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Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Saturday, August 01, 2020

Trump ordered federal forces to quell Portland protests, a miserable failure that only exacerbated the situation causing the protest to swell. As expected, the chaos ended as soon as Trump's federal forces left.

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What do you think should be done?
#39 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER AT 2020-07-25 11:22 AM | REPLY | FLAG:
--------------
What I think would take care of this? I believe what needs to happen is the Federal insertion needs to end now. They have to disappear.
The police need to back down with teargas and beating people. ...
I would limit police visibility as much as possible.
(In) Chile when I was there this last year...once the police withdrew, and a few days went by so people could process and let the emotion die down, then the only fires set were in the middle of the streets, and in 55 gallon drums.
#41 | POSTED BY YAV AT 2020-07-25 11:36 AM | FLAG:
--------------
OK.
And then what?
Does the mob just do what the mob wants to do?
If they disperse, fine? If not, that's OK too?
#43 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER AT 2020-07-25 11:49 AM | REPLY | FLAG

drudge.com

Portland, I'm counting on you not to make me eat my words!

#1 | Posted by YAV at 2020-07-31 07:15 PM | Reply

Don't kid yourself Yav, the Feds haven't gone anywhere yet, the Oregon State Police cleared the parks and removed all the staging materials and the night was relatively uneventful as a result.

The Feds are just waiting for the violence to escalate so that they can truly take to the streets.

#2 | Posted by leftcoastlawyer at 2020-07-31 07:27 PM | Reply

Forget WaPo on this, the Oregonian is the best site to find what is really going on:

Leaders in Thursday night crowd called out violence, turned focus away from federal courthouse in Portland

"They succeeded on the first night of a deal struck between the federal government and Oregon's governor to try to break the cycle of violence that has erupted nightly at the courthouse since early July as a smaller group of protesters and federal officers clash, often in a cloud of smoke from fires, fireworks, tear gas and pepper spray.

Oregon State Police troopers and Portland police officers are now handling public safety outside the Mark O. Hatfield United States Courthouse. Gov. Kate Brown announced that the extra federal officers from a Border Patrol tactical group, U.S. Marshals Service etc. will start returning home.

Other than early in the evening before crowds arrived, there were no signs of any police officers " local, state or federal " on what was the 64th night of consecutive demonstrations in the wake of George Floyd's death in Minneapolis.

At one point near midnight, a couple of dozen black-clad younger men and women arrived with shields, gas masks, hockey and lacrosse sticks.

Some people started to bang on or shake the fence, some tossed a couple of glass bottles over the fence and ignited fireworks.

Others in the throng balked. They steadfastly called out the agitation and shifted the focus away from unrest.

"All you who want to start something? Bring that (expletive) to another block!" Gary Floyd shouted into the megaphone in the middle of the gathering. Floyd said he's from Louisiana and had been in Portland a week, coming here from Seattle.

"It's all about peaceful protest!" he yelled.

Another man " Daniel Thomas, who lives in downtown Portland --grabbed a bullhorn walked through the crowd.

"Attacking the federal building is not Black Lives Matter," yelled Thomas, who has brought his electric guitar out on some nights to play near the Justice Center. "Attacking the federal building doesn't make any sense. ... This is not Black Lives Matter!

"You're playing Trump's hands," he went on. "It's going to hurt Blacks more than whites. ... Attacking the federal building is the wrong approach."

Someone who disagreed tried to drown out Thomas with her own megaphone, yelling: "Take to the streets and (expletive) the police!"

Another woman on a speaker, Maya Malika, demanded: "How do we get out of this mess? Revolution, nothing less!" Malika said she came from Los Angeles with others in the crowd as part of what they called the National Revolution Tour, whose website says it's the "voice of the Revolutionary Communist Party, USA."

#3 | Posted by leftcoastlawyer at 2020-07-31 07:32 PM | Reply

Another woman on a speaker, Maya Malika, demanded: "How do we get out of this mess? Revolution, nothing less!" Malika said she came from Los Angeles with others in the crowd as part of what they called the National Revolution Tour, whose website says it's the "voice of the Revolutionary Communist Party, USA."
#3 | POSTED BY LEFTCOASTLAWYER

So not antifa.

IOW, it's the communists calling for violence. Am I interpreting that right?

#4 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2020-07-31 07:35 PM | Reply

Don't kid yourself Yav, the Feds haven't gone anywhere yet, the Oregon State Police cleared the parks and removed all the staging materials and the night was relatively uneventful as a result.

1) I didn't say they were gone, I said they'd left as in "not visible." It's in the article. I said the same of the police, except they occasionally could be seen peaking out of a window.
2) the OSP didn't clear the "parks" and didn't remove "staging materials" the same people that do it every day did. That being city workers, store owners and volunteers:

"Hundreds of volunteers gathered twice last week to pick up litter in areas of the city that had seen large crowds of protesters in previous nights. For many of the volunteers, this was their way of showing support for these protests and participating in their own way."
www.oregonlive.com
It's been the same from then through today.

I don't know why you made it "parks" and "staging materials" except you wanted drama. Neither parks nor the OSP doing cleanup was mentioned in any link you posted, and there's only one park I know that's impacted, that's Lownsdale Park, but I could be mistaken. Still have no idea what "staging materials" are, or why they'd be left out since the entire area is cleaned up every day.

#5 | Posted by YAV at 2020-07-31 08:47 PM | Reply

#4

No idea, but most communists are anti-fascists.

#5

I didn't say they were gone.

I misunderstood, your title says "Portland: After the Feds Withdrew".

I don't know why you made it "parks" and "staging materials"

Portland police clear parks across from federal courthouse in early-morning sweep

"Portland police cleared an entrenched encampment at Lownsdale Square across the street from the federal courthouse in downtown early Thursday at the request of Oregon State Police, who are set to assume control of the scene of nightly protests that have roiled the city.

The Portland Police Bureau said the city park and neighboring Chapman Square, as well as the sidewalks surrounding them, will remain closed.

The parks have been the staging grounds for nightly clashes with federal officers from the Department of Homeland Security, Federal Protective Services and Customs and Border Patrol agents."

Portland PD and Oregon State Police both said that they had removed "staging materials", Google is your friend.

#6 | Posted by leftcoastlawyer at 2020-07-31 09:45 PM | Reply

Not my job to google when you're making the claim.

I see it was Lownsdale Park as I stated and that the OSP didn't clear anything. The PP did at their request along with park rangers.
They also started at 5:30AM and this was to wipe out the encampment, not clean up anything from the protests.
Also there's no mention of "staging materials."
Also not "parks" - just the one, but you get a pass because the reporter moved from "park" and "park" and "park" to suddenly saying "parks" for no apparent reason.
Thanks for the link.

#7 | Posted by YAV at 2020-07-31 09:54 PM | Reply

Portland PD and Oregon State Police both said that they had removed "staging materials", Google is your friend.

Only hits are for your words on this site. I tried several variations:
Portland police and Oregon State Police remove "staging materials"
Portland police remove "staging materials"
Portland police remove staging materials
Police remove staging materials.

Nothing relevant except your post on this site was returned.

#8 | Posted by YAV at 2020-07-31 10:00 PM | Reply

ROC always trying to set the narrative... he works hard for the money.

Portland has had large protest movements for decades... they will be back and the losers who need to destroy things on both sides will do their best to take advantage.

Last thing we need is feds playing soldier... they proved they don't have a clue what they are doing.

#9 | Posted by 503jc69 at 2020-08-01 12:42 AM | Reply

@#9

... they proved they don't have a clue what they are doing. ...

That's the operative part for me.

The Feds have shown (proven) that they do not know how to handle crowd control, that all they know how to do if treat the protesters as an enemy.

To my eyes, it looked more like an occupation force looking for a fight than law enforcement "protecting a federal building."


#10 | Posted by LampLighter at 2020-08-01 10:03 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

they proved they don't have a clue what they are doing.

#9 | POSTED BY 503JC69

Trumpy has definitely proved he has no clue.

155,000 dead Americans and counting due to Trumpy's Criminal Negligence.

#11 | Posted by donnerboy at 2020-08-01 10:06 AM | Reply

"No idea, but most communists are anti-fascists."

Communism, as was practiced in Russia and China was the most Fascist government possible. Antifa was firmly against Fascism whether it was Communist or Capitalist. Fascism isn't necessarily about economics, it's about totalitarian control of the population. Antifa is there to prevent that from happening here, how you can be against that is sort of hard to understand. Do you want Fascism?

#12 | Posted by danni at 2020-08-01 10:59 AM | Reply

The Feds are just waiting for the violence to escalate so that they can truly take to the streets.

#2 | POSTED BY LEFTCOASTLAWYER

Why wait? Send in the White Supremacist instigators and let's break some glASS.

#13 | Posted by donnerboy at 2020-08-01 12:09 PM | Reply

"The Feds are just waiting for the violence to escalate so that they can truly take to the streets.
#2 | POSTED BY LEFTCOASTLAWYER"

They might as well leave cuz there won't be anymore violence.. (-------)

#14 | Posted by phesterOBoyle at 2020-08-01 12:47 PM | Reply

Portland: The Chaos Ended as Soon as Feds Left

funny

#15 | Posted by Sniper at 2020-08-01 12:57 PM | Reply

#7

That link uses the plural "parks" for the two squares and said it was a "staging" ground. Other local links say the same:

"Portland police cleared Lownsdale and Chapman Squares in downtown Portland on Thursday morning, removing occupants and breaking up the encampments that had formed in the two park spaces. The move was requested by Oregon State Police as part of the plan for federal officers to leave downtown Portland, according to Portland Mayor Ted Wheeler.

According to a Portland Parks and Recreation spokesperson, Chapman and Lownsdale Squares have been closed since July 16 due to health and safety concerns. Since the parks are by the two main federal buildings in Portland that have been the focus of recent protests, they have been the staging area for much of the protest infrastructure, including a pop-up food services area and other facilities."

Campers cleared from Portland parks after protest

#9

Maybe you hadn't heard, Righto is still banned.

#16 | Posted by leftcoastlawyer at 2020-08-01 01:50 PM | Reply

Equating "staging area" with "staging materials" is now resolved. Thanks for finally posting the actual words.

I've been to protests. The staging area is where you gather, go over the rules, what is forbidden, what the intent is, who the leads are, what the path will be, and where the medical tent is and water may be found, etc.

You said "cleared the parks and removed all the staging materials and the night was relatively uneventful as a result" making it sound like they had munitions stored there or something. Many things wrong with that whole sentence - like "cause and effect" and conflating terms to dissemble.

Again, I gave you parks, and I even conceded "parks" to you, though the article says "The Portland Police Bureau said the city park and neighboring Chapman Square, as well as the sidewalks surrounding them, will remain closed" which differentiated Chapman Square (technically a public place) from Lownsdale Park.

Now with all this minutia out of the way, it was another peaceful night in Portland. More than 2,000 protesters showed up. Amazing what removing the jack-booted federal thugs from the situation and keeping the police out of sight can do, isn't it? www.oregonlive.com

#17 | Posted by YAV at 2020-08-01 03:18 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

You said "cleared the parks and removed all the staging materials and the night was relatively uneventful as a result" making it sound like they had munitions stored there or something. Many things wrong with that whole sentence - like "cause and effect" and conflating terms to dissemble.

You are the one who freaked out over the wording, sorry about the confusion.

#18 | Posted by leftcoastlawyer at 2020-08-01 04:28 PM | Reply

Equating "staging area" with "staging materials" is now resolved. Thanks for finally posting the actual words.
I've been to protests. The staging area is where you gather, go over the rules, what is forbidden, what the intent is, who the leads are, what the path will be, and where the medical tent is and water may be found, etc.
You said "cleared the parks and removed all the staging materials and the night was relatively uneventful as a result" making it sound like they had munitions stored there or something. Many things wrong with that whole sentence - like "cause and effect" and conflating terms to dissemble.
Again, I gave you parks, and I even conceded "parks" to you, though the article says "The Portland Police Bureau said the city park and neighboring Chapman Square, as well as the sidewalks surrounding them, will remain closed" which differentiated Chapman Square (technically a public place) from Lownsdale Park.
Now with all this minutia out of the way, it was another peaceful night in Portland. More than 2,000 protesters showed up. Amazing what removing the jack-booted federal thugs from the situation and keeping the police out of sight can do, isn't it? www.oregonlive.com
#17 | POSTED BY YAV AT 2020-08-01 03:18 PM

It's Portland, so replace "water" with "seasonal reserve", "staging area" with "live music pavilion" and "cause and effect" with "enchiladas and sorbet", otherwise you are right on.

#19 | Posted by redlightrobot at 2020-08-01 04:34 PM | Reply

You are the one who freaked out over the wording, sorry about the confusion.
#18 | POSTED BY LEFTCOASTLAWYER

32.9% GDP drop in Q2 on line two.

#20 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-08-01 05:35 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

#20

Touche.

#21 | Posted by leftcoastlawyer at 2020-08-01 06:33 PM | Reply

The chaos far preceded the arrival of the Feds.

#22 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-01 09:20 PM | Reply

So far today's been peaceful, and we've moving into evening now. There's a Firefighters in Solidarity with Black Lives Matter event that was supposed to start at 7 at Portland Firefighters Park.

#23 | Posted by YAV at 2020-08-01 11:06 PM | Reply

The protests at the Federal building remained peaceful last night with no presence of police or federal goons.

A protest at a Portland police precinct East of and not near the main protest, allegedly became "violent" when the police allegedly reacted to protesters.

According to the police, protesters threw bottles "towards" the officers. Lasers were also allegedly pointed at the police. Why the police were out and visible was not clear. More police then swarmed the street like a mound of fire ants that had been disturbed screaming "unlawful assembly! unlawful assembly!"

In other words, totally predictable. Stupid police haven't learned a thing.

www.oregonlive.com

#24 | Posted by YAV at 2020-08-02 09:24 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

The deplorables must be so bummed they can't watch the federal stormtroopers gas and beat their fellow Americans in Portland on live tv

Trumptilians love them reality tv.

#25 | Posted by donnerboy at 2020-08-02 12:02 PM | Reply

We've reached a point where arson, assault, looting and vandalism are "peaceful." It's as if "1984" is a how-to manual.

#26 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-02 12:13 PM | Reply

@26 - No, "we" haven't.
People that aren't bright don't think that.
People that are intelligent don't think that.
People that are genuinely dumb but have integrity don't think that.
And anyone that understands and gets what "1984" was actually about doesn't think that.
Only brain damaged individuals, fascists, authoritarians, and the like, think that.

#27 | Posted by YAV at 2020-08-02 12:44 PM | Reply

They did not leave.

#28 | Posted by Sniper at 2020-08-02 12:53 PM | Reply

#27 Yes, we most certainly have. Smart individuals understand when they are having propaganda shoved at them.

This thread is a case in point. These riots have been going on for 2 months and now it's all the feds' fault.

#29 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-02 01:11 PM | Reply

You're a propagandist and a liar, so I'd expect you understand that your'e covered in the 6th line:
Only brain damaged individuals, fascists, authoritarians, and the like, think that.

No, the "riots" haven't been going on for 2 months.

No, I'm not going to rehash everything that's already known, which you are choosing to forget, just to engage you, a dishonest poster pushing a fake narrative that serves low-life POS Barr, Wolf, and Trump.

Have a nice day!

#30 | Posted by YAV at 2020-08-02 01:40 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

"In other words, totally predictable. Stupid police haven't learned a thing."

You seem to be implying that the cops should be called back and the mob should be left to do whatever it wants.

Is that what you're saying?

#31 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-02 01:44 PM | Reply

You're literally defending mob violence in support of a political cause. That's pretty much the definition of terrorism.

Well, here's the actual definition:

Terrorism is, in the broadest sense, the use of intentional violence for political or religious purposes.

#32 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-02 01:46 PM | Reply

Little Sniper's just mad he and the guys on his work crew didn't riot when they were sent to clean up Hanford without the necessary PPE, then he got disabled and brain damaged.

#33 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-08-02 01:46 PM | Reply

Since when is terrorism for "religious purposes" lol.

What's a religious purpose that isn't a political purpose hiding behind a religion? LOL

#34 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-08-02 01:48 PM | Reply

It's not my definition. It's wikipedia's.

And to be fair, Islam is just as much a political movement as it is a religion.

#35 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-02 01:56 PM | Reply | Funny: 2

All religious movements are political movements.

#36 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-08-02 02:00 PM | Reply

"All religious movements are political movements."

Really?

Is there a Christian variant of Sharia? How about a Buddhist variant? How about Satanist?

Actually, LaVeyan Satanism is pretty much a political movement. Very Libertarian.

#37 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-02 02:13 PM | Reply

"Actually, LaVeyan Satanism is pretty much a political movement. Very Libertarian."

That's because all religious movements are political movements.

#38 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-08-02 02:32 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

The 10 Commandments? Codification of Religious tenants in law?
Anti-abortion laws.
Blue laws.
Marriage law.
Divorce law.
Liquor laws.
"Under God"
You really are over your skis.

You seem to be implying that the cops should be called back and the mob should be left to do whatever it wants.
Is that what you're saying?

I posted exactly what I meant. I've been consistent. I've brought in examples, from Chile to Portland. Portland police proved my point last night.
I can't help it if you're so stuck in the way you want it to be you can accept what is right in front of you.

#39 | Posted by YAV at 2020-08-02 03:59 PM | Reply

"No, I'm not going to rehash everything that's already known, which you are choosing to forget, just to engage you, a dishonest poster pushing a fake narrative that serves low-life POS Barr, Wolf, and Trump."

That's because you are FOS and you know it. Face it - you are wedded to a narrative that has no basis in reality. You know it and so does everybody else.

#40 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-02 04:30 PM | Reply

Face it - you are wedded to a narrative that has no basis in reality. You know it and so does everybody else.
#40 | POSTED BY ZETALEPH

Talk about a self retorting retort.

Find a mirror, and read your post to yourself as many times as it takes for it to sink in

#41 | Posted by ClownShack at 2020-08-02 04:34 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#41 - Good use of a mirror. Keep him occupied for hours.
He's just upset that he got called out for being a fascist/authoritarian fanboy.
Anyone that's actually paying attention knows which one of us is FOS.

#42 | Posted by YAV at 2020-08-02 04:46 PM | Reply

He's just upset that he got called out for being a fascist/authoritarian fanboy.

He should embrace who he is.

#43 | Posted by ClownShack at 2020-08-02 04:48 PM | Reply

More than 150 rounds were fired and one woman was shot in Portland on Friday night while protesters on Saturday " some of whom appeared to impersonate press " threw glass bottles and shined lasers at city police officers sent to quell the nighttime unrest witnessed for more than two months straight.

It sure sounds peaceful to me

#44 | Posted by homerj at 2020-08-02 06:50 PM | Reply

Maybe you hadn't heard, Righto is still banned.

#16 | POSTED BY LEFTCOASTLAWYER

Yes, your other "personality" is banned.
That's why you made 2, just in case. Oldest trick to the troll playbook.
You learned well from your comrade Sheeple, who had at least 5 different personalities.

#45 | Posted by a_monson at 2020-08-02 09:12 PM | Reply

#44
Gotta love Fox News. Below the sensational headline trying to blur the shooting, the peaceful demonstration, and the Police protest and exacerbation posts the headline in 35 point font:
Portland sees 150-round shooting at apartment building, as crowds continue violent clashes with police
subtitle in small font:
City saw a second, peaceful march early Sunday and violence is 'abating,' say DHS and Portland police.

Say what, Fox News? DHS and Portland Police say what?

But what about that shooing on FRIDAY night?
"A shooting rang out about 11:08 p.m. Friday outside an apartment building near the 600 Block of NE 87th Avenue. The Portland Police Bureau said in an update Saturday that more than 150 rounds were fired and bullets struck at least eight occupied apartments and seven vehicles. One round struck a woman in the arm, and responding officers applied a tourniquet before she was transported to the hospital by ambulance with injuries that were not life-threatening."
www.foxnews.com

Nothing links the shooting with the any of the protests, at all. The local Portland press has made no correlation. The Portland Police haven't made any connection. Only Fox "News" has tried to do that:
www.portlandoregon.gov
katu.com
www.kptv.com

Fox News, smearing the lines, doing the dirty work for fascists.

#46 | Posted by YAV at 2020-08-02 10:01 PM | Reply

#45

I doubt it. Ask rcade. He has your IP and MAC addresses for anything you're posting with. Are you saying rcade is complicit in this?

#47 | Posted by willowby at 2020-08-02 10:29 PM | Reply

Wait!! ANOTHER TRUMP FAILED POLICY?!?!! Who knew!!! LOL

#48 | Posted by jvel777 at 2020-08-03 03:33 AM | Reply

"He's just upset that he got called out for being a fascist/authoritarian fanboy."

I'm a fascist authoritarian because I oppose rioting?

"Anyone that's actually paying attention knows which one of us is FOS.

#42 | POSTED BY YAV AT 2020-08-02 04:46 PM"

That would be you. Face it - you support looting, arson, vandalism and assault (so long as the victims of assault don't subscribe to left-wing groupthink).

#49 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 11:11 AM | Reply

"Fox News, smearing the lines, doing the dirty work for fascists.

#46 | POSTED BY YAV AT 2020-08-02 10:01 PM"

Why do you love rioting?

#50 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 11:12 AM | Reply

Zeta, see #30.
Again.
And as many times as it takes.
Idiot.

#51 | Posted by YAV at 2020-08-03 11:15 AM | Reply

I'm a fascist authoritarian because I oppose rioting?

#49 | Posted by zetaleph

Because you are a Trumpite.

#52 | Posted by Zed at 2020-08-03 11:17 AM | Reply

"He's just upset that he got called out for being a fascist/authoritarian fanboy."

just another day at the office.

Before it's over....I'm sure Clownshart will call you a racist.

#53 | Posted by eberly at 2020-08-03 11:20 AM | Reply

-Because you are a Trumpite.

Opposing rioting makes you a Trumpite?

#54 | Posted by eberly at 2020-08-03 11:20 AM | Reply

Opposing rioting makes you a Trumpite?

#54 | Posted by eberly at 2020-08-03 11:

Just ask the man who he's voting for.

#55 | Posted by Zed at 2020-08-03 11:21 AM | Reply

If I want to ask Trump something, I'll ask him.

I was asking you.

and you know he's voting for Trump?

#56 | Posted by eberly at 2020-08-03 11:22 AM | Reply

"Zeta, see #30.
Again.
And as many times as it takes.
Idiot.

#51 | POSTED BY YAV"

*****

You didn't post anything substantive with #30, or any other post on this topic for that matter.

Idiot.

#57 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 11:22 AM | Reply

and you know he's voting for Trump?

#56 | Posted by eberly at 2020-08-

Want to pick a fight?

#58 | Posted by Zed at 2020-08-03 11:23 AM | Reply

What it the hell does Trump have to do with rioting in Portland, Seattle, Minneapolis, etc?

The riots are supposedly over the death of George Floyd.

#59 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 11:24 AM | Reply

#57 | Posted by zetaleph

Who are you voting for?

#60 | Posted by Zed at 2020-08-03 11:24 AM | Reply

"Want to pick a fight?

#58 | POSTED BY ZED AT 2020-08-03 11:23 AM"

Yes.

#61 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 11:24 AM | Reply

"Who are you voting for?

#60 | POSTED BY ZED"

What does that have to do with rioting in cities run by Democrats?

#62 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 11:25 AM | Reply

What it the hell does Trump have to do with rioting in Portland, Seattle, Minneapolis, etc?

#59 | Posted by zetaleph at 20

Sort of let's the cat out of the bag but let's see if he answers the question anyway.

#63 | Posted by Zed at 2020-08-03 11:25 AM | Reply

Here's a clue - address the issue at hand instead of trying to make it about me. I know it's difficult, but if you take a deep breath first you might be able to pull it off.

#64 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 11:25 AM | Reply

What does that have to do with rioting in cities run by Democrats?

#62 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-

We're discussing your mindset.

#65 | Posted by Zed at 2020-08-03 11:26 AM | Reply

Who are you voting for, Zed?

More importantly, explain how you are personally voting has anything to do with this subject.

#66 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 11:26 AM | Reply

You see, I think your a fascist but EBERLY remains unsure. Settle this for us.

#67 | Posted by Zed at 2020-08-03 11:27 AM | Reply

"We're discussing your mindset.

#65 | POSTED BY ZED AT 2020-08-03 11:26 AM"

No. You are engaging in personal attacks and I'm replying accordingly. Progressives don't seem to be able to hold rational discussions about anything.

#68 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 11:27 AM | Reply

This has to be GOATMAN, based on style.

#69 | Posted by Zed at 2020-08-03 11:28 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

You are a moron, Zed. I am not going to play your stupid game. This subject isn't about me.

#70 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 11:28 AM | Reply

#69 This has to be moron, based on style.

#71 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 11:28 AM | Reply

Yeah, you're GOATMAN.

#72 | Posted by Zed at 2020-08-03 11:29 AM | Reply

rioting in cities run by Democrats

Riots in Downtown Jacksonville (Mayor - R)
www.news4jax.com

Terrorism, Rioting and Assault in Oklahoma City (Mayor - R)
oklahoman.com

Multiple Officers Assaulted in El Paso (Mayor - R)
www.ktsm.com

Protestors and Police Clash in Fort Worth (Mayor - R)
www.nbcdfw.com

I'm sorry what were you saying?

#73 | Posted by JOE at 2020-08-03 11:57 AM | Reply

#73 The bigger question is how were those riots dealt with. A riot can spring up anywhere. If the city sits back and lets it happen, that's one thing. If the city takes responsible measures to quell it and prevent future riots from precipitating, that is another. These riots are mostly planned and organized. The rioters are going to go where they can riot with impunity.

#74 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 12:00 PM | Reply

"A riot can spring up anywhere"

I found one in my driveway just this morning.

#75 | Posted by Zed at 2020-08-03 12:08 PM | Reply

What does that have to do with rioting in cities run by Democrats?
This is why #30 applies to you.

We've reached a point where arson, assault, looting and vandalism are "peaceful." It's as if "1984" is a how-to manual.
This is why #30 applies to you.

These riots have been going on for 2 months and now it's all the feds' fault.
This is why #30 applies to you.

#74.
This is why #30 applies to you.

Your use of "rioting" for any and everything you disagree with, even though the incendiary term does not apply, all without regard to the cause and who initiated the upheaval. Your equating protests with arson, assault, looting, vandalism. Your lie about the "riots" going on for 2 months. All you lying.

Nothing you said is true. They are lies, perpetrated by you, a propagandist and enabler for authoritarianism/fascism.

#76 | Posted by YAV at 2020-08-03 12:36 PM | Reply

"I posted exactly what I meant. I've been consistent. I've brought in examples, from Chile to Portland. Portland police proved my point last night."

You mean when they declared the mob as being an illegal assembly after the mob through bottles and hit them with lasers.

The cops may be different. But the behavior of the mob doesn't seem to have changed.

And if Kate Brown is unwilling to provide police with the authorities they need to defend themselves and the city, maybe the best call is to pull the police out and give the city over to the protesters.

#77 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-03 12:41 PM | Reply

#74 Ah, so now that you've been caught lying there's a "bigger question" at play. Hope you have a back brace on to help you brace your core for those goalposts.

#78 | Posted by JOE at 2020-08-03 12:42 PM | Reply

#76 Everything I've said is true. You are the one excusing away violence as these people hide behind the skirts of peaceful protestors.

I know the difference between a peaceful protest and a riot. Right now, both are occurring yet you try and explain away the violence as if it isn't happening, or that it's solely the fault of federal agents. I'd call you an idiot but that would be an insult to idiots - you are a useful idiot.

#79 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 12:49 PM | Reply

#78 The issue isn't that a riot occurred - it's how it was dealt with. Riots will continue in cities where they are enabled. They won't be ongoing in cities where they are dealt with responsibly.

#80 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 12:50 PM | Reply

Yes, your other "personality" is banned.
That's why you made 2, just in case.

#45 | POSTED BY A_MONSON AT 2020-08-02 09:12 PM

That's funny, I started posting here from the start, whereas you not only started posting here over 7 years later but when you were "forced" to change your name several months ago, your entire profile disappeared (I still have it on my killfile) and your writing style and the content of your posts changed dramatically.

Pretty sure you are the puppet at this point, I have never changed.

#81 | Posted by leftcoastlawyer at 2020-08-03 12:50 PM | Reply

"You mean when they declared the mob as being an illegal assembly after the mob through bottles and hit them with lasers."

Who's "they"? Neat trick, isn't it?
Put the police out there to provoke.
Take deep, deep offense at the first incident.
Declare them an illegal assembly.
Swarm them.
Provoke more by doing so.
Get the expected reaction.
Declare it a riot.

Now let Fox News and others like you and Zeta conflate that with all the peaceful protests going on.

Even the Portland Police have more integrity than you or Zeta:
City saw a second, peaceful march early Sunday and violence is 'abating,' say DHS and Portland police.

#46.

#82 | Posted by YAV at 2020-08-03 01:03 PM | Reply

Homer had the good sense to either recognize the lie or to shut up about it.

#83 | Posted by YAV at 2020-08-03 01:04 PM | Reply

"Who's "they"? Neat trick, isn't it? Put the police out there to provoke. Take deep, deep offense at the first incident. Declare them an illegal assembly. Swarm them. Provoke more by doing so. Get the expected reaction. Declare it a riot."

The Police were out there to defend the city. They replaced the Federal Agents. And the mob, being who they are made no distinction between the Federal Agents and those employed by Oregon.

Remember when you posted this:

"Portland, I'm counting on you not to make me eat my words!"

It's dinner time, champ.

#84 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-03 01:09 PM | Reply

"Now let Fox News and others like you and Zeta conflate that with all the peaceful protests going on."

Isn't that just what you're doing? Conflating mob activity with peaceful protesters?

The one thing that does seem to be changing is that the BLM protesters appear to be losing patience with the mob. So far it seems the mob is still represented in greater numbers. And who knows, maybe the BLM movement is just as scared of the mob as everyone else.

#85 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-03 01:13 PM | Reply

"Now let Fox News and others like you and Zeta conflate that with all the peaceful protests going on."

***

You are a liar. The only one conflating is you. And it's ugly. It's Ok to call out rioters.

#86 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 01:15 PM | Reply

Yeah Yav, why are you pretending as if the Police, Federal or otherwise, are causing the problem.

If you want to try and present an argument based on the notion that the rioters should have a safe space to destroy property that upsets them, that's one thing, but to criticize the cops for protecting federal land...I just don't get it.

#87 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-03 01:19 PM | Reply

You can say that all you want. it is what you've done over and over again Lie. So why should I be surprised you'd call me a liar? I've used link after link after link, cited even the Portland Police's own site and reports.

#88 | Posted by YAV at 2020-08-03 01:20 PM | Reply

It's Ok to call out rioters.

#86 | POSTED BY ZETALEPH

Only if you point out that the peaceful protesters far outnumber the rioters. And some of the rioters are white supremacists.

To act like they are all violent rioters is disingenuous.

Just like a goatman. Spreading disingenuous disinformation.

Now shut up and get in the van.

#89 | Posted by donnerboy at 2020-08-03 01:22 PM | Reply

Yeah Yav, why are you pretending as if the Police, Federal or otherwise, are causing the problem.

I'm not pretending.
I'm stating fact.
With evidence.
Backed up by lots of other examples.
Even quoting the Portland Police and DHS.
You won't look, because you don't want to see.
No matter how obvious it is.
Even in your own life it works the same way.
If I come up to you and provoke you, you respond. If I stay there and provoke you more, you respond more.
If I am not present, we don't have an issue.

Why do you think this is complex? Too difficult to grasp?

#90 | Posted by YAV at 2020-08-03 01:23 PM | Reply

"but to criticize the cops for protecting federal land...I just don't get it."

There's nothing the police can do wrong, in the name of protecting Federal land! Protect Federal land... from what? Doesn't matter! Just protect it at all costs. Don't worry about cracking a few skulls, Federal land is more important than American people.

Isn't it weird, how you don't get us, but we so readily understand you?

You have a huge learning disability.

#91 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-08-03 01:27 PM | Reply

"Protect Federal land... from what?"

Arson

#92 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 01:47 PM | Reply

Classic:

"Now let Fox News and others like you and Zeta conflate that with all the peaceful protests going on." this is what I said and you quoted.
You are a liar. The only one conflating is you. And it's ugly. It's Ok to call out rioters. this is what was said in response.

Apparently someone's not even aware of how ridiculous it is to charge me with conflating the two when in the very sentence quoted I make a clear delineation between the two.

#93 | Posted by YAV at 2020-08-03 01:47 PM | Reply

In Minneapolis the police were told to stand down early on and the result was one of their precincts was burned to the ground.

According to Yav, they were incited and thus justified in burning that building to the ground.

#94 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 01:49 PM | Reply

"Protect Federal land... from what?"
Arson
#92 | POSTED BYZETALEPH

I didn't realize land was flammable!
I've heard of landslides, but never landfires.

#95 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-08-03 01:50 PM | Reply

#93 All you've done is blame the violence on the police and, more specifically, the Feds. Either that, or you pretend violence hasn't happened at all.

#96 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 01:50 PM | Reply

#95 By federal land he was referring to federal buildings.

#97 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 01:50 PM | Reply

"In Minneapolis the police were told to stand down early on and the result was one of their precincts was burned to the ground."

Wasn't it the precinct that killed George Floyd?

#98 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-08-03 01:51 PM | Reply

95 By federal land he was referring to federal buildings.
#97 | POSTED BY ZETALEPH

He?

You referred to yourself in the third person.

So this is a tag-team account from the Alt-Right Discord Discontents.

Glad we cleared that up!

#99 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-08-03 01:53 PM | Reply

In Minneapolis the police were told to stand down early on and the result was one of their precincts was burned to the ground.

I haven't even brought up or responded to any nonsense about Minneapolis. This is about Portland, and my original title referenced the DHS goons and how their absence from sight has resulted in what was predicted.

I get why you need this to be about events from more than 2 months ago, though...

#100 | Posted by YAV at 2020-08-03 01:58 PM | Reply

"You can say that all you want. it is what you've done over and over again Lie."

The mob was attacking the courthouse. The Federal Police were sent in their to protect it. The mob attacked the defending officers.

What part of that is a lie?

#101 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-03 02:05 PM | Reply

"To act like they are all violent rioters is disingenuous."

Was somebody saying that?

I certainly wasn't.

It seems to be the only one here defending the mob is you. And I can't fathom why. The cops don't like them. Obviously. The BLM protesters don't like them, as they've overshadowed the message they were trying to send.

The big winners here are the mob, with one of the most obvious signs of white privilege you could ever hop to witness.

#102 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-03 02:08 PM | Reply

The problem with your headline is it insinuates that the chaos "started" with the arrival of the feds (here's a clue: it didn't). From what I can gather, that is the argument you are making as well.

#103 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 02:09 PM | Reply

"If I come up to you and provoke you, you respond. If I stay there and provoke you more, you respond more."

I get it. But you seem to be stating that, by protecting the Federal Courthouse, the Police are in fact provoking the mob.

That's easy to understand. They see the courthouse as a symbol of something they disagree with, and for that reason should be allowed to inflict damage on it. And anyone who tries to stop them is in the wrong.

#104 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-03 02:11 PM | Reply

"There's nothing the police can do wrong, in the name of protecting Federal land! Protect Federal land... from what? Doesn't matter! Just protect it at all costs. Don't worry about cracking a few skulls, Federal land is more important than American people."

And that's an option. Like I said, maybe the answer is to cede that area of the city to the mob. Because is appears that continuing to defend the structure will be seen as provocative to the mob, who will in turn attack not just the structure, but the police defending it.

#105 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-03 02:13 PM | Reply

"But you seem to be stating that, by protecting the Federal Courthouse, the Police are in fact provoking the mob."

First you describe non-violent protesters as a "mob."
Then you describe attacking non-violent protesters with tear gas as "protecting."

You're unable to differentiate between non-violent protesters and violent protesters.
Trump has trained you well.

#106 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-08-03 02:14 PM | Reply

"Apparently someone's not even aware of how ridiculous it is to charge me with conflating the two when in the very sentence quoted I make a clear delineation between the two."

So you do think there is a difference between the mob and those backing the BLM protests?

but you still don't think the police are doing the right thing by defending the courthouse?

#107 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-03 02:15 PM | Reply

Dang, I really thought Goatman had succumbed to the 'Rona.

Glad to see you're still kicking and screaming, Goatman!

#108 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-08-03 02:15 PM | Reply

"This is about Portland, and my original title referenced the DHS goons and how their absence from sight has resulted in what was predicted."

No it hasn't.

They exhibited the same behavior last night, throwing bottles and trying to blind the police with lasers.

I don't know what sort of ROE's cops operate under, but all of my training has been that the use of deadly force is authorized to defend life, limb, or eyesight.

#109 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-03 02:17 PM | Reply

"You're unable to differentiate between non-violent protesters and violent protesters. Trump has trained you well."

How do you figure that?

I've literally differentiated on this page. Twice. Today. #85 and #106

It's you and Yav who seem to have trouble with the police defending the courthouse. Neither the Courthouse or the Police have anything to fear from non-violent protesters.

But again, they're non-violent. How do they stand up to a mob devoted to violence?

#110 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-03 02:21 PM | Reply

"You're unable to differentiate between non-violent protesters and violent protesters. Trump has trained you well."
How do you figure that?

^
It's the part where you keep ignoring the police attacks on non-violent protesters, MadBomber.

#111 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-08-03 02:24 PM | Reply

A person throwing projectiles at the police is not a non-violent protester, Snoofy. Nor is a person shooting fireworks at police.

#112 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 02:33 PM | Reply

"It's the part where you keep ignoring the police attacks on non-violent protesters, MadBomber."

I'm not sure what you're talking about.

Why would non-violent protesters give police defending a federal courthouse a motive to use violence?

#113 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-03 02:34 PM | Reply

"I'm not sure what you're talking about."

I'm talking about police attacks on non-violent protesters.

#114 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-08-03 02:37 PM | Reply

Why would non-violent protesters give police defending a federal courthouse a motive to use violence?

#113 | Posted by madbomber

Why would police look for a motive?

#115 | Posted by Zed at 2020-08-03 02:38 PM | Reply

"Why would non-violent protesters give police defending a federal courthouse a motive to use violence?"

Go ask them. They're the ones doing it.
Let's clear one thing up first: Is spray-painting graffiti an act of violence, MadBobmer?

#116 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-08-03 02:40 PM | Reply

I am afraid that the authorities surrendered much of their moral authority in regards to protests whenever they began stuffing people into vans.

#117 | Posted by Zed at 2020-08-03 02:42 PM | Reply

"A person throwing projectiles at the police is not a non-violent protester, Snoofy."

When did you become such a coward that you have to post under this account, Goatman?

#118 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-08-03 02:42 PM | Reply

117

I tend to agree but if we have a change in POTUS, the "authorities" probably get a do-over and will be allowed to start clean.

One thing is for certain, the protests will stop...at least these kinds of protests.

#119 | Posted by eberly at 2020-08-03 02:49 PM | Reply

"I am afraid that the authorities surrendered much of their moral authority in regards to protests whenever they began stuffing people into vans.

#117 | POSTED BY ZED AT 2020-08-03 02:42 PM"

It's actually DHS SOS (they use unmarked vehicles in these situations as cop cars tend to get attacked) and this isn't China -- none of those people have been disappeared.

#120 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 02:53 PM | Reply

"When did you become such a coward that you have to post under this account, Goatman?

#118 | POSTED BY SNOOFY AT 2020-08-03 02:42 PM"

First off, I'm not "goatman", and secondly, what is it with you moronic progressives who feel the need to take a comment and make it personal?

#121 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 02:58 PM | Reply

"what is it with you moronic progressives who feel the need to take a comment and make it personal"

1. rage
2. lack of attention

#122 | Posted by eberly at 2020-08-03 03:09 PM | Reply

First, I am at work, so I've only been able to peak in here and comment, and I confess I may be missing some points and nuance.

The problem with your headline is it insinuates that the chaos "started" with the arrival of the feds (here's a clue: it didn't).

Not my headline. Thanks though. Mine was changes when this was promoted to the front page.
It doesn't insinuate that at all, it simply states that they are out of view and the violence where they were located, as expected, stopped. Again, not rocket science. Until that confrontation was removed the BLM folks couldn't get control over the message. DHS made the protests all about them, which is exactly what Trump, Wolf, and Barr wanted.

From what I can gather, that is the argument you are making as well.
See above.

#123 | Posted by YAV at 2020-08-03 03:14 PM | Reply

Mine was changes? Hmm.
Mine was changed... :)

#124 | Posted by YAV at 2020-08-03 03:24 PM | Reply

The Chaos Ended as Soon as Feds Left

Trump turning Americans against Americans.

This is what Republicans want.

A failed nation and a dictator.

They still may get their wish. When Trump wins in November, people, political opposition, getting kidnapped off the streets will be as common in America as it is in Russia, China or Iran.

Trump is the biggest threat to the future of America since the civil war.

#125 | Posted by ClownShack at 2020-08-03 03:36 PM | Reply

Maybe it ended.....or maybe it's paused.

I hope it's over.

#126 | Posted by eberly at 2020-08-03 03:40 PM | Reply

I hope it's over.

Same here, Eberly. For everyone's best interest.

Portland, I'm counting on you not to make me eat my words!
#1 | POSTED BY YAV AT 2020-07-31 07:15 PM | FLAG:

#127 | Posted by YAV at 2020-08-03 03:45 PM | Reply

"Trump is the biggest threat to the future of America since the civil war.

#125 | POSTED BY CLOWNSHACK"

You are either completely ignorant of history or are a drama queen. I'm going with both.

#128 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-08-03 03:48 PM | Reply

#128 | POSTED BY ZETALEPH

Trump turning Americans against Americans.

This is what you want.

A failed nation and a dictator.

Because anything is better than knowing costal liberals are better off that you are.

#129 | Posted by ClownShack at 2020-08-03 03:57 PM | Reply

"costal liberals are better off that you are."

bad spelling aside, is that true? rather, do you think Coastal liberals are better off than me?

#130 | Posted by eberly at 2020-08-03 04:17 PM | Reply

First off, I'm not "goatman"
#121 | POSTED BY ZETALEPH

Don't be shy, Goatman!
Lots of people here like you.
Nobody much likes this new persona.

#131 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-08-03 04:34 PM | Reply

bad spelling aside,

Oh thank goodness. You spelling Nazis are relentless.

is that true?

Based on most things I've read. Yes. Landlocked mouth breathers hate coastal liberals for being better off.

That's why deplorables love Trump for pwning libz.

do you think Coastal liberals are better off than me?

"what is it with you moronic regressives who feel the need to take a comment and make it personal"

#132 | Posted by ClownShack at 2020-08-03 04:35 PM | Reply

"Landlocked mouth breathers hate coastal liberals for being better off."

On this site, I see a tremendous amount of the reverse. Coastal Liberals hating landlocked mouth breathers.

explain that.

#133 | Posted by eberly at 2020-08-03 04:37 PM | Reply

"do you think Coastal liberals are better off than me?"

Why's it about you, Eberly?
He was talking to Goatman.

Do you think poor people in Kansas are better off than poor people in coastal liberal states?
How about middle class people, and rich people?

#134 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-08-03 04:37 PM | Reply

"On this site, I see a tremendous amount of the reverse. Coastal Liberals hating landlocked mouth breathers."

You hate landlocked mouth breathers, Eberly.

#135 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-08-03 04:39 PM | Reply

Shart, you're a coastal liberal, right?

You're as hateful towards the rest of us as anybody else....why?

and when you're done answering that question....why can't that be the reason why landlocked folks can't stand you?

BTW, do you know what "landlocked" means?

#136 | Posted by eberly at 2020-08-03 04:41 PM | Reply

explain that.
#133 | POSTED BY EBERLY

I can't explain why you perceive life the way you do.

If I could, I'd solve the problem with regressivism in America.

#137 | Posted by ClownShack at 2020-08-03 04:42 PM | Reply

Why's it about you, Eberly?

It's a combination of life long narcissism and a chapped hide.

#138 | Posted by ClownShack at 2020-08-03 04:43 PM | Reply

"First off, I'm not "goatman""

Then feel free to tell us what other name(s) you've posted under.

#139 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-08-03 04:44 PM | Reply

-I can't explain why you perceive life the way you do.

can you read? I didn't ask you to.

#140 | Posted by eberly at 2020-08-03 04:45 PM | Reply

Is it JPW or Snoofy who's sniffing my ass?

I'm not turning around to see........

#141 | Posted by eberly at 2020-08-03 04:46 PM | Reply

#136

Eberly, there's no one else in America more hateful than conservatives.

You Regressives prove it in the real world every day with your lack of compassion and empathy for your fellow human beings.

Yea. I'm so mean, on the DR!

Meanwhile, conservatives are fkkking horrible in the real world.

All the pain and misery in the world can be traced back to conservatism.

#142 | Posted by ClownShack at 2020-08-03 04:49 PM | Reply

what is it with you moronic progressives who feel the need to take a comment and make it personal?
#121 | POSTED BY ZETALEPH

Make it personal?
You did that.

You addressed me personally when you said
"A person throwing projectiles at the police is not a non-violent protester, Snoofy."

Why is that a problem? I don't think it is!
And if it is a problem, then why'd you do it?
???

#143 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-08-03 04:50 PM | Reply

Is it JPW or Snoofy who's sniffing my ass?
I'm not turning around to see........
#141 | POSTED BY EBERLY

No one gives a shht who you're hiding from.

You stupid coward.

Quick. Shut your eyes before your worldview gets challenged.

#144 | Posted by ClownShack at 2020-08-03 04:50 PM | Reply

Is it JPW or Snoofy who's sniffing my ass?
#141 | POSTED BY EBERLY

^
No hate from the landlocked mouth breathers towards the liberals in this comment!

#145 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-08-03 04:52 PM | Reply

I envy some coastal folks who have tremendous means to live well there.

but that's a relatively few. And I don't care about their politics.

#146 | Posted by eberly at 2020-08-03 04:58 PM | Reply

I envy some coastal folks who have tremendous means to live well there.

Most people living meager lives on the coats would be living like kings in landlocked states.

Flyover states are kinda like the Honduras of America.

#147 | Posted by ClownShack at 2020-08-03 05:04 PM | Reply

Coasts, not coats...

For those spelling and grammar Nazis out there.

#148 | Posted by ClownShack at 2020-08-03 05:05 PM | Reply

147

Never been to Honduras so I'll take your word for it.

But I've seen many movies about coastal cities.

Especially the ones made by Spike Lee.

But I don't run coastal cities down.

To each his own and I love visiting them.

#149 | Posted by eberly at 2020-08-03 05:17 PM | Reply

"I'm talking about police attacks on non-violent protesters."

I googled "portland police attack non-violent protesters"

Here's what came up:

news.search.yahoo.com

Most of the articles seem to be about violent protesters attacking the police.

#150 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-04 12:31 AM | Reply

"Is spray-painting graffiti an act of violence, MadBobmer?"

Nope.

But neither is smuggling cocaine.

Both are crimes through. Both will get you sideways with the law.

#151 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-04 12:33 AM | Reply

"They still may get their wish. When Trump wins in November, people, political opposition, getting kidnapped off the streets will be as common in America as it is in Russia, China or Iran."

If Trump wins, it will be due to situations like the one we've seen in Portland, as well as support for the mob by many on the left; perceived or real.

#152 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-04 12:38 AM | Reply

"All the pain and misery in the world can be traced back to conservatism."

You mean other than the 100 million or so deaths that can be directly attributable to socialism?

Actually, I was just counting Soviet Socialism. Factor in National Socialism and you can tack on another 20 million or so.

And you talk about turning American against American-Bernie Sanders whole platform was built on class warfare. Which shouldn't come as much of a surprise given his affection for socialist causes.

#153 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-04 12:43 AM | Reply

"Actually, I was just counting Soviet Socialism."

So...Oligarchy.

Calling themselves Socialists is like calling Saddam's Republican Guard, Republicans.

#154 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-08-04 12:47 AM | Reply

"given his affection for socialist causes."

Remind me where he's called for workers to control the means of production. You know...the main hallmark of Socialism.

#155 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-08-04 12:49 AM | Reply

"I envy some coastal folks who have tremendous means to live well there. but that's a relatively few. And I don't care about their politics."

CA, OR, and WA are the only states in the US with a decent coastline. And you wouldn't want to live on the coast in OR or WA. Too gloomy in the winter. Hawaii is nice to visit, but it's an island. It gets small quickly. And even the run down houses in the poorer neighborhoods would run you $750K.

If you really want to live in a nice coastal, you need to look outside the US.

#156 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-04 12:49 AM | Reply

"Most people living meager lives on the coats would be living like kings in landlocked states."

Which is why many of those people living meager lives in CA are packing up and moving out to places like Boise or Austin.

Each year, more and more of my family migrates from the Bay Area up to Idaho.

#157 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-04 12:50 AM | Reply

"Factor in National Socialism..."

Again...if the workers aren't being championed to control the means of production, you're just falling for false nomenclature. Nazis called themself Socialists; the regime enforced anything but.

#158 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-08-04 12:51 AM | Reply

"Remind me where he's called for workers to control the means of production. You know...the main hallmark of Socialism."

Kinda weird...he hasn't.

He calls himself a socialist, yet has yet to address one of the key pillars of socialism.

Maybe he wants to frame that goal through a different lens. Maybe not look so silly.

#159 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-04 12:53 AM | Reply

"Nazis called themself Socialists; the regime enforced anything but."

Actually, have you ever read through the National Socialist's 25 point program.

many were racist. The others could have easily found a home in the Bernie Sanders campaign.

#160 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-04 12:54 AM | Reply

You keep trying to sell this rancid old BS.
Gregor Strasser was socialist in a very general sense. Hitler loathed all socialism. He was a corporate man in his economic thinking. He got many ideas from Mussolini and the Italians.

The merger of the state and industry can be called socialistic. But industry stayed in private ownership. The profits were private.

They were no more socialist than we are.

More a crony capitalist economy,kind of like what we have today.

Hitler just USED his militarized economy to wage world war.

He went there,Bigly.

#161 | Posted by Effeteposer at 2020-08-04 01:14 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

POSTED BY MADDUMBER

You really should learn the difference between fascism and socialism.

#162 | Posted by ClownShack at 2020-08-04 01:47 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"He calls himself a socialist,"

He calls himself a Democratic Socialist. The only folks who call him a Socialist are the ones who can't be bothered to learn the difference.

#163 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-08-04 02:27 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Actually, have you ever read through the National Socialist's 25 point program.
many were racist. The others could have easily found a home in the Bernie Sanders campaign.
#160 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER

What's your take on the Space Force motto, "Uber Alles?"

#164 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-08-04 02:43 AM | Reply

"Hitler loathed all socialism."

When did he (Hitler) begin loathing it?

It must have been after his stint in the Army of the Bavarian Soviet Republic?

#165 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-04 07:21 AM | Reply

"He calls himself a Democratic Socialist. The only folks who call him a Socialist are the ones who can't be bothered to learn the difference."

This is what Bernie calls himself:

Democratic socialism is a political philosophy supporting political democracy within a socially owned economy, with a particular emphasis on economic democracy, workplace democracy and workers' self-management within a market socialist economy or some form of a decentralised planned socialist economy. Democratic socialists argue that capitalism is inherently incompatible with the values of freedom, equality and solidarity and that these ideals can only be achieved through the realisation of a socialist society. Although most democratic socialists seek a gradual transition to socialism, democratic socialism can support either revolutionary or reformist politics as means to establish socialism. As a term, it was popularised by social democrats who were opposed to the authoritarian socialist development in Russia and elsewhere during the 20th century.

While having socialism as a long-term goal, some democratic socialists who follow social democracy are more concerned to curb capitalism's excesses and are supportive of progressive reforms to humanise it in the present day. In contrast, other democratic socialists believe that economic interventionism and similar policy reforms aimed at addressing social inequalities and suppressing the economic contradictions of capitalism would only exacerbate the contradictions, causing them to emerge elsewhere under a different guise. Those democratic socialists believe that the fundamental issues with capitalism are systemic in nature and can only be resolved by replacing the capitalist mode of production with the socialist mode of production, i.e. by replacing private ownership with collective ownership of the means of production and extending democracy to the economic sphere in the form of industrial democracy.[31] The main criticism of democratic socialism concerns the compatibility of democracy and socialism.

...this is what Bernie is claiming himself to be.

en.wikipedia.org

#166 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-04 07:34 AM | Reply

"You really should learn the difference between fascism and socialism."

Socialism was the strict, dogmatic grandfather.

Fascism was the baby born from socialism and nationalism.

#167 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-08-04 07:35 AM | Reply

"...this is what Bernie is claiming himself to be."

Written by Wikipedia?!? Anyone can write whatever they want.

"Those democratic socialists believe that the fundamental issues with capitalism are systemic in nature and can only be resolved by replacing the capitalist mode of production with the socialist mode of production, i.e. by replacing private ownership with collective ownership of the means of production "

Yet Bernie has never said workers should own the means of production. We've been over this already. You couldn't find one Socialistic bill written or proposed by Sanders, so you called him a Marxist, but couldn't find one incidence of demanding an end to public property. At this point, you're just playing Humpty Dumpty, where words mean whatever YOU want them to mean.

"The main criticism of democratic socialism concerns the compatibility of democracy and socialism."

Riiiiiiiiiiiight. Because we're not sure if we want toll booths on every street corner.

Ultimately, we live in a capitalistic society, with socialistic aspects.

#168 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-08-04 08:50 AM | Reply

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