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Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Monday, September 13, 2021

A woman who became the center of a harassment campaign against a Chicago hospital as QAnon supporters demanded they treat her COVID-19 diagnosis with ivermectin has died, according to reports.

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Hopefully the hospital bed goes to someone more deserving than she was.

#1 | Posted by HeeHaw at 2021-09-13 11:13 AM | Reply

Haha. Burn in Hell, loser.

#2 | Posted by LegallyYourDead at 2021-09-13 11:40 AM | Reply

This late q-tard made the big time.

www.sorryantivaxxer.com

#3 | Posted by reinheitsgebot at 2021-09-13 01:55 PM | Reply

"Veronica Wolski is known for her so-called, "People's Bridge," where she drops anti-vaccine disinformation leaflets off a bridge in Chicago."

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

#4 | Posted by Nixon at 2021-09-13 04:05 PM | Reply

So we have a woman that wanted to be treated with ivermectin and the hospital refused because giving ivermectin may not provide a benefit (studies show that it does) and they didn't want her to die. And now she is dead without ever receiving ivermectin. And Liberals are now crowing that they are happy she died after being denied the medicine? How does her dying prove your point? If anything, it proves that the standard care needs to change because it is not effective.

#5 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-13 08:51 PM | Reply | Funny: 2

"If anything, it proves that the standard care needs to change because it is not effective."

Hell no.
The standard of care is to get a vaccine.

The standard of your discourse needs to change. It is not effective.

#6 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-09-13 08:55 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"The standard of your discourse needs to change. It is not effective.
#6 | POSTED BY SNOOFY "

The standard of care after you have covid is to get the vaccine to treat it? Are you sure about that? Seems Joe Rogan beat covid in under 3 days and it did not require a vaccine. Seems like whatever he did was effective.

#7 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-13 08:59 PM | Reply | Funny: 2

"Seems Joe Rogan beat covid in under 3 days and it did not require a vaccine. Seems like whatever he did was effective."

I know people who beat COVID simply by staying at home, lying in bed, and getting plenty of fluids.
Seems like whatever they did was effective too.
Notably, not taking anti-parasite drugs like hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin.

She could have so easily lived, but instead chose to let her fear lead her to death.

Imagine if all those people who called the hospt8ial had called on her to get vaccinated instead. She's almost certainly still be alive.

But, deaths cults do death cult things.

#8 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-09-13 09:05 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"Notably, not taking anti-parasite drugs like hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin.
#8 | POSTED BY SNOOFY"

There is no effective therapeutic currently according to US doctors. Israeli doctors and those around the world have found different and made ivermectin a key part in that. Given ivermectin, at worse, does not provide a benefit, what case can be made for withholding it? Beyond politics and the stripping of the emergency use authorization for the vaccines, why are you so against letting people try something when your own side admits that it does not have effective therapeutics?

#9 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-13 09:09 PM | Reply | Funny: 2

"We immediately threw the kitchen sink at it"monoclonal antibodies, ivermectin, Z-Pak, prednisone, everything," Rogan said on Instagram last month, without clarifying whether or not he had received the vaccine.

Previously, Rogan told his listeners they had no need to get vaccinated unless they fell into a specifically "vulnerable" group. "If you're a healthy person, and you're exercising all the time, and you're young, and you're eating well, like, I don't think you need to worry about this," he said in April. He later walked those comments back, admitting, "I'm not a doctor, I'm a ------- moron."

www.thedailybeast.com

#10 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-09-13 09:10 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"There is no effective therapeutic currently according to US doctors."

^
That's why taking poison isn't generally thought to be a wise move when you're already sick with an incurable, untreatable disease.

"Israeli doctors and those around the world have found different and made ivermectin a key part in that."

Then why doesn't the Jersualem Post know about it?
www.jpost.com

#11 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-09-13 09:13 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Seems Joe Rogan beat covid in under 3 days and it did not require a vaccine.

He had access to monoclonal antibodies like trump.

#12 | Posted by Alexandrite at 2021-09-13 09:17 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

"Prof. Eli Schwartz, founder of the Center for Travel Medicine and Tropical Disease at Sheba, conducted a randomized, controlled, double-blinded trial from May 15, 2020, through the end of January 2021 to evaluate the effectiveness of ivermectin in reducing viral shedding among nonhospitalized patients with mild to moderate COVID-19." www.jpost.com

^
Was the dead anti-vaxxer a nonhospitalized patient with mild to moderate COVID-19?

"
"Our study shows first and foremost that ivermectin has antiviral activity," Schwartz said. "It also shows that there is almost a 100% chance that a person will be noninfectious in four to six days, which could lead to shortening isolation time for these people."

So it doesn't cure them. It makes them shed the virus faster when they are already in the process of shedding the virus normally. People who are dying from COVID-19 aren't shedding the virus; they are being overwhelmed by it.

"This could have a huge economic and social impact."

^
Notice what he does not say: That this could save lives.

Did you go to college, Skeptical? Seems like someone would have to invest a lot of time and money, to learn to be this dumb.

#13 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-09-13 09:18 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"That's why taking poison isn't generally thought to be a wise move when you're already sick with an incurable, untreatable disease.
#11 | POSTED BY SNOOFY "

Who is taking poison? The bulk of the world outside the US (since COVID) has viewed it as an almost miracle drug. To this day, it is a critical part of their therapeutic regime. But you would rather than people die for some reason than to try. Can you state with 100%R certainty that it does not work? If not, you have blood on your hands.

#14 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-13 09:23 PM | Reply | Funny: 2

Eli Schwartz claims 'Big Pharma' suppressed his research into Ivermectin, which vaccine deniers hail as a cure for COVID. In a conversation with Haaretz, however, he warns against using horse paste and supports vaccinations

Schwartz, who has strongly endorsed the vaccine, said that while he was skeptical his work is being shared on pro-horse paste groups, he has been contacted by people interested in taking Ivermectin instead of a COVID vaccine--a course of action he strongly opposes.

Asked about Schwartz's work, Prof. Eyal Leshem, the director of Sheba's Center for Travel Medicine and Tropical Diseases, said that while his former colleague has the right to promote his theories, Ivermectin should not be used clinically to treat COVID-19 until proven in peer-reviewed and reproducible published studies.

The current body of research is "not sufficient to recommend Ivermectin for treatment of COVID at this time," Leshem said, and people "should not use Ivermectin outside randomized, controlled clinical trials."


www.haaretz.com

#15 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-09-13 09:24 PM | Reply

"The bulk of the world outside the US (since COVID) has viewed it as an almost miracle drug."

They say that about rhinoceros horn and tiger penis too.

#16 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-09-13 09:32 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

If not, you have blood on your hands.
#14 | POSTED BY SKEPTICAL

This sort of hyperbole sounds familiar.

Any takers?

#17 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2021-09-13 09:32 PM | Reply

"Can you state with 100%R certainty that it does not work? If not, you have blood on your hands."

This woman killed herself.

She chose to listen to hear fear, and not common sense, and it cost her her life.

If she really wanted ivermectin, she should have gone to Israel. It's a free country. This is truculent ignorance in search of a whipping boy, and you have more blood on your hands than I ever will for encouraging it.

#18 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-09-13 09:35 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

So we have a woman that wanted to be treated with ivermectin and the hospital refused because giving ivermectin may not provide a benefit (studies show that it does) and they didn't want her to die.

The bold above is massively misleading. Take heed.

#19 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2021-09-13 09:38 PM | Reply

Unless skeptical has access to rogans medical records, (skeptical) skeptical doesn't know anything about severity, duration, or treatment

In other words

I am Skeptical of skepticals conclusions based on skepticals hinky association

#20 | Posted by ChiefTutMoses at 2021-09-13 09:38 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

#19, #20
Thanks for standing on that wall, both of you.
We do need you.

#21 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-09-13 09:39 PM | Reply

"So we have a woman that wanted to be treated with ivermectin and the hospital refused because giving ivermectin may not provide a benefit (studies show that it does) and they didn't want her to die. And now she is dead without ever receiving ivermectin."

By the time she was hospitalized, it would have been too late for ivermectin to help her even if you believe Schwartz's study of dozens of people to be valid (emphasis mine):

Schwartz said he began studying Ivermectin after several initial studies showed that the drug might hold promise. He tested it out on dozens of Israelis who were in the early stages of a COVID-19 infection.

According to a preprint paper summarizing his research, which he admits has not been duplicated or published in any peer-reviewed journals, patients who were dosed with Ivermectin experienced a lower viral load than peers who received a placebo.

Schwartz claimed that this means Ivermectin could significantly shorten recovery time, as well as the period in which patients are infectious, allowing them to exit isolation earlier.

#22 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-09-13 09:42 PM | Reply

"#15 | POSTED BY GAL_TUESDAY"

You do know that your epidemic of horse-paste related hospitalizations and deaths has already been debunked, correct? I ask as it seems to feature prominently in your posting. The case from Rolling Stone where gunshot victims were denied care because the bed were full of ivermectin overdoses was 100% debunked by the hospital itself. In the case of the Mississippi poison control calls, it was an intentional or unintentional misstatement of statistics and since been corrected.

Meanwhile, the NHS in the UK has just kicked off a large scale trial on the use of ivermectin. As the evidence for ivermectin efficacy grows and that of the vaccines continues to diminish (Pfizer under 50% per the new Mayo study vs. Delta), I think you, and the 'vaccine only crowd' will look back in a year and realize all those people you let die because your politics forced you to slow down the use of ivermectin. And those people dying will increasingly be fully vaccinated (as shown in Israel) which is why therapeutic development should always have been the focus of our research efforts.

#23 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-13 09:53 PM | Reply | Funny: 2

Could skepticals be Rogan himself?

Rogan does peddle supplements and other garbage to rubes, who to say he didn't invested and concoct this entire charade hoping to financially benefit

Why does skepticals keep implying people should get this to "try" as if it should be available without a prescription

Somethings up. Joe rogan is a dirt bag and this stinks to high heaven

#24 | Posted by ChiefTutMoses at 2021-09-13 09:54 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"Die because of politics"

Does this Qweef think she is addressing a group of physicians?

#25 | Posted by ChiefTutMoses at 2021-09-13 09:57 PM | Reply

"The bold above is massively misleading.
#19 | POSTED BY RSTYBEACH11"

Misleading how? I linked to the studies. The downside scenario is ivermectin does not help - there is zero evidence that it causes harm.

#26 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-13 10:06 PM | Reply | Funny: 2

Posted by Skeptical

Bless your heart.

You're just dumb as a bag of friggin' hammers.

#27 | Posted by Angrydad at 2021-09-13 10:10 PM | Reply

"Meanwhile, the NHS in the UK has just kicked off a large scale trial on the use of ivermectin."

Good. Large scale clinical trials are what is needed.

"As the evidence for ivermectin efficacy grows and that of the vaccines continues to diminish (Pfizer under 50% per the new Mayo study vs. Delta), I think you, and the 'vaccine only crowd' will look back in a year and realize all those people you let die because your politics forced you to slow down the use of ivermectin."

I'm not in a 'vaccine only crowd'. I'm in the 'clinically proven crowd'. For example, the monoclonal antibodies both Trump and Rogan took have been clinically proven to help covid patients.

"And those people dying will increasingly be fully vaccinated (as shown in Israel) which is why therapeutic development should always have been the focus of our research efforts. "

Therapeutic development is good. I'm all for it, not as a substitute for vaccinations but as an adjunct to them. Vaccinations have helped in NY state keep covid hospitalizations and deaths down among vaccinated patients. This might not always be the case as efficacy wanes over time and boosters are needed, but vaccinations have been the difference between NY state in the early days of the pandemic and NY state in recent weeks:

Vaccinated New Yorkers make up just 4% of COVID-19 infections so far this year, according to data provided by the New York State Department of Health. Unvaccinated people were 21 times as likely to be infected or hospitalized statewide. The trends offer another strong indication that the vaccines saved tens of thousands of people this year from severe disease.

Of the nearly 1.3 million COVID infections recorded in New York between January 1st and September 5th, just 58,030 involved breakthrough infections, where the virus thwarts a person's vaccine-backed immunity. The state health department recorded 4,585 hospitalizations among fully vaccinated people, while unvaccinated residents accounted for 97,244 emergency visits.

This breakdown would mean, so far this year, the shots reduced the chances of being infected or hospitalized by 95%, which is in line with the vaccine effectiveness measured in clinical trials.

The new data obtained by WNYC/Gothamist follows a study published last month by the New York Health Department and researchers from the University at Albany School of Public Health. It looked at COVID cases from May to July, as the delta variant went from causing fewer than 2% of cases to more than 80% in the New York region. Vaccination coverage increased from 40% to 65% over the same timeframe.


gothamist.com


#28 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-09-13 10:14 PM | Reply

"Misleading how? I linked to the studies."

You didn't link to anything, bonehead.

#29 | Posted by Angrydad at 2021-09-13 10:16 PM | Reply

"I ask as it seems to feature prominently in your posting."

Not really. You zeroed in on those quoted tweets in the article, because it allowed you to ignore the quotes I put forward that contracted your earlier posts.

#30 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-09-13 10:16 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

"Why does skepticals keep implying people should get this to "try" as if it should be available without a prescription
#24 | POSTED BY CHIEFTUTMOSES"

It should be available without a prescription. It is available without a prescription throughout much of the world. Let me guess, you are pro marijuana legalization but want to control ivermectin because 'reasons'. Probably also pro-Abortion because 'my body my choice' unless it applies to taking vaccines or ivermectin.

#31 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-13 10:22 PM | Reply | Funny: 2

#23 | POSTED BY SKEPTICAL AT

All you're doing is defending hillbillies buying animal de-wormers from the feed and seed and playing at being doctors.

You can't admit when you're being silly and stupid. You were dim-witted long before you got on the Trump bus and once you took your seat you became frankly decorticate.

#32 | Posted by Zed at 2021-09-13 10:25 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

Probably also pro-Abortion because 'my body my choice'

#31 | POSTED BY SKEPTICAL A

No. Because your girlfriend deserves something better than a coat hanger.

#33 | Posted by Zed at 2021-09-13 10:27 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"The FDA has not authorized or approved ivermectin for use in preventing or treating COVID-19 in humans or animals. Ivermectin is approved for human use to treat infections caused by some parasitic worms and head lice and skin conditions like rosacea.

Currently available data do not show ivermectin is effective against COVID-19. Clinical trials assessing ivermectin tablets for the prevention or treatment of COVID-19 in people are ongoing."
www.fda.gov

CDC HAN Advisory:
"Rapid Increase in Ivermectin Prescriptions and Reports of Severe Illness Associated with Use of Products Containing Ivermectin to Prevent or Treat COVID-19"
emergency.cdc.gov

From the Israeli study:
"This article is a preprint and has not been peer-reviewed. It reports new medical research that has yet to be evaluated and so should not be used to guide clinical practice."

Regarding Therapeutics for COVID, yes there are therapies that have been proved. Here's a list:
www.hhs.gov
In fact, Gov. DeathSentence is making money hand over fist for one of his donors with his monoclonal antibody treatment centers in Florida.

In short, "Skeptical" you have done nothing but lie and misinform. You should be banned from the D.R.

#34 | Posted by YAV at 2021-09-13 10:38 PM | Reply

"In short, "Skeptical" you have done nothing but lie and misinform. You should be banned from the D.R.
#34 | POSTED BY YAV"

Nothing that I wrote was a lie or misinformation. I realize that you want to continue to tout official talking points but you should be clear thinking enough to know that their guidance does change often.

For ivermectin, I encourage people to read Matt Taibbi. He does a good job of balancing the arguments and explaining the actual situation. In short, I have no idea why you need to politicize medicine. You are as bad as the people politicizing the vaccine. I would predict in about a years time when the focus moves more and more towards therapeutics, you will regret your closed minded approach.

taibbi.substack.com

#35 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-13 10:48 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

I have no interest in reading Taibbi.
Why would I?
The facts are out there. I provided links.
As to therapeutics, I provided proven therapies in my post.
You won't find Ivermectin in that list.

What I will not do is allow you any unchallenged hype for ivermectin which at this point is not proven to be any better than Hydroxychloroquin, zinc, and antibiotics. If the studies prove otherwise, then and only then will I change my position.

As I said before, you chose the name "Skeptical" as a deception. Your name is a lie, as is what you post.

#36 | Posted by YAV at 2021-09-13 10:55 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

In short, "Skeptical" you have done nothing but lie and misinform. You should be banned from the D.R.

Oh c'mon... he was the new weekend sock puppet, just got started a bit late.

#37 | Posted by REDIAL at 2021-09-13 10:56 PM | Reply

This is a drug that won the Nobel Peace prize in 2015. I don't understand why progressives are so against doctors prescribing it for their patients.

#38 | Posted by BellRinger at 2021-09-13 10:57 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

Drugs win the Peace Prize?

#39 | Posted by REDIAL at 2021-09-13 10:59 PM | Reply

" I have no interest in reading Taibbi.
Why would I?"

Because he challenges those in power regardless of political affiliation. He was great when he was busy hating on Trump. But now? Nah!

#40 | Posted by BellRinger at 2021-09-13 11:03 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

"There is no effective therapeutic currently according to US doctors."

Link?

"Israeli doctors and those around the world have found different and made ivermectin a key part in that."

Links?

#41 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-09-13 11:04 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"#38 | POSTED BY BELLRINGER "

It is like arguing religion with these people. Medicine should not be politicized. They are truly horrible people.

#42 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-13 11:04 PM | Reply | Funny: 2

You aren't pushing medicine.
You're pushing lies.

#43 | Posted by YAV at 2021-09-13 11:14 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"You aren't pushing medicine.
You're pushing lies.

#43 | POSTED BY YAV"

Ivermectin is not medicine? 250M people that take it annual would disagree.

#44 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-13 11:19 PM | Reply | Funny: 2

You think I'm stupid enough to buy into your idiocy that because a drug is used across the planet for treating parasitic worms that that means it's good for treating a virus?

All you and your like are going to do is make Ivermectin unavailable for those that truly need it for what it meant to be used for and was developed for. Just like hydroxychloroquin shortages - another "do nothing" medicine that has a legitimate proven use. Study after study was cited for that drug, too.

Why don't you go full out on this stupidity and tell us all how Campbell/Omura, who won the Nobel Prize for developing an effective treatment for parasitic worms (Ivermectin) says about it and COVID-19? Are you going to state the circulated lie, or be factual?

#45 | Posted by YAV at 2021-09-13 11:29 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"You think I'm stupid enough to buy into your idiocy that because a drug is used across the planet for treating parasitic worms that that means it's good for treating a virus
#45 | POSTED BY YAV"

You sound like an angry Viagra user....because drugs could not possibly be dual purpose.

#46 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-13 11:33 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

Sounds to me like she should have got Rogans doctor to treat her since he managed to get invermectin treatments.

When my nefrologist denied me getting a procedure because of risk of infection, I asked him for a phone number of any other kidney specialist.... he changed his mind and I have benefitted greatly.

#47 | Posted by 503jc69 at 2021-09-14 12:10 AM | Reply

"When my nefrologist denied me getting a procedure because of risk of infection, I asked him for a phone number of any other kidney specialist.... he changed his mind and I have benefitted greatly.
#47 | POSTED BY 503JC69"

That seems unlikely per the posters here. Doctors are infallible so you should never question your health care providers. You must be some wild eyed Trumper.

#48 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-14 12:16 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

Anything but a Trumper here...
Doctors have almost killed me twice with pills not meant for kidney failure.
Doctors are definitely not infallible... double check everything and remember they work for you.

#49 | Posted by 503jc69 at 2021-09-14 12:36 AM | Reply

One just doesn't know who to believe, the FDA, the CDC, the Mayo Clinic... or Skeptical Trumper.

Really tough question, right?

#50 | Posted by Corky at 2021-09-14 12:42 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

Covid is de-worming humanity. Hail Covid!

#51 | Posted by bored at 2021-09-14 12:59 AM | Reply

"One just doesn't know who to believe, the FDA, the CDC, the Mayo Clinic... or Skeptical Trumper.
#50 | POSTED BY CORKY "

You could ask the girl that this whole article is about how well that FDA and CDC guideline worked out for her to protect her from taking ivermectin...yeah, that's right. Can't really do that now that she is dead. Given dead is the end result, arguing that ivermectin would have cause her harm at this point is illogical. It is pretty clear that you don't want ivermectin for political reasons. That is sick.

#52 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-14 01:19 AM | Reply | Funny: 2

"You could ask the girl that this whole article is about"

Girl? She was 64.

#53 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-09-14 01:30 AM | Reply

"Girl?
#53 | POSTED BY GAL_TUESDAY"

You are arguing that she did not identify as female?

#54 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-14 01:32 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

Veronica Wolski, 64, of Jefferson Park, died at 12:44 a.m. at Amita Resurrection Medical Center, the Cook County medical examiner's office reported. She died from pneumonia due to COVID-19 with hypothyroidism as a contributing factor, according to the medical examiner's office.

chicago.suntimes.com

#55 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday at 2021-09-14 01:35 AM | Reply

"#55 | POSTED BY GAL_TUESDAY"

And? You have proof she did not identify as female?

#56 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-14 01:49 AM | Reply | Funny: 3

Crocodile tears ...

#57 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY at 2021-09-14 03:33 AM | Reply

You sound like an angry Viagra user....because drugs could not possibly be dual purpose.

I am not sure what that's about or what it really means, so it sure sounds like a hell of a lot of projection coming from that poster. A poster that calls full grown women "girls." LMAO!

#58 | Posted by YAV at 2021-09-14 07:35 AM | Reply

"I am not sure what that's about
#58 | POSTED BY YAV"

It's about that blue pill you take to make your little dingdong work was not invented for that purpose.

#59 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-14 08:14 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

Here's the dead woman in action.
Doing pretty much the same thing Skeptical does here:
Veronica Wolski, seen here harassing store employees about wearing a mask, died this morning from Covid while wearing a mask
www.reddit.com

#60 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-09-14 08:24 AM | Reply

Given dead is the end result,

Dead is the end result for everyone.

Hospitals across the US are full of people dying from COVID. You what hospitals are not full of? People dying from the COVID vaccine.

People are posting pictures of ivermectin "working" as their stools are full of what they call the virus but is in fact the lining of their intestines disintegrating.

arguing that ivermectin would have cause her harm at this point is illogical.

Except for the small fact that doctors and nurses are not supposed to perform treatments that would do more harm. I mean, why not just run her blood through a bleach solution and put it back in. It might work. It might kill her, but she is dead already. Except it might be excruciating painful way to die. Then you have to deal with lawsuits for the pain and suffering they put her through. That is why as a doctor they cannot prescribe a treatment that is not approved...it might cause undo pain on the patient and they would be opening themselve up to liability lawsuits in today's overly litigious society.

Arguing otherwise is just plain foolish.

#61 | Posted by Nixon at 2021-09-14 08:35 AM | Reply

"Veronica Wolski, seen here harassing store employees about wearing a mask, died this morning from Covid while wearing a mask
#60 | POSTED BY SNOOFY"

Where did I write that people should not wear a mask? Where did I write that I was anti-vaccine? The only thing I wrote is that people that have covid, whether vaccinated or unvaccinated, should be able to take ivermectin if they choose to do so. I really don't know why that is so controversial here.

#62 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-14 08:38 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

"The only thing I wrote is that people that have covid, whether vaccinated or unvaccinated, should be able to take ivermectin if they choose to do so"

Well she could have taken some, up until she was basically on life support and unable to do anything for herself.

So you're not really saying anything.

So shut your stupid face.

#63 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-09-14 09:04 AM | Reply

"#63 | POSTED BY SNOOFY"

You are a truly worthless human being. I pity those that are forced to deal with you in real life.

#64 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-14 09:30 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

real life.

#64 | POSTED BY SKEPTICAL

What's not real?

#65 | Posted by Zed at 2021-09-14 09:34 AM | Reply

" people that have covid, whether vaccinated or unvaccinated, should be able to take ivermectin if they choose to"

Riiiiiiight.

Because the inmates should run the asylum.

#66 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-09-14 09:35 AM | Reply

"Because the inmates should run the asylum.
#66 | POSTED BY DANFORTH "

Are you for legalized weed?

#67 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-14 09:48 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

Given ivermectin, at worse, does not provide a benefit, what case can be made for withholding it?

The only "evidence" of efficacy is small, not well controlled studies. Meta analysis of the slew of small studies out there shows low to moderate strength evidence. Large, blinded and controlled studies have all shown no benefit.

And doctors aren't in the business of doing stuff just cuz. For something to be approved/used it has to provide additional benefit compared to current standard of care. Ivermectin doesn't reach that bar so it's not used.

#68 | Posted by jpw at 2021-09-14 09:51 AM | Reply

Meanwhile, the NHS in the UK has just kicked off a large scale trial on the use of ivermectin.

Initiation of a trial isn't a sign to start using a drug for treatment. It's to find out if you should use a drug for treatment. You're getting ahead of yourself more than a little bit.

As the evidence for ivermectin efficacy grows and that of the vaccines continues to diminish (Pfizer under 50% per the new Mayo study vs. Delta),

Pfizer efficacy dropped to 84% overall. The demographic showing the greatest risk is....those over 60. A demographic notorious for poor vaccine response.

Stop spreading misinformation.

I think you, and the 'vaccine only crowd' will look back in a year and realize all those people you let die because your politics forced you to slow down the use of ivermectin.

Not even a little. Why? Because it's not politics preventing the widespread use of ivermectin among sane people.

And those people dying will increasingly be fully vaccinated (as shown in Israel) which is why therapeutic development should always have been the focus of our research efforts.
#23 | POSTED BY SKEPTICAL

Gee, you should call up Fauci and other virologists to tell them they need to develop therapeutics. They probably haven't thought of that and sunk years of R&D into doing just that.

Make sure you call Gilead too. They might want to try Remdesivir.

#69 | Posted by jpw at 2021-09-14 09:58 AM | Reply

Rogan does peddle supplements and other garbage to rubes, who to say he didn't invested and concoct this entire charade hoping to financially benefit

I've commented to others that Joe reminded me of Jude Law's character in Contagion who hocked forsythia as a "cure."

#70 | Posted by jpw at 2021-09-14 10:00 AM | Reply

You are a truly worthless human being. I pity those that are forced to deal with you in real life.
#64 | POSTED BY SKEPTICAL

^
Save your pity for your cult leaders like Veronica Wolski and Bob Enyart.

Literally nboody here talks to you, except to correct the constant stream of disinformation coming out of your mouth.

You don't add value, you subtract it. No one will come to your funeral.

#71 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-09-14 10:11 AM | Reply

"Gee, you should call up Fauci
#69 | POSTED BY JPW"

We have covid today because of Fauci's irresponsible funding of Chinese research. Fauci should be on trial for the deaths of millions worldwide. You still trust him? Some people never learn.

#72 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-14 10:51 AM | Reply | Funny: 2

#68 and #69 - EXACTLY.

#72 - And now we get this insane right-wing conspiracy nutcase finally outs himself!
Skeptical's a f**king loon.

I really don't know why that is so controversial here.

I told you why I think your statement is so controversial. You just won't hear it.

All you and your like are going to do is make Ivermectin unavailable for those that truly need it for what it meant to be used for and was developed for. Just like hydroxychloroquin shortages affected so many with malaria and lupus - another "do nothing" medicine that has a legitimate proven use. Study after study was cited for that drug, too.

What you should do is push getting vaccinated. Something that works and has been proven to work, without any doubt or question. But here you are pushing an unproven medicine for an "off label" use for which is has shown no demonstrable efficacy.

And you wonder why your ridiculous stance is controversial?

#73 | Posted by YAV at 2021-09-14 11:06 AM | Reply

"What you should do is push getting vaccinated. Something that works and has been proven to work, without any doubt or question.
#73 | POSTED BY YAV "

Vaccines push out the problem, not solve it as Israel is proving now. We need therapeutics. In fact, as variants continue to emerge, you are likely better off giving covid now and recovering from it than getting vaccinated but that is neither here nor there. As I said above - get the vaccine. Then, when you wind up on the hospital with a variant, you will want ivermectin. It is just politics that makes you so obtuse.

#74 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-14 11:12 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

You're supposed to make your sockpuppet seem "almost" as intelligent as you are, dumb@ss.
This one is a dolt.

#75 | Posted by LegallyYourDead at 2021-09-14 12:01 PM | Reply

"That is why as a doctor they cannot prescribe a treatment that is not approved" - Nixon

Once a therapeutic is approved for an indication we can use it off label. We are supposed to document well that the patient understands that we may have studies that support it but we don't have full FDA approval. When prozac first came out it was approved for major depression. It was used off label for a variety of conditions. Some of those have since gained FDA approval, some have not.
Another example is quetiapine, or Seroquel. Thousands, maybe millions are taking it for insomnia, an unapproved indication.
Unlikely that the manufacturers would seek further indications of Invermectin as it is generic and no profit in it for them.

#76 | Posted by mattm at 2021-09-14 12:04 PM | Reply | Funny: 1 | Newsworthy 1

Push out?
Like Polio?
Like Measles?
Like Mumps?
Like Chickenpox?
Like typhoid?
Like Hepatitis?
Like Pneumonia?
Like influenza?
Just pushes the problem out? And you think therapeutics are better than not getting sick in the first place?

#77 | Posted by YAV at 2021-09-14 12:35 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Furthermore I posted an article on the DR that detailed what we're starting to see longer term. That when someone gets COVID, then gets vaccinated with an mRNA vaccine, a super-immunity develops that works against all coronaviruses. They believe they'll see that with the 3rd shot spaced out appropriately. That's the hope, anyway.

That beats the ---- outta therapeutics.

#78 | Posted by YAV at 2021-09-14 12:39 PM | Reply

We have covid today because of Fauci's irresponsible funding of Chinese research. Fauci should be on trial for the deaths of millions worldwide. You still trust him? Some people never learn.

#72 | POSTED BY SKEPTICAL

You're an idiot.

#79 | Posted by jpw at 2021-09-14 01:16 PM | Reply

Vaccines push out the problem, not solve it as Israel is proving now.

Push out the problem? What does that even mean?

Vaccines largely mitigate the necessity for therapeutics by preventing severe disease.

That milder cases then gives you a boost.

We need therapeutics.

Again, call scientists and doctors and tell them this. They apparently don't know and aren't bothering to look.

In fact, as variants continue to emerge, you are likely better off giving covid now and recovering from it than getting vaccinated but that is neither here nor there.

Actually, you're better off getting vaccinated because you will get COVID at some point.

As I said above - get the vaccine. Then, when you wind up on the hospital with a variant, you will want ivermectin. It is just politics that makes you so obtuse.

#74 | POSTED BY SKEPTICAL

No, I won't. Because I'm informed and know what I'm talking about.

The only ones demanding ivermectin are the idiots who puffed out theirs chests at this "hoax" then ran like scared bitched when their crash course in how real it is started.

#80 | Posted by jpw at 2021-09-14 01:23 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Man walks into a hospital and says: I will take 10 doses of ivermectin please

Sincerely
Skepticals imagination

#81 | Posted by ChiefTutMoses at 2021-09-14 03:15 PM | Reply

#74 | POSTED BY SKEPTICAL

Surprised misinformation like this is being allowed on the DR.

Shameful.

#82 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2021-09-14 03:23 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"Ivermectin is very widely used and seen as a safe drug. We need to figure out, now, whether the dosage you can use it at in humans will be effective " that's the next step," Wagstaff explains.
www.medicalnewstoday.com

Ivermectin is effective at certain levels combatting the virus in a petri dish. The question now remains would the required dose for human trial be safe and effective. As of right now, the prospect is not certain:

Lack of efficacy of standard doses of ivermectin in severe COVID-19 patients

Ivermectin has recently shown efficacy against SARS-CoV-2 in-vitro. We retrospectively reviewed severe COVID-19 patients receiving standard doses of ivermectin and we compared clinical and microbiological outcomes with a similar group of patients not receiving ivermectin. No differences were found between groups. We recommend the evaluation of high-doses of ivermectin in randomized trials against SARS-CoV-2.

journals.plos.org

"Of course, rolling out vaccination as quickly and widespread as possible would negate the need to use ivermectin as a treatment," [David Boulware, MD, MPH, of the University of Minnesota] added. "So big picture, vaccines are the better solution."
www.medpagetoday.com

IOW, yes the drug is safe to take. The question now remains what dose is effective in combatting the virus and whether that effective dose is safe for human ingestion. Considering high doses of ivermectin can be lethal, people should be cautious when considering the drug as a treatment for COVID. And as Dr. Dave iterated above, get vaxxed, it's the best thing you can do for yourself and others.

#83 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2021-09-14 03:44 PM | Reply

When I go to the hospital next, I am going to demand to be treated with Whiskey. It doesn't require a prescription and is widely used.

#84 | Posted by bored at 2021-09-14 03:48 PM | Reply

Japan has not approved ivermectin as a COVID-19 treatment, and it's still using Moderna vaccine
The Tokyo Medical Association is a professional organization that's not affiliated with the government, and can only make policy recommendations.
Ivermectin is not listed by the Japanese government as an approved medication to treat COVID-19.
A batch of the Moderna vaccine had to be recalled in Japan because of a contamination issue, but it remains an approved vaccine and is being used.
www.politifact.com

#85 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2021-09-14 05:09 PM | Reply

and it's still using Moderna vaccine

Just to be clear, there's nothing wrong with the vaccine itself.
www.reuters.com

The issue may be a combination of things, such as improper needle withdrawal, improper needle insertion into the bottle breaking off part of the pink rubber seal, a manufacturing issue with the lot produced in Spain. The U.S. doesn't use that particular manufacturer, so no issue here, nor have there been any reports of any of what's been seen in the two provinces in Japan.

#86 | Posted by YAV at 2021-09-14 06:52 PM | Reply

"The only ones demanding ivermectin are the idiots who puffed out theirs chests at this "hoax" then ran like scared bitched when their crash course in how real it is started.
#80 | POSTED BY JPW "

I am fully vaccinated with Moderna and got the vaccine as soon as it was available. I will get the booster as soon as it is available. And I am demanding ivermectin.

So, your argument is easily proven to be wrong. Yet, I predict you will keep making it anyway because you are too blinded by politics to do anything else.

#87 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-14 07:16 PM | Reply | Funny: 2

"Of course, rolling out vaccination as quickly and widespread as possible would negate the need to use ivermectin as a treatment," [David Boulware, MD, MPH, of the University of Minnesota] added. "So big picture, vaccines are the better solution.
#83 | POSTED BY RSTYBEACH11"

1.) Better should not equate to 'only solution allowed' as it does in the minds of the liberals that think medicines are right wing and left wing

2.) The data from Israel proves him wrong. Their hospitals are being filled with fully vaccinated patients.

Additionally, if children become more susceptible, they will be better served by therapeutics than a vaccine until we have full data on the long term impacts of the vaccines.

#88 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-14 07:23 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

until we have full data on the long term impacts of the vaccines.
#88 | POSTED BY SKEPTICAL

Curious, when do you expect this to be accomplished?

#89 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2021-09-14 07:30 PM | Reply

"Curious, when do you expect this to be accomplished?
#89 | POSTED BY RSTYBEACH11"

You need to ask the CDC, I don't know how much longer they intend to wait until they approve vaccines for kids of all ages or what specific study results they are waiting for.

#90 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-14 07:58 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

"Curious, when do you expect this to be accomplished?
#89 | POSTED BY RSTYBEACH11"

I just checked the CDC website on the timeline for kids under 12 but all that is listed is:

"Protect Unvaccinated Children
Children between the ages of 2 and 12 should wear a mask in public spaces and around people they don't live with."

So, no timeline or what they are doing before they approve it. Unless you have proof otherwise, I am going to make the assumption that they are waiting for additional long-term studies before approving it and are not just withholding it because they want to be jerks.

So, when will it come? No idea. And luckily children have not been at high risk for covid (other than potentially long-covid). So, I think the therapeutics are pretty essential now and will be in the future.

#91 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-14 08:45 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

#88 Wrong.
The doctor decides which drug to prescribe to a patient, patients don't get to demand drugs.
The data from Israel proves Dr. Boulware correct. 10% of Israeli covid kids have long haul covid. They don't get that from the vaccine. Infection is worse than vaccination.

#92 | Posted by bored at 2021-09-14 08:47 PM | Reply

"The doctor decides which drug to prescribe to a patient, patients don't get to demand drugs."

Doctors are not infallible and are often more concerned with not being sued that saving their patients. They do this by strictly following the prescribed treatment path - even with that treatment path is basically hydration and vitamins. Further, if you think doctors in the US are not influenced by their patient's request for a drug, you obviously do not understand the US pharma industry. Why do you think the US is the only country that allows prescription drugs to be advertised? If you want to be accurate, it would be 'doctors do not allow patients to demand generic drugs' -they have no problem with the on-patent stuff generating kickbacks.

"The data from Israel proves Dr. Boulware correct. 10% of Israeli covid kids have long haul covid. They don't get that from the vaccine. Infection is worse than vaccination.
#92 | POSTED BY BORED"

Again - where do you get this polar view of "It's being vaccinated" vs. "Using ivermectin and no vaccine"? I think I have been very clear on this point - IT SHOULD BE BOTH. As the data from Israel shows, the vaccines has decreasing efficacy which means we will fall back to therapeutics regardless - the only question is when they actually get the funding and support they should already be receiving. Politically/financially - there is a big incentive to ------ ivermectin because it threatens the EUA for the vaccines. My assumption is that you are too blinded to understand this rather than you wanting people to die. Maybe I am wrong.

#93 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-14 08:59 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

So, your argument is easily proven to be wrong. Yet, I predict you will keep making it anyway because you are too blinded by politics to do anything else.

#87 | Posted by Skeptical

I'm actually capable of analyzing data.

The data isn't supportive of demanding ivermectin. The only thing political is the continued insistence it's effective in any significant way.

#94 | Posted by jpw at 2021-09-14 11:02 PM | Reply

until we have full data on the long term impacts of the vaccines.

#88 | Posted by Skeptical

Usual garbage. I'm betting you wont' be able to answer this question that I've asked many who spout the BS you're spouting.

What long term effects do you think are possible and what vaccine has ever caused long term effects that didn't manifest during an acute stage?

#95 | Posted by jpw at 2021-09-14 11:04 PM | Reply

I am going to make the assumption that they are waiting for additional long-term studies before approving it and are not just withholding it because they want to be jerks.

www.pfizer.com

Trials in adults were 90 days (July to October).

Trials in children started in July.

So October.

Wasn't hard to find. But I guess it wasn't as easy as simply making ---- up.

#96 | Posted by jpw at 2021-09-14 11:09 PM | Reply

As the data from Israel shows, the vaccines has decreasing efficacy which means we will fall back to therapeutics regardless

That's not what the data shows, moron.

Primary risk factor is being older than 60. Guess who was vaccinated first?

People older than 60. So is it really time or loss of efficacy in a population with known issues of poor responses to vaccines?

the only question is when they actually get the funding and support they should already be receiving.

They do, idiot. That's why I've been mocking you every time you say this as if you have the slightest clue.

One of the first things many groups did when COVID started was to test small molecule libraries in vitro for antiviral activities. Other groups screened large groups of approved meds to see if they can be repurposed against COVID.

Historically, antivirals have been extremely difficult to develop and few have been successfully utilized.

Politically/financially - there is a big incentive to ------ ivermectin because it threatens the EUA for the vaccines. My assumption is that you are too blinded to understand this rather than you wanting people to die. Maybe I am wrong.

#93 | Posted by Skeptical

Except the Pfizer vaccine is FDA approved.

And its use wouldn't do a damn thing towards threatening the use of preventatives over narrow windowed, ineffective treatments.

#97 | Posted by jpw at 2021-09-14 11:22 PM | Reply

"I'm actually capable of analyzing data."

As proven by you incorrect statement, no, you are not capable.

"What long term effects do you think are possible and what vaccine has ever caused long term effects that didn't manifest during an acute stage?"

Take that up the with CDC - they are the ones that have not authorized the use of the vaccines in children, not me. Sorry, but when comparing their pedigree vs. your sub-GED level reading comprehension and IQ, I am going with the CDC over you.

"Trials in children started in July.
So October."
"#96 | POSTED BY JPW"

You want to bet on that October date for vaccinations for any age?

You are the combination of obnoxious, opinionated, and uninformed. The fact that your friends and family are unwilling to speak with you should probably be a signal of your personality disorder. I recommend you get that treated before continuing to broadcast your mental illness here.

#98 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-09-14 11:29 PM | Reply

#93 Wrong again.
Doctors may listen to patients but they don't prescribe on demand. Leave the goal posts alone.
I didn't argue against therapuetics. You said:
if children become more susceptible, they will be better served by therapeutics than a vaccine.

The Israeli data proves vaccines are better than therapuetics alone.

We also have no data on the long term effects of therapuetics on Covid kids.

#99 | Posted by bored at 2021-09-15 12:37 AM | Reply

You want to bet on that October date for vaccinations for any age?

Sure. I'm willing to bet they release the data and you make a new user name.

You are the combination of obnoxious, opinionated, and uninformed.

Says the guy pushing ivermectin based on his high school level biology knowldge.

www.researchgate.net774809180991488@1561740312049/Graph-of-the-Dunning-Kruger-effect-on-the-confidence-of-medical-
students-in-their.png

#100 | Posted by jpw at 2021-09-15 11:00 AM | Reply

You are the combination of obnoxious, opinionated, and uninformed. I recommend you get that treated before continuing to broadcast your mental illness here.

#98 | POSTED BY SKEPTICAL

PROJECT MUCH, DUMB@SS?

#101 | Posted by LegallyYourDead at 2021-09-15 11:24 AM | Reply

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