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Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Sunday, December 06, 2020

Peter Baker: The final days of the Trump presidency have taken on the stormy elements of a drama more common to history or literature than a modern White House. His rage and detached-from-reality refusal to concede defeat evoke images of a besieged overlord in some distant land defiantly clinging to power rather than going into exile ... And while he will leave office in 46 days, the last few weeks may only foreshadow what he will be like after he departs.

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At times, Mr. Trump's railing-against-his-fate outbursts seem like a story straight out of William Shakespeare, part tragedy, part farce, full of sound and fury. Is Mr. Trump a modern-day Julius Caesar, forsaken by even some of his closest courtiers? (Et tu, Bill Barr?) Or a King Richard III who wars with the nobility until being toppled by Henry VII? Or King Lear, railing against those who do not love and appreciate him sufficiently? How sharper than a serpent's tooth it is to have a thankless electorate.

"This is classic Act V behavior," said Jeffrey R. Wilson, a Shakespearean scholar at Harvard who published the book "Shakespeare and Trump" this year. "The forces are being picked off and the tyrant is holed up in his castle and he's growing increasingly anxious and he feels insecure and he starts blustering about his legitimate sovereignty and he starts accusing the opposition of treason."

Others hear echoes from the East, recalling autocrats in the far reaches of the former Soviet Union barricading themselves in presidential palaces while furiously spinning out enemies-of-the-people propaganda to justify holding onto power after popular uprisings.

"If there are these analogies between classic literature and society as it's operating right now, then that should give us some big cause for concern this December," said Mr. Wilson, the Shakespearean scholar. "We're approaching the end of the play here and that's where catastrophe always comes."

Who ever thought that things like these would be uttered by or about someone with a sworn duty to defend and protect this nation and its Constitution while his cultish supporters ignore that he's doing precisely the opposite completely in service of himself alone?

#1 | Posted by tonyroma at 2020-12-05 09:05 PM | Reply

Dumbasses are gonna dumbass. You can't fix stupid.

He will be dragged out of the white house in a straightjacket. Foaming at the mouth.

I'm gonna be eating popcorn and loving every second of the show.

#2 | Posted by Effeteposer at 2020-12-06 12:04 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

#2

Yeah thanks. Enjoy watching the monster you helped create go crazy. I think you should probably take a humbler approach.

#3 | Posted by bocaink at 2020-12-06 10:03 AM | Reply

I'm gonna be eating popcorn and loving every second of the show.

There is nothing entertaining about Trump falsely riling up millions of Americans into believing that a wholly fair election return was fraudulent simply because he didn't win. Of course this flies in the face of every other Republican who won their races up and down every ballot in the very same states that Trump himself lost.

Trump is trying to foment open and possibly violent rebellion in this nation simply to serve his personal interests - none of his machinations having anything to do with defending or protecting the Constitution or this nation. He is actively trying to destroy the publics' belief in fair accounting of legal ballots and most of his ire is directed toward REPUBLICAN officials who know that no systemic fraud occurred, yet still are now fired, pilloried, and threatened as a part of Trump's false grievance.

Once Trump leaves the White House on January 20th, he will not remain quiet, he will daily lead a "shadow government in exile" while making sure that the Republican Party does not allow Joe Biden to accomplish a single thing on his agenda to improve things for this nation's suffering people. The damage Trump will cause is incalculable as is the final number of Americans who will lose their lives due to his gross mismanagement of America's coronavirus pandemic response.

There is nothing to "love" of this upcoming travesty that Trump is planning on broadcasting that will undermine the very law and Constitution he swore to uphold.

#4 | Posted by tonyroma at 2020-12-06 10:09 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 7

Maybe we can hope for a Hitler-like exit? Buy him some dogs so he can poison them before he blows out his brains.

#5 | Posted by Zed at 2020-12-06 11:12 AM | Reply

It's difficult for a malignant narcissist to kill himself. Hitler did so because he was terrified the Russians would parade him as a prisoner and humiliate him. Donald Trump is just as terrified of humiliation. If he ever becomes convinced prison is inevitable he'll off himself. But he won't use a gun. A gun is for real men, as Hitler to the very end saw himself.

#6 | Posted by Zed at 2020-12-06 11:21 AM | Reply

But he won't use a gun.

His own lack of health will do it. Eventually his protective shield of self-delusion will crack and his blood pressure will blow his eyeballs right out of his face.

#7 | Posted by REDIAL at 2020-12-06 11:41 AM | Reply

An option I've not thought of until lately (thanks to smarter people writing about it) is yet another norm that Trump will smash-the quiet, retired POTUS who stays out of policy matters.

Even though Trumpism was rejected, he'll lead his kool aid brigade from out of office and we'll have to see a former POTUS continue to directly influence our lives through our government. As far as I know that's never happened before...

#8 | Posted by jpw at 2020-12-06 12:31 PM | Reply

He'll always be a pathetic loser.

#9 | Posted by LegallyYourDead at 2020-12-06 02:10 PM | Reply

He is one very sick puppy.

#10 | Posted by Yodagirl at 2020-12-06 02:57 PM | Reply

Speaking of denial, my posts stating my opinion that mail-in ballots were mishandled were deleted.

So who's in denial?

#11 | Posted by BillJohnson at 2020-12-06 06:44 PM | Reply | Funny: 2

Trump should attend the inauguration out of respect for the office.

However, he should never concede so the topic of mail-in ballots will continue to reverberate in the media.

#12 | Posted by BillJohnson at 2020-12-06 06:49 PM | Reply

Trump should attend the inauguration out of respect for the office.

He should stay away because he has no respect for the office.

#13 | Posted by REDIAL at 2020-12-06 06:56 PM | Reply

"However, he should never concede so the topic of mail-in ballots will continue to reverberate in the media."

BillJohnson, if mail in ballots are so insecure, why didn't Republicans stop them?

Why haven't Republicans complained about mail-in ballots prior to 2020?

Why haven't you?

#14 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-12-06 07:02 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

Speaking of denial, my posts stating my opinion that mail-in ballots were mishandled were deleted.
So who's in denial?
#11 | POSTED BY BILLJOHNSON

You are.
You are in denial that mail-in ballots were handled properly.

Why were the mail-in ballots for Senators and Representatives okay, but not the ones for President?

You realize those are the same ballots, right?

Right?

#15 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-12-06 07:04 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

Even weeks before the election I was going on a rant about mail-in ballots being a potential problem.

My opinion has less to do with accusations of fraud and more to do with the fact we're looking at a system were verification is minimal and the ability to cheat is high. I have worked in accounting information systems over 25 years. I understand the risk of human error and the importance of solid checks and balances.

Regardless how many gates you install in the system, mail-in ballots are a problem and should be kept to a minimum.

I mentioned once on here...with mail-in ballots how would you know your vote got counted? Ok...you get a confirmation email. What if you don't get an email? You won't know if it's because your vote didn't get counted or if you just didn't get the confirmation. Ok...now what do you do?

We're talking about an army of people required and a logistical nightmare to insure all votes are counted once (and only once).

Or...just have people start showing up a month before election day, show your id and vote.

Mail-in ballots are a sure fire way to make sure we lose all confidence in the results of elections.

Mail-in ballots are stupid. I said that before the election and I still say it.

#16 | Posted by BillJohnson at 2020-12-06 07:10 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

Bill Johnson, you have no credibility. If we wanted to throw the election, don't you think we'd have sabotaged Mitch McConnell too?

#17 | Posted by cbob at 2020-12-06 07:28 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 5

"Even weeks before the election I was going on a rant about mail-in ballots being a potential problem."

You and Trump both.

"Mail-in ballots are stupid. I said that before the election and I still say it."

You think the troops voting is stupid.
I strongly encourage you to keep saying it.

#18 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-12-06 07:34 PM | Reply

Even weeks before the election I was going on a rant about mail-in ballots being a potential problem.

Because you listened to others tell you what to believe.

The only problem you are having with mail in ballots is Trump lost.

#19 | Posted by ClownShack at 2020-12-06 07:35 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

"Mail-in ballots are a sure fire way to make sure we lose all confidence in the results of elections."

Then you've never had faith, because mail-in ballots are older than you.

You're trying to die on a hill that's been there since before you were born.

You just didn't notice it until now.

And you didn't think it was a problem until Trump declared it a problem.

I encourage you to try and do better, BillJohnson.

#20 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-12-06 07:37 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Rogers....you of all people being a programmer should understand the risk of mail-in voting.

I don't know if you write programs that handle real money, but votes are as precious as money and should be treated accordingly.

We're not talking about voting for king and queen of the prom.

We're voting for the President of the United States.

How on earth can you agree that mail-in ballots are adequately safe enough to tackle such a task and can possibly be monitored to insure every vote is legitimate and counted only once? Sure...for some people it's necessary but to be considered as a normal alternative for voting is a travesty and in this day and age where so much is at stake and people have become so nasty and willing to do anything to win....mail-in ballots absolutely MUST be tightly tightly regulated and restricted.

You know I'm right.

#21 | Posted by BillJohnson at 2020-12-06 07:38 PM | Reply

#21 Mail in ballots are used exclusively in several states and fraud has never been a problem.

The real election fraud is done by republicans when they restrict the right to vote by sabotaging vote in person in dem areas by ensuring long lines.

If any voting precinct has lines longer than an hour, then the party in charge of voting should automatically lose.

#22 | Posted by bored at 2020-12-06 07:49 PM | Reply

Cbob,

I have no illusions that cheating and mail-in ballot irregularities didn't occur on both sides.

and I have never said the wrong person won. How would I know for sure?

But I will say I believe the results we have been told are most certainly inaccurate due to mail-in ballots.

#23 | Posted by BillJohnson at 2020-12-06 07:52 PM | Reply | Funny: 1 | Newsworthy 1

Rogers....you of all people being a programmer should understand the risk of mail-in voting.

What with them being not remotely similar and all...

#24 | Posted by REDIAL at 2020-12-06 07:53 PM | Reply

Bored,

"The real election fraud is done by republicans when they restrict the right to vote by sabotaging vote in person in dem areas by ensuring long lines."

I agree with your statement.

There are several ways politicians have attempted to corrupt our elections.

But I'm just talking about mail-in ballots right now.

#25 | Posted by BillJohnson at 2020-12-06 07:55 PM | Reply

Bored,

Absentee ballots have been used for many many elections and are the only way people out of the country can vote.

I've noticed people insist on confusing the usage and administration of Absentee and Mail-in ballots.

I guess that's to avoid having an honest discussion.

#26 | Posted by BillJohnson at 2020-12-06 07:59 PM | Reply

But I'm just talking about mail-in ballots right now.

#25 | POSTED BY BILLJOHNSON

And as usual you have no idea what you are talking about.

This could also be called Bill Johnson's final days of rage and denial.

Though I doubt it is the final days for either.

#27 | Posted by donnerboy at 2020-12-06 08:13 PM | Reply

Bill,

I don't know how many times the protocols for both verifying and then counting mail-in ballots has been posted totally discrediting your "feelings". You have no facts, just stupid speculation built upon your own ignorance. Ballot verification for mail-in ballots is just as stringent as it is for in-person voting - including voter ID requirements depending upon the state. Multiple states have been conducting all their elections by mail for years and years with no problems and you keep ignoring these facts because you want to cling to the fiction invented by your complete lack of understanding the process.

Some states even require 3rd party affidavits to accompany mail-in ballots on top of copies of state-approved ID - basically a third person legally vouching that the voter is who they say they are. That is never done with in-person voting. Depending upon the state either multiple people of both parties (or independent persons) first check mail-in ballots to make sure that the address matches the voter's registration or ballot request.

Then the ID requirements are verified by multiple people simultaneously for every single voter who submits a ballot. Then it takes multiple people (or scanners in some states) to match voter signatures on file and if one of those people (or the machine) do not think the signatures match, those ballots are set aside for further verification. They become part of the "curing" process you may have heard being mentioned. Voters are contacted that their ballots have not yet been accepted and that they need to personally contact the voting board to give them more information or to verify yet again that they alone did submit the disputed ballot. Then and only then is it counted. So again, another level of verification that in-person voting doesn't have.

These processes are repeated for every single mail-in ballot before they are separated from their envelopes and the ballots then placed in queue to be tallied. And this is for each and every single ballot. You cannot and will not ever be able to explain how this process can be corrupted by fraud in any appreciable quantity where it can effect most races on most ballots. And you'll never be able to square the circle of logic that dictates if such a widespread fraudulent attempt to affect one race toward a party's candidate was attempted it would only make sense to do the same for every race on those affected ballots. No such efforts have ever been discovered anywhere at any time but for a number of ballots manipulated in North Carolina by Republicans who were caught.

You are not right and we're tired of you repeating your ignorance over and over without recognizing the truth. Mail-in ballots are as secure- if not more so - than in person voter fraud attempts, and both of them are impossible to scale in large enough quantities to effect all but the smallest of races because it can only be done one vote at a time. Even if many ballots were stolen, how would the thief know the intended voter's birthdate or last 4 of SS, or whatever personal information - including a reasonable facsimile of the voter's signature - required to accompany the ballot by the state? They don't, and no schemes to commit widespread voter fraud ever occur because the safeguards protect both the rights of legal voters while assuring others the impossibility of mass fraud one vote/voter at a time.

#28 | Posted by tonyroma at 2020-12-06 08:17 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

I've noticed people insist on confusing the usage and administration of Absentee and Mail-in ballots.

No, yet again it is you who fail to understand that absentee ballots are just one classification of mail-in ballots - otherwise they are the same - the ONLY DIFFERENCE being absentee voters claim that they would be unable to cast their in-person ballot on Election Day, hence they are absentee.

Mail-in votes are the complete class of ballots received through the mail regardless of whether the voter can or cannot physically cast a ballot in their voting district on Election Day.

Depending upon the state, absentee ballots must be requested by the voter while in some states, mail-in ballots are sent to each registered voter without them having to request one, and in most others voters must request a mail-in ballot in order to receive one.

There is zero physical difference between an absentee ballot and a mail-in ballot outside all absentee ballots are mail-in ballots but not all mail-in ballots are absentee per definition explained above.

#29 | Posted by tonyroma at 2020-12-06 08:30 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

And to further elaborate, in many cases absentee ballots are for those who have a specified reason for NOT being able to cast an in-person ballot during the election voting period. Basically, one needs a state-accepted excuse in order to receive an absentee ballot.

Many states offer mail-in ballots to voters as simply another way (or in 5 states, the ONLY way) of voting without each voter needing an approved reason for voting by mail instead of in-person.

#30 | Posted by tonyroma at 2020-12-06 08:38 PM | Reply

"I've noticed people insist on confusing the usage and administration of Absentee and Mail-in ballots."

How you think.
The absentee ballots.
Get to the ballot box?

#31 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-12-06 08:39 PM | Reply

#28 | Posted by tonyroma

Bill's going through Trump's stages of grief:

Denial, anger, denial, anger, denial, anger ...

#32 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY at 2020-12-06 09:09 PM | Reply | Funny: 6

This thread needs to be renamed "BillJohnson's Final days of Rage and Denial."

Jesus dude, I can't tell who the bigger whiner is. You are living a lie Bill....

You are looney toons, you are detached from reality. Everyone else isn't the one that's wrong.

#33 | Posted by bocaink at 2020-12-06 09:13 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

Tony,

This election things were handled differently.

It was more wide spread.

Perhaps you're pointing out something that needs addressed before it grows any larger.

As I recall those ballots have been a problem in past elections only proving my point.

#34 | Posted by BillJohnson at 2020-12-06 09:20 PM | Reply

"I'm just talking about mail-in ballots right now."

Why hasn't there been ANY proof offered inside courtrooms? The lawyers for the Republicans have stipulated: NO FRAUD. Why do you believe something happened that many, many folks paid to find it can't find, and admit they don't have???

#35 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-12-06 09:37 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"my posts stating my opinion that mail-in ballots were mishandled were deleted."

Probably because you, and everyone else, has absolutely NO proof of your claim.

If mail-in ballots were a problem, there would be a long line of examples by states which use them routinely. You've never found one.

#36 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-12-06 09:41 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

One would have to be a math moron to believe in irregularities, and then assume only one party's voters would participate.

#37 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-12-06 09:43 PM | Reply

As I recall those ballots have been a problem in past elections only proving my point.
#34 | POSTED BY BILLJOHNSON

Your stated proof is a recollection of something that you are too lazy to substantiate?

JFC, Bill. Once again, your post is significantly lacking in substance.

Why in the hell do you bother posting anything at all?

#38 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2020-12-06 09:46 PM | Reply

But I will say I believe the results we have been told are most certainly inaccurate due to mail-in ballots.
#23 | POSTED BY BILLJOHNSON

Such an inaccuracy being statistically insignificant is the point you SHOULD be considering. Even you pointed out the accuracy of the election's outcome should not be in dispute. Yet, hear you are, hammering a point about an inaccuracy as though it's worthy of honest discussion.

Often, when someone tries to do that here on the DR, it's because he's trying to distract everyone from something else.

What do you suppose that MIGHT be, BILL?

#39 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2020-12-06 09:53 PM | Reply

I wished someone would stick a mail in ballot up Bill's hidey hole. Jesus Christ.

#40 | Posted by LauraMohr at 2020-12-06 10:19 PM | Reply | Funny: 2

Barely a mask in sight at his Valdosta, GA gripe-a-thon.

Expect a COVID surge in south GA

#41 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY at 2020-12-07 12:19 AM | Reply

If there had been no covid, which resulted in the increased use of absentee ballots, Trump and people like Bill would be saying the election was stolen because busloads of illegal voters were brought into polling stations in various states:

No Evidence of Busing Voters to N.H.
Posted on February 14, 2017

White House senior policy adviser Stephen Miller doubled down on President Trump's unsupported claim that thousands of voters were bused in from Massachusetts to vote illegally in New Hampshire.

Despite multiple prods from ABC "This Week" host George Stephanopoulos to provide evidence, Miller did not-- instead he said the practice was common knowledge to "anyone who's worked in New Hampshire politics."

New Hampshire's deputy secretary of state told us there is no evidence of organized efforts to bring in voters from out of state.

Miller then went on to repeat the baseless claim of massive voter fraud in the 2016 presidential election across the country, based on two studies that show no such thing.


www.factcheck.org

President Putin thanks you for your support.

#42 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2020-12-07 08:45 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Even before the 2016 election, Trump was promoting rigged elections:

Trump's Bogus Voter Fraud Claims
Posted on October 19, 2016

Donald Trump is citing unsubstantiated urban myths and a contested academic study to paint a false narrative about rampant voter fraud in the U.S. and the likelihood of a "rigged" election.

Trump claimed "people that have died 10 years ago are still voting," citing a report that found 1.8 million deceased people remain on voter registration rolls. But the report did not find evidence of wrongdoing, and numerous studies have found such voter fraud is virtually nonexistent.

Trump claimed there is a massive problem with "illegal immigrants [who] are voting," citing research by Old Dominion professors who say noncitizen voters may have benefited Democrats in 2008. But a Harvard professor who manages the data used in the Old Dominion study said the data was misused and the study's conclusions are wrong.

Finally, Trump broadly claimed that "voter fraud is very, very common," and he has called for poll watchers to look for people impersonating voters or voting numerous times. However, numerous academic studies and government inquiries have found in-person voter fraud to be rare.

For weeks, Trump has been warning about rigged elections. He urged his supporters in Ambridge, Pennsylvania, on Oct. 10 to monitor polls and "watch other communities, because we don't want this election stolen from us."

In a speech in Wisconsin on Oct. 17 [2016], Trump provided some detail and purported evidence to back up his claims about the prevalence of voter fraud, particularly by noncitizens and people casting ballots on behalf of deceased voters. But we found that his evidence is lacking.


www.factcheck.org

Trump thought he was going to lose in 2016, so he started promoting the rigged election propaganda before the election. He did the same thing in 2020. The only difference is he placed greater emphasis on mail in ballots this year, because he knew so many more people, especially Democrats, were going to use them.

#43 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2020-12-07 08:52 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

Rsty,

"Even you pointed out the accuracy of the election's outcome should not be in dispute"

Oh no..that's not what I said.

What I said was I believe there were irregularities on both sides so there is no way to say the wrong person won.

Both sides cheating does not make this election accurate.

At this rate instead of the winner being whoever gets the most people to the polls to cast their vote, it will become whoever builds the biggest army of foot soldiers gathering ballots from homes.

Voting is a precious right and we must do what is required to insure the election is accurate.

#44 | Posted by BillJohnson at 2020-12-07 09:37 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

Making Sniper seem erudite and logical by comparison. It's a colossal achievement. You should be applauded.

#45 | Posted by Hagbard_Celine at 2020-12-07 09:42 AM | Reply

Both sides cheating does not make this election accurate.

#44 | Posted by BillJohnson

I ask my Congressman to show us the cheating, BILL. He won't, because he can't. You're not him, are you?

#46 | Posted by Zed at 2020-12-07 10:08 AM | Reply

Both sides cheating does not make this election accurate.

#44 | Posted by BillJohnson

The cheating has come ex post facto, from Trump. What the man continues to do amounts to a coup attempt. That it is incompetently waged is no reason not to fear it. Ted Cruz is a smarter snake than Donald. He's paying attention.

#47 | Posted by Zed at 2020-12-07 10:10 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

However, he should never concede so the topic of mail-in ballots will continue to reverberate in the media.

#12 | POSTED BY BILLJOHNSON

What an idiot.

#48 | Posted by jpw at 2020-12-07 12:02 PM | Reply

Voting is a precious right and we must do what is required to insure the election is accurate.

#44 | POSTED BY BILLJOHNSON

So does doing what we must include removing mail sorting machines from the post office and doing everything Trumpy could to slow down and disrupt the return of mail in ballots just before an election? During a frickin pandemic?

We pointed out all these problems long before the elections and tried to get congress to pass legislation to allocate the money needed make our elections safer and more accurate , especially during a pandemic, a pandemic that Republicans pretended didn't matter and that this administration denied even existed.

The time to correct these things is long before an election. Not during one.

You had plenty of time and warning before the elections. But Republicans refused.

Your faux rage is funny. And and sad.

But your tears are delicious.

You built that.

#49 | Posted by donnerboy at 2020-12-07 12:05 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Both sides cheating does not make this election accurate.

#44 | Posted by BillJohnson

Lets just say for the sake of argument that both sides did cheat.

By the Trumplandia rule of Translunification then that means the Democrats are the best cheaters in the land and so therefore are the naturally best choice for fixing a broken elections system. Since the Democrats are the best cheaters therefore only the Democrats can fix it!

Congratulations. You built that.

#50 | Posted by donnerboy at 2020-12-07 12:20 PM | Reply

Why hasn't there been ANY proof offered inside courtrooms? The lawyers for the Republicans have stipulated: NO FRAUD.
#35 | POSTED BY DANFORTH

You're never going to get an answer to this.

Never.

#51 | Posted by ClownShack at 2020-12-07 12:21 PM | Reply

"Both sides cheating does not make this election accurate."

That's not the point.

I was even giving you the benefit of the doubt; then I inserted math, which is Kryptonite to your theory. If, as you suggest (without a shred of proof), folks culled mail-in ballots, the only mathematical effect would be if one party culled them at a much greater rate than the other.

Your basic premise is: the opportunity is there, so people will take advantage of it. Are you actually suggesting one party cheated MUCH MORE than the other? Because your conclusion requires both the culling, AND the assumption Democrats are MUCH MORE inclined to cheat than Republicans, when frankly, the only vote fraud uncovered in recent memory was by Republicans in North Carolina. Even Kansas' Kris Kobach, after claiming he had "hundreds of cases" to file, spent four years and $4 million to get NINE convictions, and all from Western Kansas, which is about as Republican an area as there is in the country...and most of those were addled elderly folks who moved and forgot they'd already voted.

Ultimately, if you're going to assume one party cheated much more than the other, your conclusion should be that's the only reason the election wasn't even MORE of a blowout.

#52 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-12-07 01:54 PM | Reply

"it will become whoever builds the biggest army of foot soldiers gathering ballots from homes."

FFS, you can't commit a fraud with four people without one of them posting something on Facebook.

In addition, you'd be having a schitt-ton of people coming forward right now (Republicans) claiming a family member took their ballot, and possibly voted a different way than they wanted. The fact NO ONE has come forward stating as much should tell you something.

#53 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-12-07 01:58 PM | Reply

one thing's for sure...If I was Mr. Biden,
I would INSIST that the White House staff
burn the old bedroom mattresses and buy all
new ones. Take the drapes with them too.
They gotta stink like corruption also...

#54 | Posted by earthmuse at 2020-12-07 02:06 PM | Reply

Bill, just making the assertion that cheating took place doesn't mean it really did.

The seriousness of the charge is not evidence.

We need to be narrowing our discussion of this issue to what EVIDENCE that's been discovered can indicate cheating that impacted the results of this election. I say "results" rather than "result" because of every election we just settled......senate, house, state races, etc. Not just the POTUS.

Produce evidence or stop.

Now, in fairness if you're just saying "I believe..." which is what you seem to be saying then fine. I don't care...believe what you want.

You have no evidence.

#55 | Posted by eberly at 2020-12-07 02:32 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

It is my perception that the major news outlets are going through a period of mourning with the passing of Trump. Love him or hate him, they have relied on him so heavily for their content over the past five years that they don't seem to know what they will do without him. It's like they are going through the five stages of accepting death. Denial. Anger. Depression. Negotiation. Acceptance? It also makes me realize how much I blame the media, both conservative and liberal, for keeping Trump front and center in our thoughts so intensely over the past years. No matter what our politics, we have all been lead around on a leash by CNN, Fox, ABC, CBS, NBC, etc.

#56 | Posted by moder8 at 2020-12-07 02:33 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Trump isn't planning on going away, he's planning on continuing to try and dominate news cycles - this time pillorying anything and everything that Joe Biden tries to accomplish - while he demands that elected Republicans agree with him that Biden is an illegitimate President and the GOP is duty bound to oppose him on every issue or those who won't will suffer his wrath as well as traitors to Trumpism.

What's headed our way on January 20th is something we've never seen nor contemplated in our lifetimes. We're going to have an ex-President who'll both announce his 2024 campaign while declaring himself the legitimate leader in exile for the next four years - unless his legal problems slow him down - and he won't have any restrictions upon what he mainlines into media bloodstream. He'll be even more unhinged than he has been during his presidency.

Trump is in it for Trump and he doesn't who or how many will suffer as long as he gets what he wants.

#57 | Posted by tonyroma at 2020-12-07 02:45 PM | Reply

It all depends on what you think constitutes "cheating".

I say anyone who collected votes for other people or "assisted" friends and family in such a manner their vote was influenced or people had no privacy to cast a vote different from family members was a manner of "cheating" the system.

Voting should be anonymous and private. Any attempt to circumvent those basic requirements is a form of "cheating".

#58 | Posted by BillJohnson at 2020-12-07 03:37 PM | Reply

#56

What you said. I'm so sick of the person, that horrific person. For the most I avoid talking about him. It's his cult members and his enablers who are the ones who deserve the scrutiny.

But I would love to talk about basically any other topic on Earth.

#59 | Posted by bocaink at 2020-12-07 03:37 PM | Reply

"Voting should be anonymous and private."

Anonymous.
How exactly would that work...

Think, BillJohnson, about why it's not anonymous. Think about why your party clamors for Voter ID.

#60 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-12-07 03:55 PM | Reply

What's Bill's theory?

One group collected millions and millions of mail in ballots and voted for Biden, but didn't vote for down ballot Democrats?

Millions and millions of people willingly gave up their mail in ballots, but no one came forward to admit they were asked to participate? No family or friends leaked information of those participating? None of them?

It was just brilliantly planned out and none of Trump's lawyers or investigators were able to discover anything, despite all the fraud?

Bill probably believes the entire world in pretending Covid is real in order to hurt Trump as well.

#61 | Posted by ClownShack at 2020-12-07 04:29 PM | Reply | Funny: 1 | Newsworthy 2

#60 -- voting is anonymous. With mail in voting all of the identifying information is on the outside of the envelope and separated from the ballot before they are counted. There is no way to later unify them. With in-person voting you identify yourself before the ballot is provided and then you turn it in to a locked box where nobody sees what your choices were. We slid ours out of a colored sleeve into the box. Nobody at my polling place knows what bubbles I filled.

#62 | Posted by justagirl_idaho at 2020-12-07 04:54 PM | Reply

Clown,

I believe you're a troll who needs to get a life.

How's that.

#63 | Posted by BillJohnson at 2020-12-07 06:44 PM | Reply

there's a procedure for sick puppies, it's called The Needle. Wrap him up, softly & gently, in an old towel, and put him out of his (and OUR) misery! LOL

#64 | Posted by earthworm at 2020-12-07 06:53 PM | Reply

Snoofy,

"about why it's not anonymous"

It is where I vote.

I might show an id, but once I vote there is no connection between my identity and my vote.

Voting methods that don't preserve your anonymity are likely being phased out.

#65 | Posted by BillJohnson at 2020-12-07 07:36 PM | Reply

I might show an id, but once I vote there is no connection between my identity and my vote.

So your ballot is anonymous, but the fact that you voted is not. Kinda like using the mail.

#66 | Posted by REDIAL at 2020-12-07 07:45 PM | Reply

If we have to put up with the EC and the risks it entails, we also have to put up with mail in voting and the risks it entails.

Deal with it and move on.

#67 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2020-12-07 08:02 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Hey Trumptards, you're President,
never mine...

www.alternet.org

#68 | Posted by earthmuse at 2020-12-07 08:13 PM | Reply

I believe you're a troll who needs to get a life.
#63 | POSTED BY BILLJOHNSON

You also believe mail in voter fraud is why Trump lost.

You have zero evidence for either statement.

You only come here to attack posters and liberals while pretending you're a victim.

You're the troll.

#69 | Posted by ClownShack at 2020-12-07 08:59 PM | Reply

Jeff Tiedrich
@itsJeffTiedrich

remember when we said that we all had to vote for Biden in numbers so great that Trump couldn't steal the election? the bulls**t going on right now is exactly what the ---- we were talking about


Thank goodness.

#70 | Posted by ClownShack at 2020-12-07 09:21 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

What's headed our way on January 20th is something we've never seen nor contemplated in our lifetimes. We're going to have an ex-President who'll both announce his 2024 campaign while declaring himself the legitimate leader in exile for the next four years

What to know how we become Valenzuela? It's not socialism like the Right insists, but what I have highlighted above from Tony.

#71 | Posted by brass30 at 2020-12-07 10:31 PM | Reply

I think the mail in ballot theory goes something like this for the Right:

Millions and millions of ballots were printed illegally......with the vote checked from Biden. Down ballot, it was totally random.

These ballots were dropped off in suitcases and then fed to the readers to tabulate votes when no one was looking.

Hence the "spike" you saw at night...........while mostly everyone slept.

#72 | Posted by brass30 at 2020-12-07 10:34 PM | Reply

"What to know how we become Valenzuela?"

Pitch for the Dodgers?

#73 | Posted by Danforth at 2020-12-07 10:48 PM | Reply | Funny: 4

I might show an id, but once I vote there is no connection between my identity and my vote.
#65 | POSTED BY BILLJOHNSON

Same with a mail-in ballot.

Do you really think there was a problem when I dropped off my ballot with the poll workers at the public library?

#74 | Posted by snoofy at 2020-12-08 12:39 AM | Reply

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