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Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Sunday, July 18, 2021

Zachary B. Wolf: Summer is only halfway done, but the carefree Covid season is over. Case numbers and hospitalizations are up. Vaccinations are down and the US government has labeled vaccine misinformation a "serious threat to public health."

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Thank you, Republicans.

#1 | Posted by Zed at 2021-07-18 10:44 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

Eh, why shouldn't I be carefree at this point? Chances are very good I won't get it, if I get it, chances are it'll be mild, and if I get it and transmit it, chances are it'll just be to some antivaxxer idiot who will get very sick.

Yeah, I'll still wear a mask in the grocery. I'll still avoid eating indoors at restaurants. But the vaccine is available to everyone over 12 in the US, for free, and they're taking walk-ins at Kroger now.

No, I'll worry again when there's a new variant that's better getting through the vaccine than delta, but until then I'm sticking with carefree.

#GetVaccinated

#2 | Posted by DarkVader at 2021-07-18 01:51 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

^
I'm at the same point

I am having significant difficulty feeling any sympathy for these Kid Rock "conservatives".

#3 | Posted by ChiefTutMoses at 2021-07-18 02:02 PM | Reply

Same here.

I live in Florida.
I just ordered food online, went up to the restaurant to pick it up.
Wearing a mask I went in, and it was elbow to elbow, no masks.
I picked up my food and immediately left.

There's no mystery as to why Florida's number 1 in the Nation for COVID infections, and #3 in new infections per capita, falling just behind Missouri and Arkansas. Not with Governor DeathSenence.

You want to see something that looks bad? Click the "Forecast" button and then move the slider over. Florida turns BLACK by the end of this month:
www.mayoclinic.org

#4 | Posted by YAV at 2021-07-18 03:02 PM | Reply

Good. I'm vaccinated as are all the members of my family. We're going to Michigan next month to go to the beach for a week. Michigan Governorlicious Whitmer told me sick Trumpers are avoiding the beach in favor of the ER this summer. Fine with me ...

#5 | Posted by catdog at 2021-07-18 03:06 PM | Reply

We are seeing way too many breakthrough infections to be carefree, even with a vaccine.

Like Zed said, thanks you stupid animal low-life, POS, less than dirt Republicans.

#6 | Posted by bocaink at 2021-07-18 06:23 PM | Reply

The hostility towards those in the US not choosing to be vaccinated is pretty scary. It seems the entire fear you have is around variants caused by people that don't vaccinate. If this is your fear, then your best course of action would be demanding a government travel ban for international flights and sealing the southern border as these variants have a 10x+ higher chance of originating in other countries and then migrating here like the delta variant did (originated in India in 2020). Internationally, you have way higher than 10x the population of the unvaccinated population here - maybe closer to 50x and hence, it is 50x higher likelihood that the variant would originate there. Further, even having the vaccine does not stop you from becoming a petri dish in which variants can occur - look no further than the Yankees, Texas Dems on the run, or Bill Mahr. All vaccinated and yet still being a potential source of a covid variant. So - are you demanding that the borders be sealed? If you are not, then you just want to hate other Americans because you don't like the choice they are making with their bodies. You are no different than abortion zealots.

#7 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-18 11:36 PM | Reply

"#7 | POSTED BY EBAYREPAIR"

I should note that I am an expat living outside the US now. I am not trying to avoid the vaccine but it has not been made available to me yet. This is actually a point where I am deeply disappointed in Biden. Other countries are making the vaccine available through their embassies and consulates (such as the French, etc) but the US will not do the same. So, they have a huge excess of vaccine in the US but they donate to other countries rather than trying to vaccinate their citizens abroad. It is an epic fail on the part of Biden. I am expected to pay US taxes but not derive the benefits of being a citizen - all the while you are handing out free money like candy and giving away the vaccines we would willing pay for. Very disappointed in the US government.

#8 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-18 11:47 PM | Reply

FYI: The Delta variant originated in India in December 2020 before India started vaccinating anyone:

ourworldindata.org

#10 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-07-19 08:00 AM | Reply

I am expected to pay US taxes but not derive the benefits of being a citizen - all the while you are handing out free money like candy and giving away the vaccines we would willing pay for. Very disappointed in the US government.

#8 | POSTED BY EBAYREPAIR

Hang on. Trump will be back in August. That's two weeks.

#12 | Posted by Zed at 2021-07-19 08:18 AM | Reply

The hostility towards those in the US not choosing to be vaccinated is pretty scary.

#7 | POSTED BY EBAYREPAIR AT 2021

Why? No one is proposing harm to them. It's just being pointed out that they are choosing to die.

#13 | Posted by Zed at 2021-07-19 08:20 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Only 2.4% will die at best.

#14 | POSTED BY FSUKNOWIT AT 2

You have this Trump neon blinking above your head. Just saying.

What is 2.3% of the 73 million unvaccinated?

Bloody-minded idiot.

#15 | Posted by Zed at 2021-07-19 08:27 AM | Reply

giving away the vaccines we would willing pay for.

#8 | POSTED BY EBAYREPAIR

If these people won't get one for free that why do you think they'd get one for paying a fee?

#16 | Posted by Zed at 2021-07-19 08:30 AM | Reply

I'm rooting for Covid19.

#14 | POSTED BY FSUKNOWIT A

Well of course you are, you Trumpite bastard.

Go beat your wife, she's wondering what happened to you.

#17 | Posted by Zed at 2021-07-19 08:32 AM | Reply

mobile.twitter.com
#11 | POSTED BY FSUKNOWIT

Yes, I looked at that thread when you posted it the other day. From an article in the thread (from a site where Dr. Robert Malone is an advisor) that is looking at trends in Israel, which has one of the highest vaccination rates in the world:

But what about hospitalization numbers and deaths? One would expect the hospitalized rate to be significantly higher for the unvaccinated than the vaccinated. According to the data set herein, the total number of hospitalizations is slightly higher in the vaccinated. Is this due to the potency of the Delta variant or waning immunity from the vaccine? Could this be linked to vaccine-induced Antibody-Dependent Enhancement? This is something many vaccine experts wary of fast-tracked mRNA-based vaccines predicted could be a factor. Could this be a small difference now (with smaller numbers) yet lead to worsening numbers in forthcoming seasons?

TrialSite finds the data a bit concerning and suggests it justifies a close watch. No severe conclusions can be drawn at this point. Some items that should be considered with the data is the relatively small sample size since Israel still has a low case count, an even lower hospitalization count, with an almost non-existent death rate. The cases are growing though, so this could change in the forthcoming weeks.

The other element here is that Israel experienced a high infection rate before their mass vaccine rollout. Here, it is possible that a sizable percentage of the unvaccinated cohort is protected by natural immunity. Thus, many of the recovered COVID-19 patients may not feel a need to take a vaccine since they already have natural protection. If that is indeed occurring, the comparable numbers of vaccinated and unvaccinated cases could perhaps just confirm that natural immunity and vaccine-derived immunity provide similar levels of protection. The key is to remain open-minded to the myriad scenarios. But regardless, the data points coming out of Israel should prompt concern with more intensified monitoring of what unfolds over the next weeks.


trialsitenews.com

Basically, it's too soon to jump to any conclusions.

#18 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-07-19 08:37 AM | Reply

mobile.twitter.com
#11 | POSTED BY FSUKNOWIT

From that link:

Something really odd is going on:

In Europe we are seeing surges at many places where most of the population has already been vaccinated.

At the same time, the 15 least vaccinated countries dont seem to face any problem.

At some point, denying this problem will get painful.


If that trend were to follow here in the US, wouldn't that mean that the more unvaccinated states in the US wouldn't be seeing surges now and that the more vaccinated states would be? Is it just a matter of time before the more vaccinated states get more covid cases than the less vaccinated states, according to this projection?

#19 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-07-19 08:44 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"Considering that highly vaccinated states still have 40% unvaccinated...yes, it's only a matter of time before this starts moving through vaccinated states.
the difference between these states is around 10% points."

Yes, I agree. I'm bracing for a significant uptick in cases here in NY and in the NE in general. My question for FSUKNOWIT specifically had to do with the link s/he cited and I quoted in #19 regarding covid cases in Europe.

#22 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-07-19 08:58 AM | Reply

99% of Covid deaths were unvaccinated. Morticians thank the anti-vaxxers for their service.

#23 | Posted by bored at 2021-07-19 09:21 AM | Reply

There is no reason why you shouldn't be carefree.

There are vaccines available if you want them...so...carefree

If you don't want them you're likely not worried about COVID...so again carefree.

Here in Germany the focus has always been on reducing the caseloads. Now the government is switching to a more reasonable approach and focusing less on the number of cases and more on the number of hospitalizations. And even then, if you're a westerner and you wind up in the hospital due to COVID...it's pretty much your own fault.

#24 | Posted by madbomber at 2021-07-19 10:11 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

"Wearing a mask I went in, and it was elbow to elbow, no masks. I picked up my food and immediately left."

If you're concerned about it, you probably shouldn't go out.

I spent the last week and a half in Vegas. The only place that masks are required is the airport and medical facilities. So if you find a lack of masks intimidating, you should avoid Las Vegas at all costs.

#25 | Posted by madbomber at 2021-07-19 10:14 AM | Reply

Gal, regarding the link and Dr. Robert Malone, who by the way claims he was The One that invented mRNA vaccination (a claim not backed up by facts), and who cited a person that is unknown, but had some interesting data?

I also looked into it. The per capita rates of infection are for the entire country, and none of the data IIRC was broken down between vaccinated and unvaccinated. Then the criteria were applied at times when it wasn't appropriate to draw conclusions. This is where the data we have in the US is superior to what was presented in the RT Malone did. In the RT, the breakdown of a country's unvaccinated versus the per capita number was never shown, so you couldn't draw a conclusion about who was getting infected. Was it unvaccinated? Vaccinated? Both? If both, what's the ratio?

The more I looked the worse it got.

In short, I found the "analysis" inconsistent, undisciplined, and it drew conclusions that weren't backed up by the data.

It was the equivalent of "meaningless sums" in mathematics. It was bad enough for me to doubt Malone's abilities these days, or at the very least his motivations for posting such data at all.

#26 | Posted by YAV at 2021-07-19 11:52 AM | Reply

"the ongoing mass vaccination experiment drives a rapid evolutionary response of SARS-CoV-2"

This is the third coronavuris outbreak in a dozen years.

LOL

#29 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-07-19 06:43 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

Yawn. So happy I'm escaping the madness of
America in a couple of weeks. Have my masks, passports, and euros packed. Cant wait to get to Ireland and get out of the heat and dysfunction that is home, if only for a bit.

#30 | Posted by earthmuse at 2021-07-19 09:49 PM | Reply

#27, #28 - Do you not read this ---- and think "Hm. That was beyond hyperbole, perhaps I should be a bit more critical of what I'm reading?"

"If that thread is followed they are discussing countries with very high and rapid vaccination compliance and how there is a massive surge among them. It doesn't seem to make sense if the vaccine works as advertised. That's what is perplexing and alarming."

A massive surge in those that are unvaccinated getting it. Just like the U.S. is experiencing. When I went through it they never broke down those that were getting infected and vaccinated against those that were getting infected and not vaccinated. They played the "per capita" game and then applied it to the entire population without differentiation.

Take Florida at 29 cases per 100,000. What's the percentage of people vaccinated in Florida? 47.8%, or 10.3M people. There are 21.9M people in FL. What's the per capita number of people not vaccinated? 52,968. Compare that number to 29. There is a LOT of headroom for infections to grow and that per capita number of those getting infected to rise without touching those that are vaccinated.

Without specifically delineating the line between those that are vaccinated and getting infected from those that are getting infected and not vaccinated in the per capita number, trying to apply the per capita to a general population to make the case that the vaccine isn't effective is meaningless.

BTW, we know that there have been approximately 5,000 hospitalizations and about 1,000 deaths in the United States of people that were vaccinated. This is far, far lower than that of those that are unvaccinated.

Also Snoofy's right on with his #29.

#31 | Posted by YAV at 2021-07-19 10:43 PM | Reply

Yav,

What say you about the articles FSU linked to that talk about mass vaccinations leading to more variants and eventually to super variants that will be resistant to all vaccines?:

www.geertvandenbossche.org

www.geertvandenbossche.org

I tried to read them but they were above my paygrade and I got lost in the details. The basic gist I got from them was that just as overuse of antibiotics can lead to bacteria resistant to all antibiotics, mass vaccinations will lead to variants resistant to vaccines. (The analogy to bacteria and antibiotics is mine; the articles don't make that comparison.)

#32 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-07-19 11:06 PM | Reply

What say you about the articles FSU linked to that talk about mass vaccinations leading to more variants and eventually to super variants that will be resistant to all vaccines?:

What do I say?

Polio.
Small Pox.
MMR
Meningitis B.

Vaccines can be incredibly effective, and we've even stamped out some viruses completely.

Super variants? 1918 flu. There was no vaccine, and we got one killer influenza virus. In fact this SARS-CoV-2 didn't come about as the result of vaccinations. Swine flue mutated via an animal host for decades before breaking out.

Also, bacteria are not viruses.
The way we conquered bacterial infections is through hygiene, cleanliness, prophylactics, antibiotics, etc. but bacteria are ubiquitous. Bacteria reproduce on their own.

For a virus to survive it needs a host. It can't reproduce without one. That's why the R0 number is critical. If the R0 drops below 1 the virus burns itself out. It may go into an animal host for years or decades, and reemerge, but they just don't function the say bacteria do.

This doesn't mean that the mutations in the virus won't develop that allow the virus to infect a vaccinated host, especially if we don't have a concerted effort like we do with other viral diseases. That is always a possibility.

But the Alpha and Delta variants didn't arise out of vaccinated populations. So far there's no evidence to support the conjecture at this point.

If the SARS-CoV-2 ends up acting more like an influenza virus then we will be living with this for a long time and with perhaps annual reformulations of the vaccine. That is one possible direction.

My 2 cents.

#33 | Posted by YAV at 2021-07-19 11:36 PM | Reply

"Also, bacteria are not viruses."

Yes, I know that. As I said, the analogy was mine and meant as a general comparison on principle. The principle being that too much of a good thing can end up being a bad thing, which was my layman's take on what I took to be the article's underlying point: mass vaccination can lead to bigger problems, i.e., a super vaccine resistant variant.

"But the Alpha and Delta variants didn't arise out of vaccinated populations."

Yes, that was a point I made to FSU about Delta developing in India before they started vaccinating anybody.

#34 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-07-19 11:49 PM | Reply

"mass vaccination can lead to bigger problems, i.e., a super vaccine resistant variant."

It could be like if you don't take all your antibiotics, it develops resistance. But at a population level.

If the population doesn't take enough vaccines to get R0 below one, it develops resistance. Something like that.

"Delta developing in India before they started vaccinating anybody."

Something like that.

#35 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-07-19 11:57 PM | Reply

PS I had to look up ADE/Antibody-dependent enhancement, which was a term used, but like I said, above my paygrade.

#36 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-07-19 11:57 PM | Reply

The analogy is not bad, Gal, but it breaks down a bit because bacterial reproduction (there are like 5 different ways bacteria reproduce, but we're only going to consider the applicable process) can pass on the mutated version to "offspring." There is inheritance with bacteria. This is particularly the mechanism that is causing so much trouble with antibiotic resistance.

Viruses just can't do that. The variant itself has to stand on its own, and then through reproduction through the host, make more of itself. It can't share the successful adaptation.

Does that make sense?

#37 | Posted by YAV at 2021-07-19 11:58 PM | Reply

Gal - RE: ADE and something that's understandable this isn't bad and it covers a lot of what seems to be at issue:
www.medpagetoday.com

#38 | Posted by YAV at 2021-07-20 12:07 AM | Reply

Thanks, guys, for all the info/feedback. I'm going to bed now but will come back to this thread tomorrow when I am less tired and hopefully can follow along a little better.

#39 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-07-20 12:10 AM | Reply

The hostility towards those in the US not choosing to be vaccinated is pretty scary.
#7 | Posted by ebayrepair

"Wahhhh why can't I continue to help a pandemic spread and mutate and not have people be mad at meeeeeeee?"

#40 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-07-20 12:35 AM | Reply

"It can't share the successful adaptation."

It can't.

We do.

This virus plays a record that has to skip for it to work. There's a skip somewhere around the 10th beat. JPW knows what I'm talking about.

The ability to cut up a beat makes hip-hop an art form.

So, only one person has to develop Delta. Just like only one person had to get SARS, or MERS, or SARS-CoV-2.

The lineage is updated daily with clinical isolates daily on Pangolin and Nextclade. This process is called surveillance. Public Health are The Police.

We Are Spirits In The Material World.

Viruses are the Ghost In The Machine.

#41 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-07-20 12:42 AM | Reply

If this is your fear, then your best course of action would be demanding a government travel ban for international flights and sealing the southern border as these variants have a 10x+ higher chance of originating in other countries and then migrating here like the delta variant did (originated in India in 2020).

Except that some mutations found in delta have independently arose in multiple locations.

What makes delta so bad is that it has a combination of mutations not seen anywhere else.

#42 | Posted by jpw at 2021-07-20 12:44 AM | Reply

The hostility towards those in the US not choosing to be vaccinated is pretty scary.
#7 | POSTED BY EBAYREPAIR

Then go get a gun ^H^H^H vaccine and protect them ^H^H^H^H yourself.

#43 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-07-20 12:45 AM | Reply

#25 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER

Cool.

Do you have any other irrelevant anecdotes to share with us?

#44 | Posted by jpw at 2021-07-20 12:48 AM | Reply

"Except that some mutations found in delta have independently arose in multiple locations.
#42 | POSTED BY JPW"

Your comments does not address my argument. If unvaccinated populations are the most likely place for variants to arise, then the variants are 50x more likely to arise outside of the US than in it. Given that is a fact, then the much bigger risk to the US is from a variant arising outside the US and then being let into the country by international travelers. This is the same as the original response to covid. Those countries that 100% shut down their borders, were able to control covid (Vietnam, Japan, SK, Singapore, Taiwan, etc). Even now, their issues are arising due to opening for international travel. So, do you support controlling the border to stop this from occurring?

#45 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 12:52 AM | Reply

But the Alpha and Delta variants didn't arise out of vaccinated populations.

IIRC both arose prior to vaccines being available.

Anybody pointing to vaccines driving variant development is trying to sell you a bad bag of goods.

Variants arise to counter immunity, and viruses don't know whether said immunity is from a vaccine or infection.

#46 | Posted by jpw at 2021-07-20 12:54 AM | Reply

"So, do you support controlling the border to stop this from occurring?"

You must think we're stupid.

How do you propose controlling the border, and why didn't Trump do it?

#47 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-07-20 12:55 AM | Reply

#46 immunity. Well said.

#48 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-07-20 12:56 AM | Reply

"How do you propose controlling the border, and why didn't Trump do it?
#47 | POSTED BY SNOOFY"

You stop all international flights and land crossings. Taiwan did it. SK did it. Vietnam did it. Singapore did it. What makes the US incapable of doing it? Without this step, the next international variant of covid will make its way to the US and could very well undermine all the progress made by vaccines.

#49 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 01:01 AM | Reply

#37 | POSTED BY YAV

Viruses have evolved to have a certain degree of mutation during every replication cycle to get around that issue.

The progeny virions released from a host cell are more a cloud of variants than a single version. That "cloud" is called a quasispecies.

Different viruses have different sized clouds.

Luckily SARS-CoV-2 us about 1%.

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

In a more extreme example such as HIV you have, statistically, a change at every position in the genome per replication cycle.

#50 | Posted by jpw at 2021-07-20 01:05 AM | Reply

"You stop all international flights and land crossings"

Now where's that wall?

Have you seen America? You're not stopping an infectious from getting across these borders.

Ask the people who've been here for over 500 years if you don't get it.

#51 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-07-20 01:06 AM | Reply

"What makes the US incapable of doing it?"

It's already here.

What made Trump incapable of doing it?

#52 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-07-20 01:08 AM | Reply

Your comments does not address my argument.

Yes it does.

Mutations found in delta have independently evolved in multiple locations.

In any case I do support requirements for entry, ie testing and/or vaccination records.

#53 | Posted by jpw at 2021-07-20 01:15 AM | Reply

I'm out kids.

Enjoy your evening.

#54 | Posted by jpw at 2021-07-20 01:17 AM | Reply

There is no political solution
To our troubled evolution
Have no faith in constitution
There is no bloody revolution

We are spirits in the material world

Our so called leaders speak
With words they try to jail ya
They subjugate the meek
But it's the rhetoric of failure

We are spirits in the material world

Where does the answer lie?
Hidden from day to day
Is it something we can buy?
There must be another way

We are spirits in the material world

#55 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-07-20 01:51 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"Ask the people who've been here for over 500 years if you don't get it.
#51 | POSTED BY SNOOFY"

If this is your belief, then your whining about the unvaccinated in the US is a fart in the wind.

#56 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 02:05 AM | Reply

Except that some mutations found in delta have independently arose in multiple locations.
What makes delta so bad is that it has a combination of mutations not seen anywhere else.

#42 | POSTED BY JPW AT 2021-07-20 12:44 AM | REPLY |

Fake doctor has been pilfering in the scientists documents again, I see. Damn janitors.

#57 | Posted by BellRinger at 2021-07-20 02:50 AM | Reply

Mutations found in delta have independently evolved in multiple locations.
In any case I do support requirements for entry, ie testing and/or vaccination records.

#53 | POSTED BY JPW AT 2021-07-20 01:15 AM

More from the fake doctor. Stay in school boys and girls. Copy & paste idiots like this end up in the gutter.

#58 | Posted by BellRinger at 2021-07-20 02:52 AM | Reply

You're not stopping an infectious from getting across these borders.

#51 | POSTED BY SNOOFY AT 2021-07-20 01:06 AM | FLAG:

I'm sorry. an infectious what?

#59 | Posted by BellRinger at 2021-07-20 02:53 AM | Reply

In a more extreme example such as HIV you have, statistically, a change at every position in the genome per replication cycle.

#50 | POSTED BY JPW AT 2021-07-20 01:05 AM | REPLY

LMAO. Fake doctor is getting serious with his google search.

#60 | Posted by BellRinger at 2021-07-20 02:56 AM | Reply

Without this step, the next international variant of covid will make its way to the US and could very well undermine all the progress made by vaccines.

#49 | Posted by ebayrepair

So will the morons who watch Fox News and won't get vaccinated.

A new deadly surge: COVID-19 infections soaring to crisis levels in regions of low vaccination

... hm, I wonder why? Oh, ya!! Because of morons who won't get vaccinated!

FOX News: Unvaccinated People Dying From COVID? So What? That's Their Choice!

E.R. Doctor writes Editorial BLASTING FOX: "One predictor of vaccine refusal is Fox News viewership"

#61 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY at 2021-07-20 03:26 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Fox has quietly implemented its own version of a vaccine passport while its top personalities attack them

Tucker Carlson has called the idea of vaccine passports the medical equivalent of "Jim Crow" laws. And other Fox News personalities have spent months both trafficking in anti-vaccine rhetoric and assailing the concept of showing proof of vaccination status.

But Fox Corporation, the right-wing talk channel's parent company, has quietly implemented the concept of a vaccine passport as workers slowly return back to the company's offices.

(Tucker Carlson's Fox News colleagues call out his dangerous anti-vaccination rhetoric)

Fox employees, including those who work at Fox News, received an email, obtained by CNN Business, from the company's Human Resources department in early June that said Fox had "developed a secure, voluntary way for employees to self-attest their vaccination status."

#62 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY at 2021-07-20 03:37 AM | Reply

"#61 | POSTED BY AMERICANUNITY"

That is a whole lot of words, but none of them address the argument. The chances of a variant occurring outside the US is 50x+ the odds of it occurring within the unvaccinated US population. Yet, you huff and puff about Fox News while not addressing the one issue that is 50x+ more effective in protecting the US from covid variants. Also, it should be noted vaccine hesitancy is high across all groups, especially the young, so your attack is entirely misplaced without even mentioning it has nothing to do with the argument I am making. If you are not for closing the border until covid is contained in the US, you are not serious about stopping covid so don't pretend to be.

#63 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 03:42 AM | Reply

Bulls***

If we get 80% vaccinated we can end this pandemic.

No point in sharing obvious scientific facts with you. You're too Fox News crazy. And ya, right now it's the Tucker Carlson's of Fox News spreading anti-vaccination bulls***.

While they're now requiring employees entering the building to prove they've been vaccinated.

#64 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY at 2021-07-20 03:46 AM | Reply

EBAY

You're part of the problem, not a part of the solution.

Why you right wing morons would rather believe idiots on Fox News than scientists is puzzling.

Guess there are simply a lot of very stupid people in America.

#65 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY at 2021-07-20 03:49 AM | Reply

Here, EBAY. You can spout your mindless opinions at an ER physician:

How Fox News Covid Vaccine Denialism Hurts My Patients

Dr. Rob Davidson: Right-wing Covid-19 denialism hit my community hard during the first surge. Now, we're seeing a new, dangerous anti-vaccine push from these same sources.

In many parts of the country, summer looks relatively normal and safe, thanks to wide acceptance of the Covid-19 vaccine. But that's not the case for areas that have low vaccination coverage. In those areas, cases are rising again. And as an emergency physician still battling Covid-19 in Michigan, I'm often frustrated by the way the news sources my community watches add fuel to these surges.

drudge.com

(I'll keep believing in science)

#66 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY at 2021-07-20 03:52 AM | Reply

"If we get 80% vaccinated we can end this pandemic.
#64 | POSTED BY AMERICANUNITY"

You are speaking in the US or globally? If in the US, we are probably at 80% of people now that have been vaccinated + have already had covid for people over 18.

Globally? We are probably at 5-10% tops. We are years away from global vaccination. And, it is a pretty good bet that in that time, there will be a variant that develops globally.

I will also note that England is 87% vaccinated with at least 1 dose, had huge case numbers before the vaccination push, and is currently in its 4th wave with 40-50k new cases per day almost reaching the peak from the 3rd wave so I would question your arbitrarily selected 80% number, and all of this is before taking into account the large number of positive covid cases in fully vaccinated people.

The reality is that the next covid variant will be imported to the US because we refuse to close our borders like a sane nation would do.

And again, why are you obsessing so much on Fox? Your level of fixation on this is worthy of a mental illness tag.

#67 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 03:54 AM | Reply

"Why you right wing morons would rather believe idiots on Fox News than scientists is puzzling.
#65 | POSTED BY AMERICANUNITY"

Again with the Fox News. Your song is so repetitive and boring, time to change the record. As for right wingers, Trump has 100% stated that people should get vaccinated and touts Warp Speed as a huge accomplishment of his administration. Even Tucker Carlson doesn't tell people not to get vaccinated, just that it is not a riskless proposition. I WANT the vaccine, but because Biden is an incompetent ---- compared to the French and others, I am not able to get it. However, I fully understand why some under 35 would choose not to get it, especially if they have already had covid or were planning to start a family.

Also, I believe that vaccines are great but I believe we will have a vaccine resistant variant appear way in advance of global herd immunity. So, I want the US to take sensible precautions to stop that international variant from making its way to the US and starting the whole process over again.

#68 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 04:01 AM | Reply

I'm talking science, you're spouting bulls***.

You're a prime example of why we're back to 58,000+ cases a day.

#69 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY at 2021-07-20 04:11 AM | Reply

"I'm talking science, you're spouting bulls***.
You're a prime example of why we're back to 58,000+ cases a day.
#69 | POSTED BY AMERICANUNITY"

No, you are showing your Fox News derangement. Did Tucker sleep with your wife or something?

If you want to actually address my argument, I would be happy to hear it. However, I don't expect you to be able to do that as it does not involve Fox News.

#70 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 04:15 AM | Reply

"You're a prime example of why we're back to 58,000+ cases a day.
#69 | POSTED BY AMERICANUNITY"

And again, for about the 3rd time on this thread, I am not in the US. I would happily take the vaccine were it available to for me like it is for expats of countries not run but corrupt geriatrics. So, how that makes me part of any problem makes no sense what so ever.

#71 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 04:17 AM | Reply

"Gal - RE: ADE and something that's understandable this isn't bad and it covers a lot of what seems to be at issue:
www.medpagetoday.com"

Yes, that was more understandable. TY Malone's claim is that we haven't seen ADE yet with the covid vaccine because:

This is a "self own" that vaccine durability is poor. It is during the waning phase of vaccine-induced immune response that the risk of ADE is highest. Evidence? you say? See Dengue vaccine development, ADE, and the risk associated with waning immunity. QED.
twitter.com

But from the article you linked to, it seems like the situation is/could be more complicated than that.

#72 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-07-20 07:37 AM | Reply

I'm a Christian and a conservative.
And I'm fully vaccinated.
Tons of people in my church are too.

The few that aren't won't ever get it, I estimate.

And although I don't regret getting vaccinated.

The manipulative rhetoric, the lotteries, the $100 incentives, the preachiness ...
If we Christians promoted the Gospel the way those afraid of COVID promote the vaccine, YOU ALL WOULD COMPLAIN for days, wouldn't you?

#73 | Posted by drivelikejehu at 2021-07-20 10:36 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Of course.
That you don't see why says a lot.

#74 | Posted by YAV at 2021-07-20 02:13 PM | Reply

If we Christians promoted the Gospel the way those afraid of COVID promote the vaccine, YOU ALL WOULD COMPLAIN for days, wouldn't you?

#73 | Posted by drivelikejehu

We're trying to end a pandemic you moron. Not bring more people into the world's oldest scam.

#75 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-07-20 02:35 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

As for right wingers, Trump has 100% stated that people should get vaccinated and touts Warp Speed as a huge accomplishment of his administration.

#68 | Posted by ebayrepair

Why did trump get vaccinated in secret, instead of in public like biden?

#76 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-07-20 02:52 PM | Reply

-Why did trump get vaccinated in secret, instead of in public like biden, Pence, GWB, and many many many republicans?

ft

#77 | Posted by eberly

Not willing to take a guess at the answer?

#78 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-07-20 03:31 PM | Reply

Where are the democrat leaders casting doubt on vaccine safety mr both sides?

#79 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-07-20 03:31 PM | Reply

You know, Eberly.
You just don't want to say.

#81 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-07-20 03:38 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

I haven't talked with Trump about this so I'm going to give you the only answer anybody can give....well, an honest answer.

I don't know.

#80 | Posted by eberly

HAha so the guy who claims to know everything about every other posters' personal lives and secret thoughts says he has NO IDEA why trump would get vaccinated in secret.

How precious.

#83 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-07-20 03:55 PM | Reply

#68 | POSTED BY EBAYREPAIR

Trump touted the vaccine once during an interview on Fox News.

#84 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2021-07-20 04:34 PM | Reply

-HAha so the guy who claims to know everything about every other posters' personal lives and secret thoughts says he has NO IDEA why trump would get vaccinated in secret.

I don't have any dialogue with Trump.....unlike open books such as you.

#85 | Posted by eberly

Your imagination isn't the same as reading a book.

You've had years, if not decades to observe trump and see how he works - yet you wont dare hazard a guess why he got vaccinated in secret.

You've never seen me on tv, met me, heard my voice, or know anything other than what I've told you - yet you claim to know everything about me and what my motivations are.

You say youre not a trump supporter but you twist yourself into pretzels to avoid saying anything bad about him and switch the topic to some false democrat equivalency.

#86 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-07-20 05:25 PM | Reply

only to irritate you. Not because I don't have one.

#87 | Posted by eberly

Yes, mustn't speak ill of dear leader. Otherwise you'll get the liz cheney treatment. Good little cult member. here's a cookie.

#88 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-07-20 05:31 PM | Reply

-but you twist yourself into pretzels

HAHA......sure. If I'm twisting it's because of laughter.

#89 | Posted by eberly

How sad is your life that your source of joy is saying things you don't really beleive on an obscure website in order to upset decent people?

That is the very definition of a troll.

#90 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-07-20 06:05 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Then stop taking to me, jackass

#91 | Posted by eberly

A troll admits to trolling and says its our fault for listening to him.

How long do you think you can go without getting kicked off the site like that?

#92 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-07-20 07:09 PM | Reply

LOL F all you retarded rodent people of the world that refuse to get the vaccine you're all going to crash and burn and watch everyone like you die as well LOL

I'm looking forward to the new human race Will Rise From the Ashes of such rubbish.

Idiocracy has been averted.

#94 | Posted by Tor at 2021-07-20 07:46 PM | Reply

"Why did trump get vaccinated in secret, instead of in public like biden?
#76 | POSTED BY SPEAKSOFTLY"

Trump already had covid so he had no need for the vaccine but at the time he took it, it was not available to the public so it comes off as a bit elitist to get it. As for Biden, he clearly does not even remember getting the vaccine as he said it did not even exist until he took power. The sad thing is that the liberals hate Trump so much, that they are trying to tie him to vaccine hesitancy when the truth is the exact opposite. As I posted above, Trump sees the success of Warp Speed as the crowning achievements of his administration. So, tying him in with hesitancy is a lie.

#95 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 08:03 PM | Reply

Trump already had covid so he had no need for the vaccine but at the time he took it, it was not available to the public so it comes off as a bit elitist to get it. As for Biden, he clearly does not even remember getting the vaccine as he said it did not even exist until he took power. The sad thing is that the liberals hate Trump so much, that they are trying to tie him to vaccine hesitancy when the truth is the exact opposite. As I posted above, Trump sees the success of Warp Speed as the crowning achievements of his administration. So, tying him in with hesitancy is a lie.

#95 | Posted by ebayrepair

It was already being taken by medical workers and other critical positions in january. The president certainly qualifies.

The sad thing is that repubs love trump so much that even when he does something like kill a half million americans with lies and incompetence you still give him the benefit of the doubt.

How many more people would have gotten the vaccine if trump openly got it, bragged about it, and promoted it?

Biden didn't say the vaccine didn't exist before he took office. If you have to lie about your opponent, you know you're losing the argument.

#96 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-07-20 08:11 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Warp speed describes how rapidly the 300 lb orange plague rat racked up 500,000 deaths.

#97 | Posted by reinheitsgebot at 2021-07-20 08:15 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"The sad thing is that repubs love trump so much that even when he does something like kill a half million americans with lies and incompetence you still give him the benefit of the doubt."
"#96 | POSTED BY SPEAKSOFTLY"

Trump came into covid, like the rest of the world, without any idea how deadly covid was, that it was airborne, and was saddled by poor CDC responses. Biden is walking into covid about 14 months into a pandemic with all the cumulative learnings. EVERY delta variant death from covid is 100% on him as he allowed it to infiltrate the US when he could have closed the borders but chose not to do so. I just hope Biden can keep his death toll under Trump's.

#98 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 08:18 PM | Reply

Trump came into covid, like the rest of the world, without any idea how deadly covid was, that it was airborne, and was saddled by poor CDC responses

#98 | Posted by ebayrepair

Funny he didn't say that. he said it was just the flu, maybe 15 people might die, and it would vanish in the summer. even though behind closed doors he was saying it was much worse than that. There are recordings.

He didn't care about saving lives. he cared about downplaying the virus and keeping the stock market and his poll numbers up. If he had to lie to the nation about a deadly pandemic, he was fine with that.

Still you give him the benefit of the doubt.

#99 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-07-20 08:29 PM | Reply

I just hope Biden can keep his death toll under Trump's.

#98 | Posted by ebayrepair

Every president in history has a lower death toll than trump. So that's not hard.

#100 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-07-20 08:30 PM | Reply

Unless you want to count worldwide. Dubya, your party's previous moron disaster president, might be responsible for more deaths all stemming from his obsessing with invading iraq.

But for american lives, trump holds the record. And when one of his moron followers attacks a city with some sort of WMD, that will add to trump's body count.

#101 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-07-20 08:31 PM | Reply

"Funny he didn't say that. he said it was just the flu, maybe 15 people might die, and it would vanish in the summer. even though behind closed doors he was saying it was much worse than that. There are recordings."

Yes, he was trying to stop a panic. I think it was the wrong move and more people died than should have died as a result.

"He didn't care about saving lives. he cared about downplaying the virus and keeping the stock market and his poll numbers up. If he had to lie to the nation about a deadly pandemic, he was fine with that.
#99 | POSTED BY SPEAKSOFTLY"

It was a trade off and I think it was the wrong one. He should have been more honest. In retrospect, it could have been that he knew Americans were incapable of having a Chinese style lockdown so they only way forward was to develop a vaccine as soon as possible. This is consistent with all of his actions.

Which takes us to Biden and what he does now, with the benefit of hindsight. Again, 100% of deaths attributed to the delta variant are on him. 100% of the economic and social disruption due to the delta variant is on him. Unfortunately, I see him repeating all the mistakes of Trump. I don't give Trump as pass on covid. But, it seems you are willing to do so for Biden. Why?

#102 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 08:58 PM | Reply

"Unless you want to count worldwide. Dubya, your party's previous moron disaster president, might be responsible for more deaths all stemming from his obsessing with invading iraq.
#101 | POSTED BY SPEAKSOFTLY"

I never voted for nor supported any of the Bush family nor did I support the invasion of Iraq or any foreign war for that matter. And if you want to look at international death tolls, FDR and his rescue of Stalin and the subsequent communist death count takes the cake hundreds of times over. You could also through in a few million under the libs for Vietnam.

#103 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 09:01 PM | Reply

Incel Scatberg, the delta variant emerged during the orange plague rat's disastrous presidency.

#104 | Posted by Reinheitsgebot at 2021-07-20 09:06 PM | Reply

"Incel Scatberg, the delta variant emerged during the orange plague rat's disastrous presidency.
#104 | POSTED BY REINHEITSGEBOT"

The delta variant was first discovered in India in Dec'2020. Now, we have the first cases of the lambda variant from Peru being detected in Texas...wonder how it go there? 100% of these deaths from the covid variants are on Joe Biden and the Dem refusal to close the borders.

#105 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 09:10 PM | Reply

Trump's epic failure killed more Americans than Hitler. You own that.

#106 | Posted by reinheitsgebot at 2021-07-20 09:13 PM | Reply

You could also through in a few million under the libs for Vietnam.

Except Eisenhower was a republican. Either way trying to compare political alignments from the 50-60's with today is a fools errand.

Again, 100% of deaths attributed to the delta variant are on him. 100% of the economic and social disruption due to the delta variant is on him.

For real? Because Biden isn't trying everything to get people vaccinated while republicans compare his efforts with the gestapo?

#107 | Posted by TaoWarrior at 2021-07-20 09:23 PM | Reply

Dem refusal to close the borders.

www.google.com

Right just twiddling their thumbs, wasn't it just a few weeks ago the meme was Biden was still locking kids up and detention facilities were overcrowded? Which VP was it that literally said don't come was that Pence? No? Oh yeah it was Harris.

#108 | Posted by TaoWarrior at 2021-07-20 09:33 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Trump already had covid so he had no need for the vaccine Whoa. That is not true. Even if you've had COVID-19 you still need to get vaccinated!

Now, we have the first cases of the lambda variant from Peru being detected in Texas...wonder how it go there?

Peru? I'd assume someone travelled to Peru and brought it back. We don't have Peruvians streaming across the border. You know Peru isn't Guatemala, Honduras, or El Salvador, right? Different continent...

#109 | Posted by YAV at 2021-07-20 09:37 PM | Reply

It was a trade off and I think it was the wrong one. He should have been more honest. In retrospect, it could have been that he knew Americans were incapable of having a Chinese style lockdown so they only way forward was to develop a vaccine as soon as possible. This is consistent with all of his actions.

Which takes us to Biden and what he does now, with the benefit of hindsight. Again, 100% of deaths attributed to the delta variant are on him. 100% of the economic and social disruption due to the delta variant is on him. Unfortunately, I see him repeating all the mistakes of Trump. I don't give Trump as pass on covid. But, it seems you are willing to do so for Biden. Why?

#102 | Posted by ebayrepair

If you care about honesty trump would be the last man on earth you'd ever support.

Biden cant make these morons get vaccinated. If he did then they'd attack him as a totalitarian tyrant. Frankly, I wish he would. But his cult would use it as a reason to start civil war 2.

These morons have PROVEN that people are too stupid to be truly free. The cost of living in a society is giving up some freedom. And getting vaccinated is not that tyrannical on any scale. You are not free to live in and benefit from society when you are not willing to do your part to protect that society's well being. Then you're just taking and not giving. Is that really what republicans are about now?

#110 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-07-20 09:37 PM | Reply

"For real? Because Biden isn't trying everything to get people vaccinated while republicans compare his efforts with the gestapo?
#107 | POSTED BY TAOWARRIOR"

Vaccinating is a half measure when the real risk for the US is a vaccine resistant variant arising overseas, where they have 50x+ the unvaccinated population. If you are not for closing the borders and enforcing a 21 day+ quarantine for all international visitors, you are not serious about stopping covid in the US.

#111 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 09:39 PM | Reply

"Vaccinating is a half measure when the real risk for the US is a vaccine resistant variant arising overseas, where they have 50x+ the unvaccinated population."

I'm not sure how this jives with folks on here who are saying that a vaccine resistant variant is most likely to develop in countries that have the most vaccinated populations.

#112 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-07-20 09:44 PM | Reply

#111 and #112 haven't heard either of those before but #111 is more correct more infections means more chances of mutation. If however we have say 70% vaccination then new cases can be caught quickly and new variants identified quickly so they can be rapidly quarantined. So I don't really see that as an excuse to not get vaccinated. In fact if you are worried about immigrants and visitors then even more reason to get vaccinated.

#112 So the argument is that if you get vaccinated against something that can kill you it might mutate into something that could kill you more effectively so best to just let the first version kill you?

#113 | Posted by TaoWarrior at 2021-07-20 09:56 PM | Reply

"If you are not for closing the borders and enforcing a 21 day+ quarantine"

I'm not aware of any political figure or public health expert who suggests this.

Did you just make this up?

#114 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-07-20 10:00 PM | Reply

"#111 and #112 haven't heard either of those before but #111 is more correct more infections means more chances of mutation. If however we have say 70% vaccination then new cases can be caught quickly and new variants identified quickly so they can be rapidly quarantined. So I don't really see that as an excuse to not get vaccinated.
#113 | POSTED BY TAOWARRIOR"

I have never said it was an excuse not to get vaccinated. As stated 4+ times now, I am 100% in support of people being vaccinated and if we did not have an incompetent geriatric running the country, I may be able to get vaccinated like the expats from France, etc are able to do now. My entire point here is that the greatest risk for the US is the fact that we are 100% incapable of stopping a foreign variant (see Delta + Lambda as examples 1 and 2) which is the real risk to the US vaccinated population. However, their focus is solely on demonizing the people in the US. Thereby, they focus on the small threat vs. something 50x+ greater. An uncontrolled border will be what causes the next wave of deadly pathogens in the US.

#115 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 10:05 PM | Reply

"#112 So the argument is that if you get vaccinated against something that can kill you it might mutate into something that could kill you more effectively so best to just let the first version kill you?"

Yes, checkout FSUKNOWIT's posts in this thread and follow the links in #11 and #28:

I'm going to spread the Covid. As an asymptomatic I'm going to spread it as far as I can. It's the vaccinated whom are the petri dishes breeding variants. They built this.
#9 | POSTED BY FSUKNOWIT

Good link provided by Yav in #38 that offers some pushback.

#116 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-07-20 10:06 PM | Reply

"I'm not aware of any political figure or public health expert who suggests this.
Did you just make this up?
#114 | POSTED BY SNOOFY"

It is the exact policy for every country that has successfully controlled the virus to date - Vietnam, Taiwan, SK, Singapore. You cannot have a porous border and expect to control the virus. For instance, Vietnam is now experiencing their first real shutdown with the 4th wave of corona virus due to Chinese illegally entering along with uncontrolled crossing of the Cambodia border (mainly Chinese again). When Vietnam controlled the border, they controlled covid.

#117 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 10:08 PM | Reply

"#112 So the argument is that if you get vaccinated against something that can kill you it might mutate into something that could kill you more effectively so best to just let the first version kill you?"

Also check out FSU's posts #109 and 129 in this thread:

The vaccine is dangerous because it only targets a certain spike protein. It does not make one sterile to covid. Soon covid will adapt and in a few months your vaccine will be worthless. It's artificially selecting against S spike. With so many Vaccinated able to be infected you can almost guarantee Covid will adapt. It's already been happening.
Delta variant to Delta+ variant to something worse.
#109 | POSTED BY FSUKNOWIT

Playing the short game with mass vaccinations. Enjoy the ride while it lasts because turbulence lies just ahead.
#129 | POSTED BY FSUKNOWIT

drudge.com

#118 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-07-20 10:11 PM | Reply

"It is the exact policy for every country that has successfully controlled the virus to date - Vietnam, Taiwan, SK, Singapore. You cannot have a porous border and expect to control the virus."

We have a porous border, and there's no way to change that.

That's why nobody in politics or public health is recommending what you suggest. They know it's impossible. Why don't you know that?

#119 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-07-20 10:14 PM | Reply

"We have a porous border, and there's no way to change that.
#119 | POSTED BY SNOOFY"

It is not impossible physically to do it. It is a political problem. Which is why all the deaths from variants are squarely on the Biden admin and Democrats in general.

#120 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 10:27 PM | Reply

Wouldn't shutting down the borders to prevent covid entry would require no one entering the country by any means? Not by land, not by sea, not by air. Or it would require those who do enter to be officially quarantined for two weeks to make sure they are truly covid free.

#121 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-07-20 10:32 PM | Reply

"Or it would require those who do enter to be officially quarantined for two weeks to make sure they are truly covid free.
#121 | POSTED BY GAL_TUESDAY"

Should be 21 days or more at a government controlled facility.

#122 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 10:38 PM | Reply

"It is not impossible physically to do it."

Yes it is.

#123 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-07-20 10:40 PM | Reply

"Should be 21 days or more at a government controlled facility."

Oh, wow, imagine the outrage. I mean if wearing a mask is too onerous and a loss of freedom to an authoritarian regime, imagine how some folks would take to being locked up in a govt facility for 3 weeks.

#124 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-07-20 10:45 PM | Reply

"Oh, wow, imagine the outrage. I mean if wearing a mask is too onerous and a loss of freedom to an authoritarian regime, imagine how some folks would take to being locked up in a govt facility for 3 weeks.
#124 | POSTED BY GAL_TUESDAY"

I think people would much rather have those that CHOOSE to travel internationally to have a 21 day quarantine rather than the entire country being locked down for another 18 months. Travel to Asia, they do exactly this.

#125 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 10:54 PM | Reply

"being locked up in a govt facility for 3 weeks."

One of my co-workers had to go to Vietnam to renew her visa.

She didn't quarantine in a government facility. She was in a hotel room for three weeks.

The government doesn't have the housung or the money or the manpower to quarantine people for three weeks. It's a pipe dream.

#126 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-07-20 11:32 PM | Reply

If you are not for closing the borders and enforcing a 21 day+ quarantine for all international visitors, you are not serious about stopping covid in the US.

#111 | Posted by ebayrepair

If you still think closing borders can stop diseases, you must not have access to information.

#127 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-07-20 11:40 PM | Reply

Simple minds need to think simple solutions work.

Simple minds should STFU about complicated things like pandemics.

#128 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-07-20 11:41 PM | Reply

"She didn't quarantine in a government facility. She was in a hotel room for three weeks.
The government doesn't have the housung or the money or the manpower to quarantine people for three weeks. It's a pipe dream.
#126 | POSTED BY SNOOFY"

The hotels in Vietnam are government authorized with access in and out controlled by the government, not the hotel staff. There is a limited number under this program and yes, it is highly controlled by the government. This program is available to those that choose to pay for it, otherwise, you go to the standard government run facilities. During the first wave, they commandeered a university and brought all inbound passengers there for 14+ days of quarantine. In short, you have no idea what you are talking about so stop spreading false stories.

#129 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 11:46 PM | Reply

"She didn't quarantine in a government facility. She was in a hotel room for three weeks.
The government doesn't have the housung or the money or the manpower to quarantine people for three weeks. It's a pipe dream.
#126 | POSTED BY SNOOFY"

The hotels in Vietnam are government authorized with access in and out controlled by the government, not the hotel staff. There is a limited number under this program and yes, it is highly controlled by the government. This program is available to those that choose to pay for it, otherwise, you go to the standard government run facilities. During the first wave, they commandeered a university and brought all inbound passengers there for 14+ days of quarantine. In short, you have no idea what you are talking about so stop spreading false stories.

#130 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 11:46 PM | Reply

"If you still think closing borders can stop diseases, you must not have access to information.
#127 | POSTED BY SPEAKSOFTLY"

If you think having an open border without quarantine requirements has no impact on the spread of disease, I question your sanity. Or, for that matter, ask you to explain why we still implement quarantine for pets and forbid people from transporting vegetables internationally or even within the US. Look to any international flight terminal, CA border patrols inside the state, Hawaii, etc.

In short, your position that shutting the border makes no impact is counteracted by all available science and common sense applied by humanity over thousands of years. Even the ancients were smart enough to form leper colonies but you just want to fling the doors open. Put some of that Biden blood on your hands too I guess.

#131 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 11:51 PM | Reply

LMAO. Fake doctor is getting serious with his google search.

#60 | POSTED BY BELLRINGER

You really are a pathetic f$%^.

I did HIV research for two years as an undergrad. It was my first experience handling a pathogen. You know, the start of my Pd.H. journey.

#132 | Posted by jpw at 2021-07-20 11:52 PM | Reply

Not a false story.

Another thing that isn't false is that Uncle Sam doesn't have the logistics capability to quarantine everyone who enters the USA for three weeks.

#133 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-07-20 11:53 PM | Reply

"#132 | POSTED BY JPW"

Can you comment on this? Sorry, it is a long clip.

rumble.com

#134 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 11:54 PM | Reply

so I would question your arbitrarily selected 80% number

It's not arbitrary.

The predicted threshold for herd immunity based on SARS-CoV-2 R0 is 70-80%.

And again, why are you obsessing so much on Fox? Your level of fixation on this is worthy of a mental illness tag.

#67 | POSTED BY EBAYREPAIR

Maybe because popular hosts on that network have supported Trump's downplaying of COVID from the beginning, have raised false anti-vaxx "concerns" and are just in general giant wastes of carbon?

Just a guess...

#135 | Posted by jpw at 2021-07-20 11:56 PM | Reply

"Not a false story."

It is a false story. You posted "The government doesn't have the housung or the money or the manpower to quarantine people for three weeks. It's a pipe dream."

This is a lie. They can and do despite being a poor, 3rd world country compared to the US. Here is the latest notice from the US Embassy.

vn.usembassy.gov

Again, stop spreading false stories. Fake news is dangerous.

#136 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-20 11:59 PM | Reply

"They can"

We can't.

#137 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-07-21 12:02 AM | Reply

Trump already had covid so he had no need for the vaccine but at the time he took it, it was not available to the public so it comes off as a bit elitist to get it.

That's some weak sauce right there.

Leadership is often times all about example.

Pulling up his sleeve on TV would have gone a long way to getting his cult to follow along and get vaccinated.

But he was too vested in downplaying COVID but too aware of its danger to do anything other than get vaccinated in secret.

#138 | Posted by jpw at 2021-07-21 12:04 AM | Reply

""They can"
We can't.
#137 | POSTED BY SNOOFY"

You are an American't. Sad.

#139 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-21 12:08 AM | Reply

The link in #136 shows Vietnam is doing a while lot more than simply have people quarantine upon arrival.

That wouldn't work here. Because mah freedumbs.

#140 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-07-21 12:11 AM | Reply

"#140 | POSTED BY SNOOFY"

If you can control international cases being imported, it is easy to control domestic cases via contract tracing. Contract tracing loses all meaning when you have a porous border as do shutdown order. Vietnam is now learning this the hard way after too many Chinese were able to sneak across the border and spread covid.

#141 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-21 12:16 AM | Reply

Trump came into covid, like the rest of the world, without any idea how deadly covid was, that it was airborne, and was saddled by poor CDC responses.

Nonsense. Woodward had him on tape admitting to knowing how serious it was.

Biden is walking into covid about 14 months into a pandemic with all the cumulative learnings.

Which is why he's pushing vaccination and enacting programs to pursue public outreach.

Much to the chagrin of Repubs looking for bumper sticker talking points.

EVERY delta variant death from covid is 100% on him as he allowed it to infiltrate the US when he could have closed the borders but chose not to do so. I just hope Biden can keep his death toll under Trump's.

#98 | POSTED BY EBAYREPAIR

Oh --------.

#142 | Posted by jpw at 2021-07-21 12:27 AM | Reply

"Trump came into covid, like the rest of the world, without any idea how deadly covid was"

There were two previous coronavirus outbreaks to draw reasonable inferences from.

Trump decided to use magical thinking instead.

#143 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-07-21 12:30 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

An uncontrolled border will be what causes the next wave of deadly pathogens in the US.

#115 | POSTED BY EBAYREPAIR

Interesting.

I would say our inability to learn obvious lessons will be what causes the next wave of deadly pathogens in the US.

#144 | Posted by jpw at 2021-07-21 12:32 AM | Reply

"If you can control international cases being imported ... too many Chinese were able to sneak across the border"

Oh I see. So Vietnam can't seal their border either.

#145 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-07-21 12:33 AM | Reply

Should be 21 days or more at a government controlled facility.

#122 | POSTED BY EBAYREPAIR

10-14 days would be more than enough, especially with testing.

Careful you don't let your fear let your authoritarian side slip...

#146 | Posted by jpw at 2021-07-21 12:34 AM | Reply

"I did HIV research for two years as an undergrad."

Not sure hanging out in bath houses counts...

(I only said that because I can't believe he let that one slide!)

#147 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-07-21 12:36 AM | Reply

Is there a part of that video you're interested in most?

I mean, I'm 7:00 or so in and I already laughed because anybody who was informed knew that we had decades of research into coronavirus vaccines guiding development of anti-SARS-CoV-2 vaccines.

#148 | Posted by jpw at 2021-07-21 12:50 AM | Reply

"I would say our inability to learn obvious lessons will be what causes the next wave of deadly pathogens in the US.
#144 | POSTED BY JPW"

And I would say the biggest lesson to be learned was the failure to immediately stop travel to/from the source of the outbreak. Covid could have been easily contained in China if that had been the goal of the CCP.

#149 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-21 12:50 AM | Reply

OK. With his ominous declaration of "we...made...SARS" at about 9:55 is it for me.

This guy is clearly clueless.

That ---- is laughably bad.

#150 | Posted by jpw at 2021-07-21 12:53 AM | Reply

#149 | POSTED BY EBAYREPAIR

Not really an option unless the US is the source of the outbreak.

BTW stopping travel from China wasn't going to be enough. They tried it. NYC was still seeded by strains from Europe.

#151 | Posted by jpw at 2021-07-21 12:54 AM | Reply

"#148 | POSTED BY JPW"

I watched straight through so I did not jot down timestamps. I guess my question would be on the claim Fauci was rejected from patenting mRNA vaccines/research previously and the general sense that all of this was in a lab for years.

#152 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-21 12:55 AM | Reply

"BTW stopping travel from China wasn't going to be enough. They tried it. NYC was still seeded by strains from Europe.
#151 | POSTED BY JPW"

Would have worked is 'the world' cut the travel links or at least insisted on a quarantine for travelers. It needs to be a global response. You cannot count on any single country being responsible enough to contain it.

Also, I read an article today on India - per their 'excess death' stats, covid likely killed 4m people there alone.

#153 | Posted by ebayrepair at 2021-07-21 12:59 AM | Reply

I don't know about Fauci trying to patent mRNA vaccine platforms. I stopped watching before getting there.

What is "all of this"? Coronaviruses? mRNA vaccine?

#154 | Posted by jpw at 2021-07-21 01:01 AM | Reply

Would have worked is 'the world' cut the travel links or at least insisted on a quarantine for travelers.

Sure. Once they're aware. Problem is we usually don't now until it's already spread a bit.

Also, I read an article today on India - per their 'excess death' stats, covid likely killed 4m people there alone.

#153 | POSTED BY EBAYREPAIR

That wouldn't surprise me one bit.

#155 | Posted by jpw at 2021-07-21 01:02 AM | Reply

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