during WW2.

Europe would all be Germany and Japan would have taken over the South Pacific.

#23 | Posted by ClownShack at 2019-10-13 10:17 PM | Reply

The Syrians and Russians will help the Kurds against the Turks. Kurds let down by USA again :(

#24 | Posted by Nuke_Gently at 2019-10-13 10:32 PM | Reply

Europe would all be Germany and Japan would have taken over the South Pacific.

I doubt it. Vastly complicated concept though.

My take is Adolf didn't have the resources to take and hold all of Europe for long, and neither did Japan for the Pacific.

#25 | Posted by REDIAL at 2019-10-13 10:33 PM | Reply

"My take is Adolf didn't have the resources to take and hold all of Europe for long, and neither did Japan for the Pacific.
#25 | POSTED BY REDIAL"

Exactly But if half the 7th fleet wasn't at sea on December 7 and Hitler had listened to his generals and not gotten bogged down on the Easter front, things might have been different.

Still, Japan had an uphill battle even if Pearl Harbor did go better for them.

#26 | Posted by goatman at 2019-10-13 10:42 PM | Reply

We have an unhinged idiot in the Whitehouse.

#4 | Posted by hamburglar

I think the spy you call the whistleblower has been removed.

#27 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2019-10-13 10:42 PM | Reply

Or on the train from Kingston on the Hull to East Anglia via Petersborough. LOL Don't have time to go into that story.

#18 | Posted by goatman

Noted.

#28 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2019-10-13 10:47 PM | Reply

Exactly But if half the 7th fleet wasn't at sea on December 7 and Hitler had listened to his generals..

Custer should have waited for Terry. Hindsight is a bitch. And it's not fair bitch.

I find it hard to fault anyone who makes their best move if it goes wrong, unless it was blatantly stupid to begin with.

#29 | Posted by REDIAL at 2019-10-13 11:04 PM | Reply

"I find it hard to fault anyone who makes their best move if it goes wrong, unless it was blatantly stupid to begin with.

#29 | POSTED BY REDIAL "

Exactly. And Pearl Harbor was stupid. As Admiral Yamamoto famously said after the attack, "We have awakened a sleeping giant." He knew it was a stupid move

#30 | Posted by goatman at 2019-10-13 11:08 PM | Reply

Exactly. And Pearl Harbor was stupid

The concept was sound. The US Carriers not being in port at the time ------ it up for Japan.

Fog of War and all that. Had they hit the actual targets?

#31 | Posted by REDIAL at 2019-10-13 11:29 PM | Reply

>It's about time the honeymoon ends.
We only get forever wars in return unless and until leftists stop being so belligerent and assuming they can be the world police.

#32 | Posted by berserkone at 2019-10-14 12:12 AM | Reply

>The US word is worth nothing at this point. It's a shame really
>The world has been on edge since the Electoral College put him in office.
>The Turkish militias and ISIS are killing Kurds and Christians.
>You mean like the Kurds doing the heavy lifting in fighting ISIS for the USA?

all I see is clamoring for more war without end. Liberals used to be against this kind of thing, but leftists' minds have been shattered by the current occupant of the White House. Blumpf really did a job on you guys, didn't he?

#33 | Posted by berserkone at 2019-10-14 12:17 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Urgent notification for all pro-war leftists:
Blumpf breathes air, eats food, and drinks water. In order to maximally dissociate, I suggest you refrain from the aforementioned behaviors, grab a rifle and buy a plane ticket to Syria. Free Kurdistan will not be realized without your valiant efforts!

#34 | Posted by berserkone at 2019-10-14 12:21 AM | Reply

>you guys
In an effort to be more inclusive, I retract this statement and amend it as follows:
you xim xap xappitydoos
as long as we're gonna feed people into the meat-grinder, we might as well be inclusive. Just be forewarned that the SAA is unlikely to be merciful on account of your very feminine penis.

#35 | Posted by berserkone at 2019-10-14 12:25 AM | Reply

Last week Turkey had not attacked and killed Kurds. That was peace through strength.

Erdogan intimidated trampy into ticking tail and abandoning an ally. Trampy escalated the conflict by his traitorous actions.

He is serving warlords in expectation of payoffs. That increases war.

#36 | Posted by bored at 2019-10-14 12:34 AM | Reply

grab a rifle and buy a plane ticket to Syria. Free Kurdistan will not be realized without your valiant efforts!

#34 | Posted by berserkone

At least call your representatives in Congress and demand that they declare war.

#37 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2019-10-14 02:01 AM | Reply

Why should I give a damn about what warlords on the other side of the globe do to each other? We've been way overextended for decades, and can't be everybody's daddy. Let them fight it out; my life changes precisely 0% due to tribal warfare over patches of desert and mountainous desert. Fug off.

#38 | Posted by berserkone at 2019-10-14 02:38 AM | Reply

>my life changes precisely 0%
as a consequence; however, tax lollars spent to support one side or the other definitely affects Americans

#39 | Posted by berserkone at 2019-10-14 02:41 AM | Reply

Why should I give a damn about what warlords on the other side of the globe do to each other? We've been way overextended for decades, and can't be everybody's daddy. Let them fight it out; my life changes precisely 0% due to tribal warfare over patches of desert and mountainous desert. Fug off.

#38 | Posted by berserkone

Great, so when a candidate says it's time to scale back the DoD budget you're all in to support that, right?

#40 | Posted by jpw at 2019-10-14 08:15 AM | Reply

Great, so when a candidate says it's time to scale back the DoD budget you're all in to support that, right?

#40 | Posted by jpw at 2019

I think BERKESONE would say that we continue to need a huge military budget to make it for Trump to screw the next war ally.

#41 | Posted by Zed at 2019-10-14 11:25 AM | Reply

so when a candidate says it's time to scale back the DoD budget you're all in to support that, right?

#40 | POSTED BY JPW

Yes, I'm all in for supporting that -- we should scale back the DoD budget because we already got more than enough military hardware coming out of our ears to last us the rest of the century.

If you have anymore softball questions, just let me know -- I'm here for you.

#42 | Posted by PinchALoaf at 2019-10-14 11:44 AM | Reply

Lindsey Graham publicly excoriated Turkey for their invasion of Syria and attacks on the Kurds.

But when Russian pranksters got him on the phone during a hoax call, pretending to be the Turkish Defense Minister, Graham sympathized with Turkey's 'problem' with the Kurds.

Graham labeled the Kurds a "threat" to Turkey in the call.

Also:

Graham also mentions Trump's personal interest in a "Turkish bank case" in the call that appears to refer to a U.S. case involving Reza Zarrab, an Iranian-Turkish gold trader and client of Trump's personal lawyer Rudy Giuliani. Bloomberg reported on Wednesday that Trump had asked then-Secretary of State Rex Tillerson in 2017 to help persuade the Justice Department to drop the Zarrab case.

https://www.politico.com/news/2019/10/10/lindsey-graham-trump-hoax-call-043991

#43 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY at 2019-10-14 01:49 PM | Reply

And now, Erdogan is asking Trump to mediate for peace.

ROTFLMAO

#44 | Posted by DixvilleNotch at 2019-10-14 10:09 PM | Reply

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