Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Saturday, November 09, 2019

Do you think the president of the United States pressuring another country to investigate a political rival is a high crime and misdemeanor? Is it just morally wrong? Or is it just politics as usual, something presidents do all the time? Almost two-thirds of Republicans see Trump's behavior as typical political maneuvering.

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Forty-four percent of the country, however, says that presidents pressure other countries to investigate their domestic political rivals all the time. That belief, at least right now, is heavily concentrated among Republicans " almost two-thirds of Republicans see Trump's behavior as typical political maneuvering.

So now, the argument has mutated: Yes, Trump did it, but it's fine that he did it. Pressuring a foreign government to investigate your chief domestic political rival isn't wrong, and even if it is wrong, everybody does it.

That's the level of cynicism Trump is forcing his supporters to embrace. It's not quite, as Nixon famously said, "when the president does it, that means that it is not illegal." It's closer to: when the president does it, that means it's normal.

The scary thing about that is it could become a self-fulfilling prophecy. If the Republican Party chooses to treat what Trump has done as normal and protect him from consequences or sanction, then perhaps it will become normal. Perhaps it does just become a tactic, another power the incumbent can leverage against threats.

We don't get the political system we deserve. We get the political system we accept.

If the 250 year old American democratic experiment does indeed expire on the garbage heap of Cult 45, let history document exactly who killed it and the loathsome reasons why it died.

#1 | Posted by tonyroma at 2019-11-09 03:58 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

It's indistinguishable from prior Democrat behaviour.

#2 | Posted by visitor_ at 2019-11-09 04:29 PM | Reply | Funny: 6

On cue

#3 | Posted by hamburglar at 2019-11-09 04:35 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 8

It's indistinguishable from prior Democrat behaviour.

Then you should be able to document such behaviours with actual links supporting your delusional assertion.

One unassailable fact would be that if any Democratic president ever tried something like Trump has done the Republicans would readily use it to support him.

Where's the beef ignatz? What Democrat behaviour are you referring to?

#4 | Posted by tonyroma at 2019-11-09 04:36 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 5

65% of republicans are "Idiocracy level" morons.

#5 | Posted by aborted_monson at 2019-11-09 04:47 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

A Democrat makes an overt threat to stop aid in order to get a prosecutor fired and kill an investigation. A Republican implies a threat for cooperation in reopening same investigation.

#6 | Posted by visitor_ at 2019-11-09 05:21 PM | Reply | Funny: 3

The DR number is more like 100%.

#7 | Posted by snoofy at 2019-11-09 05:35 PM | Reply

#6

The Vice President was implementing the US Government's official policy in conjunction with the IMF, sundry Western governments and anti-corruption organizations in requiring that a corrupt prosecutor who WASN'T pursuing necessary anti-corruption investigations be fired before the US would give Ukraine loan guarantees.

The prosecutor wasn't investigating corruption, he was protecting the corruptors. You already know the truth, so why keep clinging to your lies?

Does it make you feel better, stunod?

#8 | Posted by tonyroma at 2019-11-09 05:36 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 6

I'd say maybe 65% of DR so-called "Independents" think Trump Ukraine scheme is normal.

#9 | Posted by snoofy at 2019-11-09 05:37 PM | Reply

"A Republican implies a threat for cooperation in reopening same investigation."

^
To what is this referring?

#10 | Posted by snoofy at 2019-11-09 05:39 PM | Reply

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Of course they do.

Because to righties, whatever is necessary at that exact moment is what's "right".

#11 | Posted by jpw at 2019-11-09 06:38 PM | Reply

Aside from what Pres Trump's supporters think...

My big concern is that the President of the United States sees nothing wrong with using American taxpayer dollars to further his political campaign.

Pres Trump see nothing wrong with that.

That is frightening.

What other illegal activities does he see no wrong in committing?

#12 | Posted by LampLighter at 2019-11-09 07:43 PM | Reply

What other illegal activities does he see no wrong in committing?

All of them.

#13 | Posted by tonyroma at 2019-11-09 10:20 PM | Reply

"But more importantly, Article II allows me to do whatever I want."

-Illegitimate President Bucket of ----

#14 | Posted by truthhurts at 2019-11-09 11:32 PM | Reply

Anyone here remember what Nixon's supporters used to say how every President does it, only he got caught? Fourty-five years later and the GOP has not changed.

#15 | Posted by SLBronkowitz at 2019-11-09 11:34 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Then they could go on and say he could not help being that way because NYC real estate guys always work like that.

65% of GOPers dine and dash. I wonder if they would care if people thought that about them.

#16 | Posted by grumpy_too at 2019-11-09 11:53 PM | Reply

A Democrat makes an overt threat to stop aid in order to get a prosecutor fired and kill an investigation.

#6 | Posted by visitor

The request that the Ukrainian prosecutor be fired was based on the idea that he was NOT doing any investigations. He was taking money from the people that he was supposed to be dealing with. He was part of the corruption that was rampant in Ukraine at that time. And Joe Biden was acting at the behest of not only the United States but also our European allies who were also providing aid to Ukraine. He was not acting in a way that anyone would have personally gained from the firing of the aforementioned Ukrainian prosecutor. In fact, one of the investigations that the prosecutor had 'overlooked' was Burisma Holdings, the company Hunter Biden was a board member. So the reality was that Joe Biden was creating a situation in which his son's employer could have been negatively impacted. If Joe Biden had wanted to play it safe with respect to his son's situation, he would NOT have tried to have the Ukrainian prosecutor replaced. He would have wanted to keep the guy in place since he was NOT doing his job.

OCU

#17 | Posted by OCUser at 2019-11-10 12:33 AM | Reply

65% feel its ok suggests that 35% think it is not OK. So figure the population is 50/50 republican v democrat. And if it were near unanimous that the Democrats feel its not OK and 35% of the Republican feel its OK then doesn't that come out to like 70% of the American public feel its not OK?

#18 | Posted by prius04 at 2019-11-10 12:56 AM | Reply

Wait, didn't they vote for Trump because he wasn't like the others?

#19 | Posted by TFDNihilist at 2019-11-10 07:09 AM | Reply

"The guy we voted in to not be a corrupt politician is really a corrupt politician, oh well."
-Trump Humpers

#20 | Posted by TFDNihilist at 2019-11-10 07:10 AM | Reply

OCU, why would you waste your time trying to tell the truth to Visitor? He is aware of the truth but wants to lure stupid folks here, who don't know the truth, to believe crap that he knows isn't true. That is what Russian bots are trained to do. If there is a bot on this blog it is visitor. Unthinking, unfeeling, just trained to always argue against anyone trying to offer truth.

#21 | Posted by danni at 2019-11-10 09:16 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

My big concern is that the President of the United States sees nothing wrong with using American taxpayer dollars to further his political campaign.
Pres Trump see nothing wrong with that.
That is frightening.
What other illegal activities does he see no wrong in committing?
#12 | POSTED BY LAMPLIGHTER

Well he doesn't see anything wrong with using charity donation for veterans to further his campaign. He clearly has zero ethical or moral qualms with any shady/illegal tactic to further his brand and his supporters have shown they don't care.

#22 | Posted by johnny_hotsauce at 2019-11-10 10:21 AM | Reply

Yeah!! It's obvious this presidents has not morals.

This is how he does it.

So

When will you people with a actual integrity, honesty and morals "get over it"?

#23 | Posted by donnerboy at 2019-11-10 11:15 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"But more importantly, Article II allows me to do whatever I want."

And if that does not work.

There is always the 2nd amendment.

And 5th ave.

#24 | Posted by donnerboy at 2019-11-10 11:16 AM | Reply

This country's fate was sealed 1619 when the first African slaves were brought ashore in Jamestown. Many of the most horrible things that have happened in the history of the US have been a consequence of, or greatly impacted by, racial inequality. It has tremendous impact today. Almost all Republicans are white, and the majority of white people are Republicans. Why?

#25 | Posted by WhoDaMan at 2019-11-10 02:32 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

I'd be willing to bet the numbers would be similar if they were asked if Nixon got framed.

#26 | Posted by Angrydad at 2019-11-10 09:54 PM | Reply

The argument from balanced people isn't that what Trump did is OK because every other POTUS does it. It's kind of ignorant to believe otherwise. The argument is that if he is going to go down for it then the same treatment he is receiving needs to be given to EVERY POTUS. But that's not what happens. Once we get a Dem in office again, all of this will be forgotten by them and defended vehemently when the new POTUS is found to have done something in a corrupt manner. If every POTUS were held to the same standard regardless of partisan opinions, I assume most of the crap that both sides are spewing about this particular issue wouldn't even exist. Obama is on microphone colluding with Putin and the Dems defended him like crazy and Cons cried like babies. Trump just sits in a same room as Putin and Dems accuse him of being Putin's puppet. Just one example of hundreds of how partisan politics has caused "normal behavior" to become either the worst thing in the world or the best strategy ever, depending on which side you are on and how much hate you keep in your heart.

#27 | Posted by humtake at 2019-11-11 12:58 PM | Reply

The whole Trump-Ukraine thing stinks, but is it worse than LBJ killing millions of people in Vietnam to get himself reelected?

#28 | Posted by SomebodyElse at 2019-11-11 04:14 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

65% of GOPers Think Trump Ukraine Scheme Is Normal Behavior

It's because 100% of the information they're receiving tells them that Trump's actions is normal behavior.

There's no thinking taking place amongst them.

#29 | Posted by ClownShack at 2019-11-11 04:24 PM | Reply

#27 | POSTED BY HUMTAKE

No. They don't all do it. They don't ask foreign governments to interfere in our elections. That is purely a conservative thing.

The closest equivalency you can get from the Obama administration for this is the "IRS targeting scandal" and claim Obama tried to put his thumb on the election through that. Because the claim there is that they questioned the tax exempt status of conservative groups for political gain. And, supposedly, not having tax-exempt status for groups "operated exclusively for the promotion of social welfare" would have severely hindered conservative political activism, even though those groups were supposed to not be political. But anyways... Aside from the fact that was mostly BS (they also "targeted" liberal groups who showed political leanings), that also was a decision made by subordinates. Conservatives have given no proof that Obama even knew it was going on, much less approved it.

But don't you remember how INCENSED conservatives were over it? How they WAILED and SCREAMED about it like it was the end of the world? Republican Congressman Kerry Bentivolio even "looked into" impeaching Obama over it.

Here, you have a conservative president DIRECTLY ASKING a foreign head of state to investigate (and put out a public statement SAYING he was investigating) Trump's POLITICAL OPPONENT (possibly) in the upcoming election. Give me an example that is ANYWHERE EQUIVALENT in what Obama did. Fast and Furious? IRS Targeting? Bowe Bergdahl? Benghazi? Uranium One? The "Tan Suit"????

You say that they all do it, but any objective observer would see that is not the case.

But, this is the here and now. Lets try to build a bipartisan consensus. As you indicated above, we can ALL agree (conservatives, independents, and liberals) that Republican politicians (like Trump) are corrupt --------. And I would think we could agree that corrupt -------- should not be President of the United States. So, lets just start to bridge the gap by impeaching the one that we ALL can agree should be impeached.

We can just agree to disagree on whether Obama should have been impeached.

#30 | Posted by gtbritishskull at 2019-11-11 04:28 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"And, supposedly, not having tax-exempt status for groups "operated exclusively for the promotion of social welfare" would have severely hindered conservative political activism"

Which is a lie from the pretend "victims". As the IG report pointed out, approval was assumed upon application, and if there were any denials (there was ONE, for a liberal group), the prior activity was still perfectly legal and acceptable. Any delays had no legal effect at all regarding their operations, fundraising, or advertising.

#31 | Posted by Danforth at 2019-11-11 04:44 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"The argument is that if he is going to go down for it then the same treatment he is receiving needs to be given to EVERY POTUS."

Well in that case, let's just impeach Trump for stealing $2.8 Million from charity donations for Veterans...something which would've gotten every other President in our lifetimes impeached by sundown.

#32 | Posted by Danforth at 2019-11-11 04:46 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Ukraine Scheme? really. nice premise

should be, Trump is trying to get to the bottom of the 2016 collusion and what Cloud Strike's participation was in the real collusion

that's what he was asking about

#33 | Posted by Maverick at 2019-11-11 07:16 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

#33 | POSTED BY MAVERICK

And... how does Biden and Burisma fit into "2016 collusion and what Cloud Strike's participation was"?

Because it is really his focus on Biden (his potential political opponent) that people think is impeachable. Focusing on paranoid baseless conspiracy theories, and screwing up foreign policy to do so, is something to criticize Trump for but does not really rise up to the level of "impeachable". That stupid, gullible behavior is pretty much expected from conservatives at this point.

#34 | Posted by gtbritishskull at 2019-11-11 07:50 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Gee. I hope The Ukraine does not want to interfere in the 2020 election too!!

#35 | Posted by Nuke_Gently at 2019-11-11 10:38 PM | Reply

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