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Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Sunday, September 13, 2020

A manhunt was underway in California early Sunday after two Los Angeles County sheriff's deputies were shot in their patrol car Saturday by a suspect who "opened fire without warning or provocation," authorities said. The deputies, a 24-year-old man and a 31-year-old woman, were both in critical condition and "fighting for their lives" as they underwent surgery following the attack, which occurred around 7 p.m. local time outside a Metro rail station in Compton, according to the Los Angeles County Sheriff's Department.

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When you fuel the fire of hating cops, this is what you get.

Even if absolutely believe in the ACAB theory, the attack on cops is only going to result in this. Acts of absolute cowards doing what cowards do: attacking the unprepared without warning.

This is an absolute tragedy. Any deflections to any events by unrelated cops that may or not have been terrible and unjustified mean nothing. These two cops weren't involved, they didn't deserve this no matter what other cops half a country away might have done.

I hope they catch the perpetrator and put him in jail forever.

#1 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-13 07:10 AM | Reply

When you fuel hate this is what happens.
When you send in Federal "troops" (gestapo) this is what happens.
When you target an entire segment of society because they're black or brown, this is what happens.
When you support Trump this is what happens.
When you are a Boogaloo Boi this is what you do.
When you foment violence and incite your fans to violence this is what happens.
When you advertise a special before this about all Muslims called "The Rising Crescent" - filled with nothing but violence - this is what happens.
(seriously - the ad before the segment was racist AF)
In that kind of environment do you really think it's going to stay one-sided?
You think crazies on the other side aren't going to react?

Don't misunderstand. I think this is horrible. I hope the two deputies recover fully. I hope they find the person that did this and that person is found guilty and spends the rest of their miserable life in prison. I absolutely do. There's too much violence. Period.

What a shame we have a President that loves it. Needs it. Can't win without it. Uses it. Creates it.

#2 | Posted by YAV at 2020-09-13 08:27 AM | Reply | Funny: 1 | Newsworthy 5

@#1 ... When you fuel the fire of hating cops ...

In a way I agree.

But that is the symptom. I prefer to resolve the root cause of the problem.

The problem is not hating cops.

The problem to solve is why are police hated?

What do police do that causes some of those they should be protecting and serving to hate the police?

#3 | Posted by LampLighter at 2020-09-13 10:33 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 5

Often times the police do seriously dirty and shady crap that deserve righteous indignation and outcry. I have known some seriously racist cops that deserved to be terminated on the spot. Almost all of them in smaller more rural departments. Never had met a big city cop that was, at least overtly, but that is all anecdotal anyway.

Often, it's from a complete lack of knowledge of the law and why the police act the way they do in a given situation. Police don't have to wait for a person to turn around if they have a knife in their hand to shoot them. Even in the back. Don't drop it, get shot. Grab The hilt of an officers gun or tazer, and get shot.

Too often the entire story gets ignored and the public focuses on two words: unarmed and black. Quite often there is a whole list of circumstances that happened that make the shooting justified. But people can't be reasonable, or level headed. They just react.

I actually do understand it to a degree. Racism is real, it is an all encompassing source of stress and stressed people lash out. Buy that doesn't justify what is happening in the country right now.

#4 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-13 10:53 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

@#4 ... Too often the entire story gets ignored and the public focuses on two words: unarmed and black.

Again, in a way, I agree.

The entire story should be told.

For instance, why the so-called blue wall of silence? Why do the police unions, e.g., seem to hide or defend bad behavior instead of trying to get those behaving badly out of their ranks (larger city police unions seem to be more of the culprit here).

#5 | Posted by LampLighter at 2020-09-13 11:57 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

If shooting Breonna Taylor wasn't a crime, how was this?

#6 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-13 12:18 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

Cops suck. These cops were innocent victims,they were just doing a job and are worthy of respect. The shooter was a monster, unprovoked attacks are wrong no matter what.

Blue wall of silence and the whole police unions and benevolent societies crap is another thing altogether.

Police are like anyone else. Not special. The whole tendency to fetishise the police is the main reason they suck and are widely hated. They are feted and treated like they are a special protected class which makes them arrogant and overbearing if the deference is not there.

Ego driven individuals are drawn to the power and impunity given to police by our culture.

The people they terrorize and harm sometimes hit back with tragic results.

If cops were just people,liable financially when they injure someone. This would stop many of the excesses by purging the wrongdoers from their ranks quickly.

No qualified immunity. If they hurt someone wrongly they pay,not the department,them personally. Maybe then they will be more circumspect in their behavior.

At the very least they won't be treated like gods of life and death and that would be better for everyone.

#7 | Posted by Effeteposer at 2020-09-13 12:32 PM | Reply

Stop it. While I think the Breonna Taylor shooting IS. A crime, you can't compare the police in the wrong house and shooting at someone shooting at them to walking up to two police officers and intentionally killing them.

You can't.

You think you have made some intellectual point.

You haven't. That was laughable nonsense.

#8 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-13 12:33 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

Obviously these cops should have been armed.

#9 | Posted by REDIAL at 2020-09-13 12:39 PM | Reply | Funny: 1


Op-Ed: Police union contracts shield bad cops from punishment. Here's how to rein them in (June 2020)
www.latimes.com

...One reason for the persistence of misconduct is the outsized influence of police unions. Since the 1960s, state laws have increasingly allowed disciplinary procedures to be determined in collective bargaining with police unions. Courts have liberally interpreted unions' bargaining authority. And unions have reinforced their clout by lobbying state legislatures for various statutes that impede supervisors from conducting investigations and imposing discipline.

Jacob Frey, the mayor of Minneapolis, said recently that police collective bargaining agreements and arbitration requirements have kept the city from holding officers accountable. A task force reviewing police misconduct in Chicago, where only 2% of complaints result in disciplinary action, said collective bargaining agreements "essentially turned the code of silence into official policy."

Evidence of union influence is supported by an impressive body of academic research. A 2017 article in the Duke Law Journal by Stephen Rushin makes for chilling reading now: "The relationship between union contracts and police accountability is an issue of serious national concern warranting additional empirical examination." Rushin studied police contracts in 178 cities and found that nine out of 10 contained one or more clauses that could thwart "legitimate disciplinary action."

Records of misconduct are typically sealed, and in cities from Baltimore to Cleveland, union contracts permit officers to expunge evidence of past misconduct. Many contracts forbid questioning of officers accused of misconduct for anywhere from several hours to several days " allowing officers to change their recollections and, if multiple cops are involved, to coordinate stories.

Although many cities have civilian review panels, union contracts weaken their authority, for instance by prohibiting them from considering anonymous complaints. Many bargaining agreements also demand that cities indemnify officers against civil litigation, further reducing officer accountability....


#10 | Posted by LampLighter at 2020-09-13 12:44 PM | Reply

"police in the wrong house and shooting at someone shooting at them"

Breonna Taylor didn't shoot at anyone, liar.

"to walking up to two police officers and intentionally killing them."

Police officers intentionally killed Breonna Taylor.

If that isn't a crime, why is this?

Save your tears -- and just tell me why.

#11 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-13 12:55 PM | Reply

"While I think the Breonna Taylor shooting IS. A crime"

No you don't.

As you just said, "you can't compare the police in the wrong house and shooting at someone shooting at them."

You're already claiming self defense for the cops who killed Breonna Taylor.

Stop lying.

#12 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-13 12:56 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"Police union contracts shield bad cops from punishment."

Every system is perfectly designed to get the results it gets. -- The W. Edwards Deming Institute.

#13 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-13 12:59 PM | Reply

Is there any evidence they shot her intentionally and aren't just crappy shots? Please.

I think their entering the wrong house rises to criminality, but certainly not murder. Manslaughter more likely.

But even then, your trying to divert away from the real topic which was intentionally trying to murder two cops. The smokescreen you are throwing up won't work.

To top it off, protestors showed up and tried to block the emergency room entrance and chanted that they hope they die. Unbelievable.

#14 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-13 01:06 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

"Is there any evidence they shot her intentionally and aren't just crappy shots? Please."

^
This is the dumbest thing you've ever said, ABH.

#15 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-13 01:09 PM | Reply

"your trying to divert away from the real topic which was intentionally trying to murder two cops."

Is there any evidence they shot them intentionally and aren't just crappy shots? Please.

#16 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-13 01:10 PM | Reply

"To top it off, protestors showed up and tried to block the emergency room entrance and chanted that they hope they die. Unbelievable."

The police who suffocated Eric Garner stopped paramedics from trying to save him.

That seemed right to you.
So why doesn't this?

#17 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-13 01:21 PM | Reply

Police are "da man' all deference to,"da man". Regular people are just worms for them to torment and crush without any consequences.

This attitude is why innocent cops are shot and protesters clamor for their deaths.

If the police didn't wage war on the populace,this kind of crap would stop. When you treat the citizens as the enemy,they get the message and act accordingly.

End the blue wall and fewer cops will die on it.

#18 | Posted by Effeteposer at 2020-09-13 01:30 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

What were the cops wearing?
Why hasn't their entire social media post history and police complaint file been release yet? Suspicious.
Where these cops involved in a gang? Taking bribes? We need a full investigation of all their associates in the department.

If they complied with the citizen, they would not have been shot.

#19 | Posted by bored at 2020-09-13 02:12 PM | Reply

Unbelievable.

#14 | POSTED BY ABH

This is Trumplandia.

Nothing is unbelievable here. Not anymore.

#20 | Posted by donnerboy at 2020-09-13 03:48 PM | Reply

It looks like a gang initiation ritual to me.The same thing has been going on across the USA for more than 50 years.

#21 | Posted by Scotty at 2020-09-13 04:34 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Some people are saying this was done by the trump campaign.

#22 | Posted by ChiefTutMoses at 2020-09-13 04:48 PM | Reply

Some people are saying this was done by the trump campaign.

#22 | Posted by ChiefTutMoses at 2020-09-13 04:48 PM | Reply | Flag

Did they have russsian accents?

#23 | Posted by Scotty at 2020-09-13 05:08 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

#22 I didn't think it was possible, but that is actually dumber than anything snoofy said.

#24 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-13 05:55 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Real Americans stand their ground

- - snotty

#25 | Posted by ChiefTutMoses at 2020-09-13 05:56 PM | Reply

Did the trump campaign murder these cops in a false flag attempt?
I don't know. Maybe. Could be. Some people are saying it though
Either way we need to find out!

I have seen no evidence that contradicts this, why is the right afraid of the truth

#26 | Posted by ChiefTutMoses at 2020-09-13 06:03 PM | Reply

This should prompt another generous donation from Russia to the NRA/GOP.

#27 | Posted by reinheitsgebot at 2020-09-13 06:05 PM | Reply

Cowardly, I think not.

#28 | Posted by fresno500 at 2020-09-13 06:59 PM | Reply

This is what Sarah Palin meant when she said "Second Amendment remedies."

I've never heard a Democrat suggest we settle our differences with Second Amendment solutions.

Only the GOP and the Russian-mob-backed NRA engages in that kind of violent rhetoric.

So take credit for what you've accomplished, right-wingers:

It's almost Reichstag Fire time.

#29 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-13 07:07 PM | Reply

#28. Riiiiiight. Only "brave" people walk up to folks and shoot them without warning and run away. I bet you think a guy who sucker punches a guy and then flees out of the bar is a real man.

#30 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-13 07:10 PM | Reply

^

How do you know so much about it?

Were you a witness? Or are you in on it?

What are you hiding?

#31 | Posted by ChiefTutMoses at 2020-09-13 07:23 PM | Reply

Snoofy and chieftitmouse, a parade of stupidity.

#32 | Posted by willowby at 2020-09-13 07:38 PM | Reply

#28. Riiiiiight. Only "brave" people walk up to folks and shoot them without warning and run away. I bet you think a guy who sucker punches a guy and then flees out of the bar is a real man.
#30 | POSTED BY ABH

^
Is there any evidence they shot them intentionally and aren't just crappy shots? Please.

#33 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-13 08:34 PM | Reply

#33

The idiocy continues.

#34 | Posted by willowby at 2020-09-13 08:43 PM | Reply

#34 I'm quoting ABH.
#34 It's also past your bedtime.

#35 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-13 09:27 PM | Reply

#35

Everything you've posted in this thread is idiocy. Par for the course.

#36 | Posted by willowby at 2020-09-13 09:33 PM | Reply

Pretty much my whole shtick here is calling out right-wing idiocy.

That's why I quoted ABH and Sarah Palin.

Thanks for noticing!

#37 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-13 09:46 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

^

Maybe they were child slavers employed by the Galaxian empire, financed by Deeezle Soros and under direct mind control from a hybrid Obama Clinton clone?
And this is simply trump, jfk jr, and Elvis taking down some liberal operators

I bet if this was on infowars willows would be foaming at the mouth

#38 | Posted by ChiefTutMoses at 2020-09-13 09:56 PM | Reply

#37

"Pretty much my whole shtick here is Spouting left wing idiocy." FTFY

#39 | Posted by willowby at 2020-09-13 10:55 PM | Reply

#38

You need help chieftitmouse. Unfortunately, my degree was in engineering, not psychiatry.

#40 | Posted by willowby at 2020-09-13 11:04 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

This is actually hilarious. Do willowby and abh actually not realize that chief is being sarcastic? Just using the type of logically false rhetoric that their Lord and savior Donald J Trump use all the time?

Idiots.

#41 | Posted by Gtbritishskull at 2020-09-13 11:06 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#41

He's being an idiotic dbag. Just like you.

#42 | Posted by willowby at 2020-09-13 11:15 PM | Reply

update: both cops survived. The dwarf with the saggy pants remains at large.

#43 | Posted by HeliumRat at 2020-09-13 11:35 PM | Reply

#41 I didn't after the first post. But then realized quickly he was and started ignoring him.

Snoofy, on the other hand, actually believes cops deserve to be murdered in the street because some cop, somewhere, far away, this one time did something unconscionable and terrible.

#44 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 05:40 AM | Reply

They were not handcuffed.

#45 | Posted by fresno500 at 2020-09-14 09:28 AM | Reply

Ummm. Who wasn't?

#46 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 09:47 AM | Reply

"Often times the police do seriously dirty and shady crap that deserve righteous indignation and outcry."

Often times the population as a whole do seriously dirty and shady crap that deserves righteous indignation and outcry. Yet, Dems and BLM have flipped the script to say that the people who do that, if they are non-white, should be allowed to do seriously dirty and shady crap without any repercussions. If you can't see why that's a problem, then you are part of the problem.

#47 | Posted by humtake at 2020-09-14 12:21 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

If you can't see why that's a problem, then you are part of the problem.

#47 | Posted by humtake at 2020-09-14 12:21 PM | Reply

You're a Trumpite, and so the problem in its very self.

#48 | Posted by Zed at 2020-09-14 12:27 PM | Reply

only a lib den would protest a hospital treating cal officers who were ambushed

#49 | Posted by Sniper at 2020-09-14 12:38 PM | Reply

#49 only a complete trash human being regardless of political party affiliation, would attempt to block an er and chant they hope the police that just got shot would die.

#50 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 12:44 PM | Reply

Snoofy, on the other hand, actually believes cops deserve to be murdered in the street because some cop, somewhere, far away, this one time did something unconscionable and terrible.
#44 | POSTED BY ABH

LOL.
You're a very stable genius, ABH.

#51 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 12:45 PM | Reply

#51 everything you have said indicates it. Care to deny it?

Deflecting to any other case other than this one to say: "whatever happened there means this must be acceptable" is condoning it whether you want to admit or not.

I may be a very stable genius, but you are an unhinged sociopath.

#52 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 12:47 PM | Reply

" Yet, Dems and BLM have flipped the script to say that the people who do that, if they are non-white, should be allowed to do seriously dirty and shady crap without any repercussions."

Noone is saying that.
The only people saying anything remotely like that are people like you: Just replace non-white with cops.
People like you, who think the cops who killed Breonna Taylor, Philandro Castile, and Tamir Rice didn't do anything wrong.

#53 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 12:49 PM | Reply

I may be a very stable genius, but you are an unhinged sociopath.
#52 | POSTED BY ABH

No, you're just projecting.

I don't support gunning people down in their cars, Philandro Castile style.
Or in their beds, in Breonna Taylor's case.
Or on the playground, like Tamir Rice.

That's what your team does: Kill people, because they are unhinged sociopaths.

#54 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 12:50 PM | Reply

Absolute horse hockey.

You see police bogey men everywhere. You actually have stated in this thread that they police went in and intentionally murdered Breonna Taylor. Her death while tragic and certainly worthy of a manslaughter charge was no premeditated murder. I can't even believe you have gotten there from the facts of the case. It's surreal.

No one condones those actions. No one. Literally not one person I know. There are many cases of complete crap that cops have done, of course. But turning it into ACAB, and demonizing then, chanting they hope they die at the hospital, it's completely insane.

We need the pendulum to land back in the middle, and fast.

#55 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 12:54 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"Is there any evidence they shot her intentionally and aren't just crappy shots? Please."

Still sticking by these words, ABH?

#56 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 12:54 PM | Reply

Yes. Returning fire when her boyfriend fired at officers.... hitting one in the leg mind you.... is not intentional murder. Oh and one of the cops was already terminated, and likely be charged with manslaughter because he fired blindly into the house in a panic after taking fire.

#57 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 12:57 PM | Reply

"You see police bogey men everywhere."

Not everywhere.

I see them pissing on the graves of Breonna Taylor, Philandro Castile, and Tamir Rice.
And George Floyd, and Eric Garner.
And thousands of others they've killed for no good reason.

But not everywhere.

#58 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 12:58 PM | Reply

"ou actually have stated in this thread that they police went in and intentionally murdered Breonna Taylor."

Obviously, they did exactly that.

Are you saying they pulled the trigger accidentally?
If so, you're an unhinged sociopath.

Are you saying they fired at her without intending to kill her?
If so, you're an unhinged sociopath.

#59 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 01:00 PM | Reply

How are they posing on the graves of George Floyd??? The officer has been arrested and charged to the maximum extent? You only gonna be happy with a public hanging?

#60 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 01:01 PM | Reply

"Returning fire when her boyfriend fired at officers"

It's not "returning" fire when you shoot a person in a bed who isn't shooting at you.
Only an unhinged sociopath would call that "returning fire."

#61 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 01:02 PM | Reply

So now, they aren't supposed to return fire? That rises to murder? You are completely off your rocker.

Murder would mean they got together outside and said "let's go kill this girl." Before entering the house.

And after they were shot at, yes they intended to end the threat to their persons. Their mistakes make it depraved indifference, but certainly not murder.

#62 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 01:05 PM | Reply

61 as I said, they missed the boyfriend and hit her. Again. Not murder. Yikes. You really do see bogey men with nefarious schemes and snidely whiplash mustaches everywhere.

Your thought processes are an absolute mess.

#63 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 01:07 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"So now, they aren't supposed to return fire?"

I never said they shouldn't return fire.

Breonna Taylor didn't fire at them, so it's impossible to return fire to Breonna Taylor.
That's what makes her killing a murder, in the eyes of people who aren't unhinged sociopaths.

#64 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 01:07 PM | Reply

"61 as I said, they missed the boyfriend and hit her."

They weren't aiming for her?

How'd they manage to hit her?

Intentionally discharging a firearm which kills someone is still a murder, but I'll grant that it could be easier to demonstrate that it's an intentional homicide. As they intentionally and recklessly fired their weapons, resulting in the death of a person they weren't even shooting at or arresting.

#65 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 01:10 PM | Reply

"Their mistakes make it depraved indifference, but certainly not murder."

"Depraved indifference" about where your bullets end up is the same thing as murder, when the bullets kill someone.
If you go shoot your guns into the sky, and the bullets come down and kill someone down in the park, you will be charged with murder. And rightfully so.
If you go shoot your guns into the side of the neighbor's house, and the bullets kill someone inside, you will be charged with murder. And rightfully so.

#66 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 01:15 PM | Reply

Which is the very definition of manslaughter. You are arguing for murder, which requires intent and premeditation.......manslaughter is the correct charge as it requires depraved indifference.

I think you are just confused about the law. At least I hope.

Otherwise every driver that hits a jaywalker is a murderer.

#67 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 01:15 PM | Reply

But hey, ten years for "depraved indifference" that results in an intentional homicide of an innocent bystander, that would also be justice.

The police acted with the same mentality of gang-bangers doing a drive-by. Spray and pray. That's murder.

How many years do you think the cops who killed Breonna Taylor should get? Is it a number greater than zero?

#68 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 01:17 PM | Reply

Snoofy, facts do matter. Breonna Taylor's was a tragedy, but she did not die in her bed. You might want to go and check out the facts. Also, Tamir Rice had a gun, yes it was a fake gun that he took the orange tip off. It is always convenient to leave out a fact or two to make it look like you are correct. You hate police and it doesn't matter what happens in your opinion, they are wrong. You probably think that hands up don't shoot is based on truth.

#69 | Posted by phinphan at 2020-09-14 01:17 PM | Reply

"You are arguing for murder, which requires intent and premeditation"

They premeditated their entry to her home. In fact, they premeditated it so extensively that they got a warrant to do so.
They intentionally discharged their firearms, repeatedly.

#70 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 01:19 PM | Reply

"Also, Tamir Rice had a gun, yes it was a fake gun"

That's like saying Eric Garner had a $20, yes it was a fake $20.

#71 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 01:19 PM | Reply

Also, Tamir Rice had a gun, yes it was a fake gun that he took the orange tip off.

And Ohio is an open carry state. Even a 911 call of suspected illicit use does not usurp anyone's 2nd Amendment rights unless the officers witnessed Rice using the gun in a manner that posed an immediate threat to another person. The officer shot him 2 seconds after exiting his vehicle.

It is always convenient to leave out a fact or two to make it look like you are correct.

Yep. Physician heal thyself.

#72 | Posted by tonyroma at 2020-09-14 01:23 PM | Reply

"You hate police"

Not true at all.
I only hate the white supremacists and racists.
Give me your honest estimate, what percentage of the police force is white supremacist or gang-related?

L.A. County deputy alleges Executioner' gang dominates Compton sheriff station
www.latimes.com

#73 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 01:23 PM | Reply

"Also, Philandro Castile had a gun, yes it was a real gun"

#74 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 01:24 PM | Reply

They intentionally discharged their firearms, repeatedly.? Did they have the right to enter that building? Were they fired at? Snoofy answer those two questions truthfully.

#75 | Posted by phinphan at 2020-09-14 01:37 PM | Reply

There's a big difference between intentionally trying to kill someone and a tragic accident. Snoofy, The cops who killed Breonna Taylor will either not be charged of if charged, will not be found guilty. There is no way a court will convict them. The person who should be up on charges is the person who designated Breonna Taylor's house as a "drug house". That's the person who started the whole thing in motion. Continuing to blame the cops is not going to get anything changed.

#76 | Posted by Rocky_b at 2020-09-14 01:57 PM | Reply

"There's a big difference between intentionally trying to kill someone and a tragic accident. Snoofy"

There was no "accident" in Breonna Taylor's killing.
The police entered the place and started a gun battle, with no regard for where their shots landed.
Nothing that happened was unintentional on the part of the police.
They intended to raid the home, and they intended to return fire. That's not an accident.

But I'll play along: What accident are you referring to?

#77 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 01:59 PM | Reply

Holy crap. You are straight faced saying the act of obtaining a warrant is premeditation for the police killing someone after they were shot at?

I hope you never are selected for jury duty. Or breed.

That is literally the dumbest thing I have read today, and the dumbest thing I will likely read all week.

#78 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 01:59 PM | Reply

They intentionally discharged their firearms, repeatedly.? Did they have the right to enter that building? Were they fired at? Snoofy answer those two questions truthfully.

Yes, Yes, Yes.
That's why none of this was an accident.
It went down exactly as they are trained to do.

#79 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 01:59 PM | Reply

"You are straight faced saying the act of obtaining a warrant is premeditation for the police killing someone after they were shot at?"

No less so than when a burglar cases a neighborhood and picks the target he is going to B&E.
The police picked, or had picked for them, the target they were going to enter. It wasn't chosen randomly or in a moment of passion.
That means it was premeditated. Their entry was premeditated, and planned, and trained for.

#80 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 02:04 PM | Reply

"is premeditation for the police killing someone after they were shot at?"

Returning fire is part of police training.
They returned fire with premeditation. Not in a moment of passion. With premeditation, and in accord with their training.

#81 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 02:06 PM | Reply

Hands down gold medal for the worst take ever.

Like seriously. I think you are a caricature now. You can't be this naive AND stupid. You just can't.

Police have a legal right to obtain search warrants, and a legal right to enter people's homes they suspect have committed a crime if and when a judge agrees, and they the right to return fire when shot at.

None of that implies premeditation for murder.

I think you are just screwing with me now. You don't actually believe that terrible, laughable, interpretation of events.

#82 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 02:08 PM | Reply

"Police have a legal right to obtain search warrants,..."

Of course they do, I'm not even disputing this.
I am simply saying the police acted deliberately, and with premeditation.

"None of that implies premeditation for murder."
It does when the results of the premeditated, deliberate action is intentionally shooting and killing someone who isn't shooting at you.

You're saying the police didn't intent to kill Breonna Taylor, right?
In that case, please tell me what you think the police thought would happen to Breonna Taylor when they fired their weapons at her.
Thanks.

#83 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 02:14 PM | Reply

In fact, they premeditated it so extensively that they got a warrant to do so.
They intentionally discharged their firearms, repeatedly.
#70 | POSTED BY SNOOFY

They falsified evidence on the warrant to justify what was initially setup as a no-knock warrant, then changed last minute to an 'announced entry' warrant. Problem is, they falsified the warrant.

#84 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2020-09-14 02:15 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Continuing to blame the cops is not going to get anything changed.
#76 | POSTED BY ROCKY_B

Oh, I don't know. The officer that was blindly discharging his weapon through the door and a closed window has a decent shot at being convicted of police misconduct.

#85 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2020-09-14 02:18 PM | Reply

"Police have a legal right to obtain search warrants, and a legal right to enter people's homes they suspect have committed a crime if and when a judge agrees, and they the right to return fire when shot at."

That's true, but that's not what happened in the Taylor case. The police did not announce themselves. They're rationale was that if they announced themselves, drug dealers would flush their drugs. Not being drug dealers, Taylor's boyfriend made the logical assumption that their house was being broken in to and opened fire. In fact some of the shots took place from outside the house, where they would not have been able to even see what they were shooting at.

There are a lot of things wrong with this case. First, why in the actual ---- do we care whether she had drugs or not. And even if she did, does that really warrant a no-knock search warrant? The cops showed themselves to be incredibly unprofessional and lacking any semblance of firearm discipline. I think the judge who provided authorization should also be taken to task, as he was the key enabler.

It seems the only people who did the right thing were Breonna Taylor and Kenneth Walker. And for a while, Walker was being held on some very serious charges. It's going to end up costing the city of Louisville a ton of money, and now their police department looks like a joke. They should maybe just consider starting over from scratch.

#86 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-09-14 02:19 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

"Police have a legal right to obtain search warrants, and a legal right to enter people's homes they suspect have committed a crime if and when a judge agrees, and they the right to return fire when shot at."

That's true, but that's not what happened in the Taylor case. The police did not announce themselves. They're rationale was that if they announced themselves, drug dealers would flush their drugs. Not being drug dealers, Taylor's boyfriend made the logical assumption that their house was being broken in to and opened fire. In fact some of the shots took place from outside the house, where they would not have been able to even see what they were shooting at.

There are a lot of things wrong with this case. First, why in the actual ---- do we care whether she had drugs or not. And even if she did, does that really warrant a no-knock search warrant? The cops showed themselves to be incredibly unprofessional and lacking any semblance of firearm discipline. I think the judge who provided authorization should also be taken to task, as he was the key enabler.

It seems the only people who did the right thing were Breonna Taylor and Kenneth Walker. And for a while, Walker was being held on some very serious charges. It's going to end up costing the city of Louisville a ton of money, and now their police department looks like a joke. They should maybe just consider starting over from scratch.

#87 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-09-14 02:20 PM | Reply

"In fact some of the shots took place from outside the house, where they would not have been able to even see what they were shooting at."

There are two choices:
These shots were fired with premeditation, or they were not.
What's your answer, ABH?

#88 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 02:22 PM | Reply

#87 all great reasons for a manslaughter charge.

#88 nope.

#89 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 02:31 PM | Reply

I could only read about half of this ---- show of a thread.

Jesus H people. No wonder the US is circling the drain.

#90 | Posted by jpw at 2020-09-14 02:32 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#87 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER

I got to about post 45 and jumped to the end.

I hope this NW post isn't the first rational thought on the topic.

#91 | Posted by jpw at 2020-09-14 02:34 PM | Reply

"#87 all great reasons for a manslaughter charge."

That's fine, but it really doesn't address the root cause of the problem. First, I don't think there is anything suggesting that any of the police officers or the judge are inherently racist. What I do suspect is that the police had been given a lot of latitude on how to enforce the law, which in turn suggests that the unit was unprepared to execute this warrant at the level of professionalism needed to do something like this. I feel like they envisioned themselves as being more like I MEF kicking down doors in Fallujah than police officers in Louisville Kentucky. Especially given that they decided to lay down some covering fire without knowing who else was in the apartment (or neighboring apartments) or what their background looked like. That place could have been full of children for all they knew.

The other thing is what constitutes a crime. I'm biased, but I think that the decriminalization of drugs is a far bigger problem than racism because it affects people all over the world. And you can't legislate away racism. You can legislate away the vast majority of negative outcomes associated with the war on drugs.

#92 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-09-14 03:00 PM | Reply

You will find I completely agree. Drug laws Shouldn't exist. All of the reasons drugs are bad, are already illegal. It's not the act of taking drugs that'sa rain on society, it's if you steal, mug, murder, and etc.

It Shouldn't be the governments job what you put on your own body, into your actions interfere with someone else's right to exist peaceably.

I apart think police departments need MUCH more civilian oversight in order to investigate problems within the department.

There are much we likely disagree on, but I am quite sure we agree on that.

#93 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 03:09 PM | Reply

I am not for a second minimizing the tragedy of Ms. Taylor's death. To think that the cops intended to kill Ms. Taylor is just stupid. The only reason they discharged their weapons is because they were fired upon first. Since this was at night, I'm sure the lights were off. The cops didn't shoot the guy who shot at them because they probably couldn't see who was shooting and Ms. Taylor was tragically hit by the un-aimed shots. Should the cops have waited for the lights to come on? The cop's intent was to shoot at the person(s) who were shooting at them. To think this was intentional from the start is just fueling the flames. We must start accepting that the majority of cops want to help keep the peace. What happened in Lancaster PA yesterday is a classic example. Snoofy, tell me what the cop in that case should have done. Why are people protesting the shooting of a guy attacking a cop with a knife? It's madness.

#94 | Posted by Rocky_b at 2020-09-14 04:04 PM | Reply

The cop's intent was to shoot at the person(s) who were shooting at them.

You don't get to hide behind the badge when you create a situation like they did.

It was unprofessional and just plain stupid. So much so they shouldn't be shielded from the consequences of their actions and they should be held legally liable for her death.

#95 | Posted by jpw at 2020-09-14 04:10 PM | Reply

#94 No one is protesting the shooting of a guy attacking a cop with a knife. They are protesting an unarmed man being shot in the back, with no consequences to the shooter in the case of the cop, and allowing the shooter to walk away from the crime scene in the case of the child terrorist.

#96 | Posted by bored at 2020-09-14 04:19 PM | Reply

#94 The cops that killed Ms Taylor are clearly incompetent at best, assassins at worst. Why do they still have jobs?

#97 | Posted by bored at 2020-09-14 04:20 PM | Reply

"To think that the cops intended to kill Ms. Taylor is just stupid.

No, it really isn't.
Police fired 20 shots into her home.
What was their intent?

#98 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 04:42 PM | Reply

#97 one was fired. The one that fired recklessly and responsible for most of the bullets fired by the police. He is still under investigation, as is the rest of the squad there.

#99 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 04:44 PM | Reply

"#94 No one is protesting the shooting of a guy attacking a cop with a knife."

You'd think maybe the cops themselves would protest the fact that they are all too often the trigger men for a thing called Suicide By Cop.

On the other hand, if the cops genuinely enjoy killing people, then there's nothing to protest.

#100 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 04:44 PM | Reply

To end the threat to threat to themselves snoofy. Duh. As has been pointed out to you a billion times, no one can stretch enough to make the leap you are making to invent a new definition of premeditation.

#101 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 04:54 PM | Reply

www.wsj.com What do you call this?

#102 | Posted by Rocky_b at 2020-09-14 05:03 PM | Reply

Their intent was to kill the person who shot at them. The fact that it was Ms. Taylor who ended up being shot is the tragedy of the situation. Would you have been OK if they killed her boyfriend? The fact that 20 shots were fired is irrelevant. I'm sure you would have been just as angry if it was one shot. I'd love to see how you'd change police training. If you're shot at...take a break to see if the person really wants to kill you. Ask them their intent first. And if they really do want to kill you, make sure you only wound them. Would that be OK with you?

#103 | Posted by Rocky_b at 2020-09-14 05:10 PM | Reply

If you're shot at...take a break to see if the person really wants to kill you. Ask them their intent first. And if they really do want to kill you, make sure you only wound them. Would that be OK with you?

#103 | Posted by Rocky_b

How about not kicking in somebody's door in the middle of the night without announcing oneself?

And yes, it does matter that 20 rounds were fired. Apparently a civilian in a shooting situation is held to much higher standards than police are.

#104 | Posted by jpw at 2020-09-14 05:22 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Whether you agree with no knock warrants or not.... and I don't..... they are a legal option for the police that require and they received, judicial review. They were well within their rights for a no knock raid, at night, as an impartial judge had reviewed it and allowed the request to proceed.

Until they are banned? It is perfectly okay for them to be used.

#105 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 05:27 PM | Reply

The headline reminds me of the controversial statements made by Bill Maher after 9-11.

He said the plane-jackers may be evil, hateful, and deserving of burning in hell forever, - but they were not cowards. Hijacking planes and ramming them into buildings takes courage. ... If memory serves, in less than a month Maher was hounded off the air by an outraged public. Nobody wanted to hear that any act of premeditated violence on an unwitting victim is anything other than cowardly.

#106 | Posted by moder8 at 2020-09-14 05:49 PM | Reply

#108. There is a big difference between the hijackers, who had to confront their victims forcefully, over a long period of time and this.

This is the murder equivalent of sucker punching someone in a bar and fleeing before they can react.

There is no amount of spin that makes this not a cowards act.

#107 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 05:56 PM | Reply

Some people are saying this was done by the trump campaign.
#22 | POSTED BY CHIEFTUTMOSES AT 2020-09-13 04:48 PM | REPLY

Who? What people? Your toothless neighbor living in a van down the street in your RV park, while he's huffing paint?

Hands down, recipient of the 2020 Darwin award.

#108 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-09-14 06:03 PM | Reply

I got news for you ABH... all murders are the equivalent of a sucker punch. Believe it.

#109 | Posted by moder8 at 2020-09-14 06:03 PM | Reply

Eh. Maybe. But this is really overt.

#110 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 06:05 PM | Reply

"I'd love to see how you'd change police training."

We could start by teaching them how to honestly fill out a warrant.

We could also teach if you've had a guy in custody for 40 minutes, he's probably not in Breonna Taylor's apartment.

How's that for a start?

#111 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-09-14 06:17 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

Should the cops have waited for the lights to come on? The cop's intent was to shoot at the person(s) who were shooting at them. To think this was intentional from the start is just fueling the flames. We must start accepting that the majority of cops want to help keep the peace. What happened in Lancaster PA yesterday is a classic example. Snoofy, tell me what the cop in that case should have done. Why are people protesting the shooting of a guy attacking a cop with a knife? It's madness.
#94 | POSTED BY ROCKY_B

You are completely devoid of the nuance.

Read a little more about the case and I'd bet you're opinion will be modified.

#112 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2020-09-14 06:20 PM | Reply

#103 | POSTED BY ROCKY_B

If the police only shot one bullet, Taylor more than likely would still be alive.

#113 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2020-09-14 06:22 PM | Reply

Until they are banned? It is perfectly okay for them to be used.
#105 | POSTED BY ABH

Not when they falsify the arrest warrant.

#114 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2020-09-14 06:23 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

How's that for a start?
#111 | POSTED BY DANFORTH

Decent, rational, and logical start.

Yet, here we are. Still discussing what would be the best way to implement criminal justice reform.

The discussion has been had and has been settled. Now is the time for action. Evidenced-based practice and policy works and is established in the literature. Now we need politicians and the voting public to put pressure on police union heads to take this on fully and sincerely.

#115 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2020-09-14 06:27 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Their intent was to kill the person who shot at them.
#103 | POSTED BY ROCKY_B

"Their intent was to kill" all right.

And kill they did.
They killed an innocent bystander.

"The fact that it was Ms. Taylor who ended up being shot is the tragedy of the situation."

Murder is indeed a tragedy.
But it absolutely was not an accident.
They did not accidentally discharge their weapons. They fired them on purpose, and with intent to kill.

And since it wasn't an accident, the only other option is that it was deliberate.
They deliberately killed Breonna Taylor, who was unarmed, and posed no threat to them.
And that is murder.

#116 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 06:50 PM | Reply

You keep stretching like that you are going to pull something.

It absolutely Was unintentional. The fact that you can actually leap the Grand Canyon of Logic in a single bound and land in pure fiction, is actually amazing to behold.

#117 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 06:52 PM | Reply

There is no amount of spin that makes this not a cowards act.
#107 | POSTED BY ABH

^
It's funny because while you say that, you're intent on spinning the police killing of Breonna Taylor into something other than a coward's act.

You have two completely different standards: One for when the police dish it out, another for when the police get a taste of their own medicine.

#118 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 06:55 PM | Reply

"It absolutely Was unintentional. "

No, it was purely deliberate. They absolutely fired their weapons with intent. Their intent was to kill the person who shot at them. Sheesh!

#119 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 06:57 PM | Reply

I could shoot at your house, and if I hit you in your house, I could claim it was unintentional, since I was only shooting at your house.
I could shoot at your dog that's attacking me, and if I hit you, I could could claim it was unintentional, since I was only shooting at your dog.

That's what you're saying, ABH?

#120 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 06:59 PM | Reply

Again, that's helluva stretch. The hijackers were there to intentionally kill everyone and perpetrate evil. They were scum.

The police were there to do what they thought was the right thing and inadvertently killed the person who wasn't shooting at them when they legally entered the house to effect a legal arrest.

These two things couldn't be more opposite, and just like you have been from your very first incorrect post, you couldn't be more wrong if you actually tried to.

#121 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 07:05 PM | Reply

No, you giant simpleton. I swear you have the IQ of toast.

You're Analogy doesn't share a single one of the facts.

Here is a closer analogy. You are walking down the street minding your own business. I am also legally on the sidewalk, and as I see you, I pull out a weapon, and shoot you in the leg. If you shoot back wildly enjoying the magazine at me, miss and hit the old lady behind me, you aren't a murderer because you didn't intend to kill her and were defending yourself from me.

Manslaughter? Maybe. Just as I said for these police.

#122 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 07:10 PM | Reply

Emptying.... stupid auto correct.

#123 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 07:11 PM | Reply

"The police were there to do what they thought was the right thing"

What you're saying is, police thought that firing blindly into the house was the right thing to do.

And all I'm saying is, they didn't fire blindly into the house by accident, or inadvertently. They fired intentionally and with intent to kill.

#124 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 07:15 PM | Reply

"If you shoot back wildly enjoying the magazine at me, miss and hit the old lady behind me, you aren't a murderer because you didn't intend to kill her and were defending yourself from me."

You're an unhinged sociopath if you don't think that's murder, emptying a whole clip in an area where there are bound to be innocent bystanders.

Here are some real-world examples of those types of murders from across America, since you don't seem to know what murder is:

SAN DIEGO (CNS) - Murder and other felony charges were filed Wednesday against a 20-year-old probationer who allegedly fired a gunshot toward his brother, missing him but inadvertently killing a next-door neighbor asleep in his bed. www.10news.com

Stray bullet kills Mississippi child, man charged with murder www.wkrg.com

Alleged Teen Gang Member Charged for Firing Stray Bullet That Killed Man Walking Dog
www.nbcnewyork.com

#125 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-14 07:19 PM | Reply

I'll give you an A for the effort, not one of those shooters were actively defending themselves in a life or death struggle.

#126 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 07:23 PM | Reply

Unfortunately as we have learned time and again, it is not always the case that misinformation in a search warrant was placed in there accidentally. As we seen time and again, law enforcement embellishes or even lies in a declaration for a search warrant when they really want it but do not feel they legitimately have enough evidence to get it.

And if that was the case in the warrant served at the residence where Breonna Taylor was shot to death, then that is murder, imo. Not just negligent homicide, but murder.

#127 | Posted by moder8 at 2020-09-14 08:33 PM | Reply

I would agree with that moder8. I base my opinion on the fact that the cops had a right to be there and a right to return fire. If they lied on the warrant, then they had no legal right to be there which trashes all of their other defenses.

#128 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-14 08:46 PM | Reply

And I would concede that if the officers in good faith believed they were serving a valid warrant at the proper address based on proper evidence presented to the judge, then it was not murder. And that is doubly true for those officers on scene who had nothing to do with the writing of the warrant.

It was something, but not murder.

#129 | Posted by moder8 at 2020-09-14 09:05 PM | Reply

It was something, but not murder.

#129 | POSTED BY MODER8 AT 2020-09-14 09:05 PM |

Got his law degree from a Captain Crunch Prize.

#130 | Posted by zetaleph at 2020-09-14 09:32 PM | Reply

Until they are banned? It is perfectly okay for them to be used.

#105 | Posted by ABH

Circular logic nonsense.

No knock warrants, like SWAT teams were supposed to be for particular circumstances. Now, because the police have tons of military equipment and have to justify their having it both are used far too often even when not warranted.

In this case it seemed doubly unwarranted. Police conduct needs to be reigned in significantly and I'd rather a few low level dealers flush their stash and avoid prison than have this kind of even happen again. Nobody deserves to die in a pool of their own blood having been shot eight times for a crime they didn't commit or even know they were being attacked for.

#131 | Posted by jpw at 2020-09-14 10:00 PM | Reply

I'll give you an A for the effort, not one of those shooters were actively defending themselves in a life or death struggle.

#126 | Posted by ABH

Doesn't matter.

Civilians are held to a higher standard of conduct in those cases than the police are. The Taylor case is a perfect example of it.

If you emptied a mag and shot a bystander eight times in the process you'd be in cuffs and in jail immediately. But yet the police enjoy a somewhat paradoxical lack of standards standard despite supposedly being better trained and equipped.

#132 | Posted by jpw at 2020-09-14 10:09 PM | Reply

I base my opinion on the fact that the cops had a right to be there and a right to return fire.

Then announce.

They absolutely did not have a right to be treated as anybody else kicking in their door if they didn't announce who they were first.

Anybody kicking in a door in the middle of the night should expect to be shot at.

#133 | Posted by jpw at 2020-09-14 10:10 PM | Reply

Anybody kicking in a door in the middle of the night should expect to be shot at.
#133 | POSTED BY JPW

Damn right!

#134 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2020-09-14 10:17 PM | Reply

#135 | Posted by bizarro_world

Piss off moron.

#136 | Posted by jpw at 2020-09-14 11:06 PM | Reply

- Just obey the law

You mean like bribing witnesses to hush them up the very week of the election?

You must be SO proud!

#138 | Posted by Corky at 2020-09-14 11:17 PM | Reply

The Day of the Dope is... here.

#140 | Posted by Corky at 2020-09-14 11:44 PM | Reply

Says the moron who didn't even get the Trump to Stormy hush money reference... you know, where your Dear Leader proved we was willing to taint the Office to get into it.

There are plenty of blogs where ignorant Trumpers understand each other's lucidity-free blather.

Just sayin'.

#142 | Posted by Corky at 2020-09-15 12:08 AM | Reply

proved he

#143 | Posted by Corky at 2020-09-15 12:09 AM | Reply

"It was unprofessional and just plain stupid. So much so they shouldn't be shielded from the consequences of their actions and they should be held legally liable for her death."

Not necessarily. The capability of a Police unit depends on it's training and discipline. If they had not been trained to do these types of operations, their liability would be minimized, and the fault would fall with their leadership.

One of the things that always bothered me about the George Floyd thing-and I don't know this for sure-was that the knee to neck technique was probably taught as an effective, non-lethal method of subduing uncooperative suspects. The big question is, how many times had the technique been used before, and how many times previously had it resulted in a fatality. And would the outcome have been different had Floyd not been using methamphetamine or have COVID.

#144 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-09-15 12:43 AM | Reply

"Their intent was to kill the person who shot at them."

That couldn't have been the intent of the cops shooting from outside the house. Not unless they were relying on the inshallah method for their rounds to reach the desired target.

#146 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-09-15 12:45 AM | Reply

"Until they are banned? It is perfectly okay for them to be used."

It is, but they probably require a higher level of training than what would be given to your average police officer. If they were serious about this, they would have done their homework. Figured out what the internal layout looked like. Monitored the property to ascertain how many people were there. Maybe even plant a bug in order to conduct pre-strike surveillance. It seems to me if the judge would support door kicking, he would be equally willing to allow the police to employ some sort of reconnaissance as well. Hit the unit from multiple entry points using flash bangs, and the whole thing is over in seconds.

But that sort of training is likely not common outside of SWAT teams or other specialized units. And it seems like a waste of time to go through all that trouble to nab some pot.

#148 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-09-15 12:52 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"It is in the manual and has been covered extensively already as such."

Apparently it wasn't covered extensively enough that I heard about it.

#149 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-09-15 01:00 AM | Reply

I can see people getting pissed about Breonna Taylor and Philando Castille, because they both got shot after doing everything right. George Floyd, Rayshard Brooks, Michael Brown...these guys were starting trouble, or trying to escape from trouble they had gotten themselves in to. Yet the former seem to be largely ignored by BLM when compared to the former.

#150 | Posted by madbomber at 2020-09-15 01:04 AM | Reply

"Problem was the guy had 4x the lethal amount of Fentanyl in his system "

But how long after death were the samples taken? That makes all the difference.

From the American Journal of Clinical Pathology:

As the interval between death and collection of blood becomes longer, drugs from tissues and organs that contain high drug concentrations redistribute owing to cadaver decomposition, leading to increased drug concentration in the blood. During the postmortem interval, drugs from the gastrointestinal tract, lungs, heart, or liver may travel via diffusion through blood vessels or via direct diffusion into other organs or vessels. Drugs that are highly concentrated in the liver, lungs, or myocardium redistribute quickly into HB, causing concentrations to increase.
academic.oup.com

From the same article:

The mean collection times of FB1 and FB2 after death were 4.0 and 21.6 hours, respectively. Fentanyl concentrations for FB1 and FB2 ranged from undetectable to 14.6 g/L (mean, 4.6 g/L) and 2.0 to 52.5 g/L (mean, 17.3 g/L), respectively.
The mean after 21.6 hours is roughly 4x the mean after 4 hours. It also follows the mean after 4 hours is more than at death.

George Floyd's autopsy was performed the next day. Claiming "4x the lethal amount" without an exact timeline parameter is meaningless.

#151 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-09-15 01:19 AM | Reply

-some rich people pay money so women don't talk about how they slept with them

Yes, and some of them bribe porn stars right before an election to the highest office in the land so that voters won't find out who they were diddling while their wife was pregnant.

How much exactly did you get paid, btw?

#152 | Posted by Corky at 2020-09-15 01:37 AM | Reply

re#151

The concentration amounts are in milligrams, not grams. It looks like the DR's system couldn't reproduce the scientific symbol for milligrams, so it substituted a "g".

Ratios and conclusions remain unaffected.

#153 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-09-15 02:19 AM | Reply

That couldn't have been the intent of the cops shooting from outside the house. Not unless they were relying on the inshallah method for their rounds to reach the desired target.
#146 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER

Then what was their intent?

#154 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-15 03:20 AM | Reply

The Day of the Dope is... here.
#140 | POSTED BY CORKY

Shortly after Trump's win, I made a comment, now we know The Day Of The Rope is Jan 20, 2017.
It was deleted.
Jan 20, 2021 is looking even better.

#156 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-15 03:26 AM | Reply

"The list of this innocent black people goes on and on."

Doesn't seem like Philandro Castile made your list.
I wonder what he was guilty of...

#157 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-15 03:28 AM | Reply

"Breona Taylor was eyeball deep in the drug game. Even the NYT admits this was the case. Had she done 'everything right', she would be alive today. Instead, she chose to actively engage in the drug game - and like many others in the drug game, wound up dead."

^
That's a very roundabout way of saying you approve of her being gunned down by the police for no good reason.

#158 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-15 03:31 AM | Reply

That's another very roundabout way of saying you approve of her being gunned down by the police for no good reason.

Are you getting paid by the word, or per each dated pop culture reference?

#160 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-15 04:14 AM | Reply

Everyone loves The Wire. I'd say conservatives are even more about it, since they get to wish away their racist tendencies in a world where Mark Furman is replaced with Richard Belzer.

I only like it because it's Baltimore. The City That Reads.

#162 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-15 05:06 AM | Reply

I wonder if Bizarro World can join ABH, MadBomber, RightOCenter, RstyBeach111, HeliumRat, and possibly even Corky and Willowby and Moder8, in calling for whoever is elected President to End The War On Drugs.

#163 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-15 05:15 AM | Reply

We 100% need more people to do exactly that Snoofy. At least we have some common ground.

Bizarro, you aren't helping and add nothing.

Breonna Taylor likely did aid get drug dealing ex a little bit. That's not a death sentence. Get being involved on the buying or selling of drugs is not in any way relevant to her being killed by police. It is ludicrous to think that poor people desperate for a way out of being poor deserve to be killed or somehow brought it on themselves.

The only relevant facts in the Breonna Taylor case is that the thus far it appears the police were legally right in their entrance to the home. They had a warrant signed by an impartial judge. They got shot at and returned fire. One of the officers is responsible for over half the rounds has been fired and is still under investigation. It seems the correct response by the department and the DAs office has been taken. If the facts change, then the response should change.

Bizarro, stop bringing up Floyd's fentanyl blood level. It doesn't matter. At all. Completely irrelevant. The rear knee choke is a restraint used to temporarily deal with a suspect to get t them cuffed. He was cuffed. And as such, he became 100% the responsibility of the arresting officer. He should have immediately sat him up and medically checked him. Period. End of story. I don't care if he has ---- his own throat right before the officer cuffed him. The officer would be responsible because instead of doing the right things after getting him cuffs, he purposefully made it worse. He is a murderer, and that's it.

#164 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-15 05:42 AM | Reply

Scared Trump has a jack boot with your name on it?
#137 | POSTED BY BIZARRO_WORLD

Remember when the Right was against Government Jack Booted Thugs?
Good times.

#166 | Posted by TFDNihilist at 2020-09-15 06:27 AM | Reply

...some rich people pay money so women don't talk...
#145 | POSTED BY BIZARRO_WORLD

And when Trump did it (you admit he did it), he broke the law. So why don't you hold him in contempt as you do other lawbreakers?

#168 | Posted by TFDNihilist at 2020-09-15 06:29 AM | Reply

You thought that because you're looking for an excuse for Trump.

#171 | Posted by TFDNihilist at 2020-09-15 06:43 AM | Reply

Jack boots where designed...
#169 | POSTED BY BIZARRO_WORLD

Actually, they were designed for fascist Nazis.

#172 | Posted by TFDNihilist at 2020-09-15 06:44 AM | Reply

Your reading comprehension is way off.
They were designed by Fascist Nazis.
Does that help?
And if you believe that Cohen paid off Daniels own his own, you're not even worth talking to.

#175 | Posted by TFDNihilist at 2020-09-15 06:58 AM | Reply

Sorry, I somehow figured that you'd be against using Nazi equipment and tactics against fellow Americans.
If that makes me stupid, I have no problem with that.

#177 | Posted by TFDNihilist at 2020-09-15 08:12 AM | Reply

Bizarro, the rear knee choke is designed to control suspects UNTIL they are in handcuffs. There are countless court cases determining that once a suspect is in handcuffs they are incapable of helping themselves and it is the responsibility of the officer to help them. The officer should have called for Ems at the first sign of trouble.... which he didn't ever see because he was still choking him. You don't know he died from the fentanyl. Of the officer had provided proper medical care and got him to the hospital he may have lived. But choking him for ten straight minutes AFTER he was handcuffed ensured he did not.

Completely the officers responsibility.

#178 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-15 08:33 AM | Reply

The only thing that would have saved him (Floyd) in Narcan

#180 | POSTED BY BIZARRO_WORLD

So, standing on his neck and suffocating him was really just cutting to the chase?

#181 | Posted by Zed at 2020-09-15 08:41 AM | Reply

BIZARRO_WORLD

Should Donald Trump win this election by any means necessary, and/or stay in office by any means necessary?

#182 | Posted by Zed at 2020-09-15 08:43 AM | Reply

BIZARRO_WORLD

Oh, don't hold back. I want the opinion of a real American on this subject.

#183 | Posted by Zed at 2020-09-15 08:45 AM | Reply

#179 | POSTED BY BIZARRO_WORLD

Dehumanizing your fellow citizens so you can label them the "other", another Nazi technique you've seemed to grab hold of.

#186 | Posted by TFDNihilist at 2020-09-15 08:50 AM | Reply

" he just downed 4x a lethal dose of fentanyl."

You must've missed the pathology link describing how fentanyl concentrates after death.

21 hours after death, the drug concentration is roughly 4 times what it was at 4 hours, which is more than at death, due to body decomposition. The link is on my page.

IOW, your "4x" talking point resides at the intersection of Worthless and Uninformed.

#187 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-09-15 08:51 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Nothing related to his neck caused the suffocation.

#184 | POSTED BY BIZARRO_WORL

Floyd's neck was where his windpipe was.

Are you smart enough to know when you've lost?

#189 | Posted by Zed at 2020-09-15 08:53 AM | Reply

Or, how about we go with 'Deplorables'?

#188 | POSTED BY BIZARRO_WORLD

Hey, man. If the shoe fits. You're certainly trying it on.

#190 | Posted by Zed at 2020-09-15 08:54 AM | Reply

BIZARRO_WORLD

Should Donald Trump win this election by any means necessary, and/or stay in office by any means necessary?

#191 | Posted by Zed at 2020-09-15 08:55 AM | Reply

" My guess is he surpasses 350 EC."

I'd take that bet, but everyone knows you'll be hiding under yet another name after the election.

What percentage of the black vote are you predicting Trump will get these days?

#192 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-09-15 08:56 AM | Reply

What percentage of the black vote are you predicting Trump will get these days?

#192 | POSTED BY DANFORTH AT 2020

There will be a Red Wave, obviously.

#193 | Posted by Zed at 2020-09-15 08:57 AM | Reply

"My guess is he surpasses 350 EC."

Wow. That's obvious not what Trump thinks.

#194 | Posted by Zed at 2020-09-15 08:58 AM | Reply

Bizarro, your argument is like saying a shooting victim died from lead poisoning and not trauma. It's stupid.

Kneeling on his neck while he is already in distress and it has no effect? Are you insane?

#195 | Posted by ABH at 2020-09-15 08:59 AM | Reply

" Nothing related to his neck caused the suffocation."

That's like saying nothing related to a plane caused Falling Man's death.

That's also not what the autopsy said.

#196 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-09-15 08:59 AM | Reply

"Are you insane?"

He has all the intelligence of Special Eddy.

#199 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-09-15 09:01 AM | Reply

" My guess is 25%."

My guess is you're 100% idiot.

#200 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-09-15 09:02 AM | Reply

" The autopsy conducted by the family of this piece of human trash or by a legitimate authority?"

Both.

Did you read my pathology link, or not?

#202 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-09-15 09:06 AM | Reply

Another moron who can't handle the truth.

#204 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-09-15 09:12 AM | Reply

...we go with 'Deplorables'?
#188 | POSTED BY BIZARRO_WORLD

I agree with Hillary's statement on this, racist, sexist, homophobic, xenophobic, Islamaphobic (the actual qualifiers she used) people are deplorable.
I certainly don't remember her suggesting that anyone was less than human, or that she planned on sending Jack Booted Government Thugs to step on their necks.

#205 | Posted by TFDNihilist at 2020-09-15 10:35 AM | Reply

"No point in reading anything you put forth."

Not me, dummy; the American Journal of Clinical Pathology. Basically, they said you're full of manure.

#206 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-09-15 11:08 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

You are on par with Zed for useless babble

Posted by bizarro_world

Floyd's windpipe was in his neck, strange as that seems to you.

#207 | Posted by Zed at 2020-09-15 11:18 AM | Reply

gvwire.com
"Accused California Cop Killer Linked To Right-Wing Extremist Boogaloo Movement"

Well there goes the narrative...

#208 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2020-09-15 01:28 PM | Reply

"Dehumanizing your fellow citizens so you can label them the "other"
#186 | POSTED BY TFDNIHILIST "

That is the entire basis of your identity politics dumbass. Or, how about we go with 'Deplorables'?
#188 | POSTED BYBIZARRO_WORLD

Deplorable is not dehumanizing.

There's no suggestion that Deplorable people aren't people.

#209 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-15 02:32 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"Accused California Cop Killer Linked To Right-Wing Extremist Boogaloo Movement"
Well there goes the narrative...
#208 | POSTED BY SPEAKSOFTLY

Carrillo allegedly scrawled the letters "boog," for Boogaloo, in blood on the hood of a car along with a phrase linked to the group as he fled police last Saturday, NBC News reported. "Boogaloo" is code for a violent insurrection by the right-wing followers.

The phrase written on the car, "I became unreasonable," is part of a call to arms by members of the group who appear on social media sites armed and urging followers to "become unreasonable." It's not clear whose blood was used; Carrillo was shot by police before his capture.

A former friend told the Mercury News that Carrillo was sharing memes of the Boogaloo movement in his Facebook comments. ...

Last week, however, three men linked to the Boogaloo movement were arrested and charged with state and federal conspiracy violations for allegedly plotting to trigger violence at anti-racism protests in Las Vegas. They were also accused of possessing Molotov cocktails.
----------

The guy arrested on suspicion of starting the fire in Oregon supposedly did so with a Molotov cocktial.

Just sayin'.

#210 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2020-09-15 02:36 PM | Reply

That is how opiods kill - respiratory collapse.
#184 | POSTED BY BIZARRO_WORLD

So when Floyd said "I can't breathe" should the cops have just kept kneeling on his neck, preventing him from breathing, preventing him from seeking medical help, and just letting the opioids keep killing him?

#211 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-15 02:36 PM | Reply

The guy arrested on suspicion of starting the fire in Oregon supposedly did so with a Molotov cocktial.
Just sayin'.
#210 | POSTED BY RSTYBEACH11

You know the cops won't go after them.

Just like the cops still haven't arrested the guy that smashed up the AutoZone in Minneapolis.

Just sayin'

#212 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-09-15 02:38 PM | Reply

There's no suggestion that Deplorable people aren't people.
#209 | POSTED BY SNOOFY

Doesn't Bannon refer to them pejoratively as 'hobbits' or something like that?

#213 | Posted by schifferbrains at 2020-09-15 02:40 PM | Reply

The guy arrested on suspicion of starting the fire in Oregon supposedly did so with a Molotov cocktial.

Just sayin'.

#210 | Posted by rstybeach11

So trump's cult is no longer satisfied with burning down the country metaphorically. Now they want to do so literally.

#214 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2020-09-15 02:48 PM | Reply

#208

Isn't that the guy up in Santa Cruz?

#215 | Posted by leftcoastlawyer at 2020-09-15 03:49 PM | Reply

The crowd should have rolled those ------- cops and saved Floyd. I hope those cops get life in prison. Scum.

#217 | Posted by YAV at 2020-09-15 10:41 PM | Reply

Scared Trump has a jack boot with your name on it? Just obey the law, get a job, and you have nothing to fear.

#137 | Posted by bizarro_world

No doubt another self-professed constitution loving "c-c-conservative.'

#218 | Posted by jpw at 2020-09-15 10:44 PM | Reply

#216 | Posted by bizarro_world

So which sausage fest deplorable is back again this time?

#219 | Posted by jpw at 2020-09-15 10:48 PM | Reply

#219 - Ira Schittsberg from the posting style I suspect.

#220 | Posted by YAV at 2020-09-15 10:50 PM | Reply

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