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Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Friday, October 22, 2021

Actor Alec Baldwin discharged a "prop firearm" Thursday on a movie set south of Santa Fe, killing the director of photography for the film he was working on and wounding its director, the Santa Fe County Sheriff's Office said. ... The director of photography for the feature film Rust, Halyna Hutchins, 42, died at University of New Mexico Hospital in Albuquerque, and director Joel Souza, 48, was taken to Christus St. Vincent Regional Medical Center, where he was receiving emergency care, the sheriff's office said.

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This post should be moved. :-)

#1 | Posted by REDIAL at 2021-10-22 12:24 AM | Reply

How the hell did this happen???

Protocol on a set is to display the fact it's not loaded to everyone involved in the frame.

#2 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 12:40 AM | Reply

^I was going to say "involved in the shot", but....

#3 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 12:46 AM | Reply

I call --------.

This type of "accident" with a real gun is inexcusable.

With a prop gun that isn't supposed to be able to shoot a projectile to begin with? To many safety layers failed for this to be an "accident."

#4 | Posted by jpw at 2021-10-22 01:18 AM | Reply

"many safety layers failed"

Exactly.

I also heard from an old colleague now living in SF. She said the crew is not a "Tier-1" crew, and word is the gun was fired during a rehearsal, which is against protocol.

#5 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 01:30 AM | Reply

Here's another wrinkle: Baldwin is also Producer on the film. There are lots of safety protocols around firearms on a set, but if the star, who is also the Producer, grabs a gun, no one will stop him.

#6 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 01:55 AM | Reply

Lock him up?

#7 | Posted by Effeteposer at 2021-10-22 02:45 AM | Reply

Well, he did his Trump impression for years - now he is doing the Dick Cheney. Too bad someone had to die due to negligence.

#8 | Posted by Skeptical at 2021-10-22 04:58 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

First rule: consider all guns loaded, and act accordingly.

#9 | Posted by Doc_Sarvis at 2021-10-22 06:57 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

As noted on the other thread dealing with this topic, the First Rule remains unchanged: all guns should be considered loaded and ready to go.

#10 | Posted by Doc_Sarvis at 2021-10-22 07:00 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

I knew a guy active in the early Hollywood action movie biz, and he was damn near killed making an "oater" when an extra followed the director's order to "get in close" and fired a blank close to his head. He was blown clean off his horse, and bore the powder burns the rest of his life. And he was still well and truly pissed off about it more than half a century later.

#11 | Posted by Doc_Sarvis at 2021-10-22 07:06 AM | Reply

On the headline, it was evidently Alec Baldwin with a prop gun at a movie set on the Bonanza Ranch.

#12 | Posted by Doc_Sarvis at 2021-10-22 07:12 AM | Reply

With a prop gun that isn't supposed to be able to shoot a projectile to begin with?

Guns that fire blanks can be dangerous because they can expel material.

Jon-Erik Hexum died filming the TV series Voyagers in 1984 when he jokingly put a prop gun to his temple and fired. He didn't know that blanks expel wadding that can cause serious injury when close to someone's body.

Brandon Lee died filming the movie The Crow in 1993 when a prop gun fired an improperly made dummy round and hit him from a distance of 12 to 15 feet.

#13 | Posted by rcade at 2021-10-22 07:30 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

a prop gun fired an improperly made dummy round and hit him from a distance of 12 to 15 feet.

#13 | POSTED BY RCADE

It's still very strange tho. The director that was killed was reportedly behind the camera.

#14 | Posted by donnerboy at 2021-10-22 07:40 AM | Reply

Ballswine dissed the POTUS nastilly for years. At the very least he should get convicted of criminally negligent homicide and being as funny as a broken ankle.

#15 | Posted by phesterOBoyle at 2021-10-22 08:18 AM | Reply

#15 - your contention is that, because he was mean to your Orange God that he should be punished for a completely unrelated accident?

#16 | Posted by YAV at 2021-10-22 08:22 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

#16
My contention is he shot and killed someone so he should be imprisoned.
I put the Trump diss in to see if anyone would home in on that and overlook the murder.
Viola! It took less than 5 min. ;o)

#17 | Posted by phesterOBoyle at 2021-10-22 08:30 AM | Reply

Look at you! All judge, jury, too!

#18 | Posted by YAV at 2021-10-22 08:31 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"My contention is he shot and killed someone so he should be imprisoned"

Automatic?
Okay, cops first.

#19 | Posted by Doc_Sarvis at 2021-10-22 08:32 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

Well that should effectively shoot down his Gun Control work.

#20 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2021-10-22 08:37 AM | Reply

"Look at you! All judge, jury, too!
#18 | POSTED BY YAV"

That's how it works with LEO. fired, sent home, on trial for their life. Tried by the press.

#21 | Posted by phesterOBoyle at 2021-10-22 08:41 AM | Reply | Funny: 2

"It's still very strange tho. The director that was killed was reportedly behind the camera."

I assume when someone is pointing the (prop)gun at the camera when they fire it it will hit people behind that camera.

#22 | Posted by qcp at 2021-10-22 08:42 AM | Reply

"I assume ... "

Didn't your mommy or daddy ever tell you what happens when you assume?

Have you ever seen a Hollywood camera? It's a big old rig. Even the digital ones.

The point was that they are not easy to shoot someone thru. Especially with a "gun" firing blanks.

Was the "camera" a freaking iPhone?

#23 | Posted by donnerboy at 2021-10-22 08:49 AM | Reply

You'd have been right 20 years ago #23. Modern cameras a much smaller.

#24 | Posted by qcp at 2021-10-22 08:56 AM | Reply

I assume when someone is pointing the (prop)gun at the camera when they fire it it will hit people behind that camera.

Same here. Maybe the woman killed was holding the camera and the director was standing behind her.

#25 | Posted by rcade at 2021-10-22 09:08 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"EXCLUSIVE It was one bullet that discharged from the prop gun on the Santa Fe movie "Rust" and killed the director of photography and wounded the movie's director.

An eyewitness on set tells this column that the bullet went straight through the body of DP Halyna Hutchins and into the clavicle of the film's director Joel Souza."

www.showbiz411.com

#26 | Posted by qcp at 2021-10-22 09:09 AM | Reply

That's how it works with LEO. fired, sent home, on trial for their life. Tried by the press.

Rarely fired.
Rarely sent home.
Moved to Admin/desk duty.
Investigated.
Claims of "feared for my life" or "immunity" get 99.99% of the guilty off anyway.
Tried by the press? Usually because of videos and witnesses that were horrified by what they witnessed. Righteous outrage.

How the hell is this even comparable?

Now go beat some more LEO up with a "blue lives matter" flag and pole.

#27 | Posted by YAV at 2021-10-22 09:10 AM | Reply

[Baldwin] dissed the POTUS nastilly for years.

Trumpers are such hypocrites. Trump is nasty to people all the time and you love it -- he just danced on Colin Powell's grave this week -- but an actor mocks him on a comedy show and you can't stop crying about it.

#28 | Posted by rcade at 2021-10-22 09:12 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

#26 - So not a blank at all. Wow.

What the hell was a loaded gun doing on set? I guess with guns becoming ubiquitous, thanks GOP and -----------, this was inevitable. Geezusfrkiienkeist.

#29 | Posted by YAV at 2021-10-22 09:13 AM | Reply

Guns that fire blanks can be dangerous because they can expel material.

I know. But wadding is entirely different than an actual bullet.

Guns that shoot blanks are usually modified so they can't accept a live round. It's a safety precaution to ensure there isn't an "accident" like this. I guess these prop guys were a bunch of amateurs.

#30 | Posted by jpw at 2021-10-22 09:21 AM | Reply

If it was an actual bullet that explains a lot.

#31 | Posted by donnerboy at 2021-10-22 09:28 AM | Reply

Alec Baldwin: Responsible Gun Owner

#32 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-10-22 09:36 AM | Reply

Whatsamatta Festus, Fat Donnie didn't pay you either? Lo siento, clown-boy.

#33 | Posted by LegallyYourDead at 2021-10-22 09:38 AM | Reply

The gun didn't kill anyone, use of passive voice is also incorrect. Gun control advocate Alec Baldwin shot and killed someone. He pulled the trigger.

#34 | Posted by visitor_ at 2021-10-22 10:03 AM | Reply

"The gun didn't kill anyone"

Good call.
It was the bullet that did the killing.
Thanks for clearing that up!

#35 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-10-22 10:06 AM | Reply

There is quite a bit to consider for this shooting.
#1 is to find out who brought live ammo to a movie set? Did the slatherass load the whole clip with live ammo? Or was it mixed in?

Someone said one projectile killed the first man and it passed thru his body and on to the next person.
Probably hardball ammo which looks nothing like a blank.
if the firearm was a semi which has to be modified to cycle blanks, was there a muzzle restrictor? Or was the recoil spring changed?

#36 | Posted by phesterOBoyle at 2021-10-22 10:14 AM | Reply

Alec Baldwin: Responsible Gun Owner

#32 | POSTED BY SNOOFY AT 2021-10-22 09:36 AM | FLAG:

You mean Prominent Anti-Gun Activist profiting off of the commercial dramatization of gun violence with a propensity for assaulting people. With his history of assaults and mental illness requiring anger management classes, you would think in such as place as New York that would disqualify him from having 2A rights.

#37 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2021-10-22 10:17 AM | Reply

Gun control advocate Alec Baldwin shot and killed someone.

It's a prop accident. Making it sound like he intended to shoot somebody is misleading.

The person in charge of the prop didn't do their job. It's no different than if lighting fell and killed somebody on set because it wasn't installed properly.

At most Baldwin is responsible for not knowing how to check a prop gun to ensure it was safe before using it in a scene. But anyone in charge of that scene has the same responsibility, not just him.

#38 | Posted by rcade at 2021-10-22 10:20 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

I guess these prop guys were a bunch of amateurs.

A tier 1 film has a budget under $6 million so it wouldn't have as many experienced pros on set.

#39 | Posted by rcade at 2021-10-22 10:22 AM | Reply

The survival rate of shots from prop guns on set is 99.99999%. Preventing me from using real guns and ammo on set is against the constitution.
Gun safety is for fearful snowflakes.

#40 | Posted by bored at 2021-10-22 10:23 AM | Reply

With his history of assaults and mental illness requiring anger management classes, you would think in such as place as New York that would disqualify him from having 2A rights.
#37 | POSTED BY SITZKRIEG

Holler back when any Republican, Libertarian, small "L" Libertarian, or Independent actually supports more gun control laws!

#41 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-10-22 10:27 AM | Reply

Sounds like they're props Department committed second-degree manslaughter.

#42 | Posted by Tor at 2021-10-22 10:51 AM | Reply

#41 | POSTED BY SNOOFY AT 2021-10-22 10:27 AM | FLAG:

Fairly certain they have zero power in New York.

#43 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2021-10-22 10:52 AM | Reply

Fairly certain they have zero power in New York.

Nothing is stopping them from voting for gun control laws introduced by Democrats.

#44 | Posted by rcade at 2021-10-22 10:53 AM | Reply

Nothing is stopping them from voting for gun control laws introduced by Democrats.

#44 | POSTED BY RCADE AT 2021-10-22 10:53 AM | FLAG:

Red Votes Matter! Sure.

The irony here is so intense. It wasn't long ago that Baldwin was doing something very Republican, lobbying for tax breaks from NYC to ensure that filming didn't leave for some god forsaken place like Georgia. Now this A-list Gun Control Advocate, in the middle of monetizing gun violence through art, has shot and killed somebody through his own ignorance of firearm safety. Ouch. He's going to have some sleepless nights.

#45 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2021-10-22 10:58 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"The irony here is so intense."

Irony? Here we have a gun homicide readily attributable to lack of effective gun control.

I guess water being wet is ironic, in the world of gun lovers.

#46 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-10-22 11:02 AM | Reply

Ironic. Guns aren't toys. Don't play pretend with them.

#47 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2021-10-22 11:08 AM | Reply

Ballswine dissed the POTUS nastilly for years.

Such a snowflake just like your orange gash god.

Politicians get mocked by satirists every single year.

The Orange tub of Goo mocks and "disses" people he doesn't like all the time and you apes go crazy for it.

The "--- your feelings crowd" suddenly wants their feelings respected.

How typical.

Sack up and go back to ballwashing dotard.

#48 | Posted by Nixon at 2021-10-22 11:11 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Ironic. Guns aren't toys. Don't play pretend with them.
#47 | POSTED BY SITZKRIEG

Ironic is you saying that, while fervently opposing gun control.

#49 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-10-22 11:14 AM | Reply

Fairly certain they have zero power in New York.
#43 | POSTED BY SITZKRIEG

Doesn't matter who has power in New York.
The Second Amendment makes effective gun control impossible in the United States.

#50 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-10-22 11:16 AM | Reply

From Twitter:

" happen to know someone in that industry who says that the studio hired a non union prop crew... and no armorer at all. So a prop manager who didn't know firearms at all loaded the weapon with live rounds. Just hearsay, but if true..."

"A: The armorer wasn't union and it sounds like he used blanks with a normal barrel instead of a solid barrel. #rumor

B: If this is true, I wonder how culpable Baldwin would be. Though the armorer bears a great deal of responsibility, is the person who pulled the trigger completely off the hook? Should Baldwin have done some checks?

C: Not likely. It would be on the prop master and armorer. Baldwin likely doesnt even know how to make it safe."

#51 | Posted by GOnoles92 at 2021-10-22 11:17 AM | Reply

Red Votes Matter! Sure.

Stop offering up weak excuses for Republicans not supporting gun control laws. They're not forced to be the puppets of the NRA. They choose to take their money and do their bidding.

Red votes for gun control would obviously matter in New York.

#52 | Posted by rcade at 2021-10-22 11:38 AM | Reply | Funny: 1 | Newsworthy 1

If ballswine goes uncharged, I call rich white supremacy privilege.

#53 | Posted by phesterOBoyle at 2021-10-22 11:38 AM | Reply

Of course you do.

You only care about partisan BS and stupid names like "Ballswine".

(that doesn't even make sense....)

#54 | Posted by jpw at 2021-10-22 11:47 AM | Reply

At most Baldwin is responsible for not knowing how to check a prop gun to ensure it was safe before using it in a scene. But anyone in charge of that scene has the same responsibility, not just him.

#38 | POSTED BY RCADE AT 2021-10-22 10:20 AM

If her were a commoner, he would be charged with involuntary homicide. But people like him AND Dick Cheney will walk away every time.

Killing someone by accident still has legal consequences (if you're a commoner).

#55 | Posted by BellRinger at 2021-10-22 11:52 AM | Reply

If some Joe Lunchbox smoked a burgler, his life would change forever. The first charge would be "hunting over bait".
IOW the homeowner (non-rich person of course) is guilty because he has valuables.

#56 | Posted by phesterOBoyle at 2021-10-22 11:59 AM | Reply

#56 - not in Florida that's for damn sure.

#57 | Posted by YAV at 2021-10-22 12:06 PM | Reply

Killing someone by accident still has legal consequences (if you're a commoner).

#55 | POSTED BY BELLRINGER

There will be consequences. Just probably not the hateful ones you desire for him Ding Dong.

Being a trumper that is all you think about. Hate. And.

Being hateful to others. I believe it the Republican 1st commandment.

#1Thou shalt be hateful to the Other.

#2You will treat no Other as you treat a Republican.

#3 Always support the Big Lie. No matter what. Even if it destroys democracy.

#58 | Posted by donnerboy at 2021-10-22 12:06 PM | Reply

" At most Baldwin is responsible for not knowing how to check a prop gun to ensure it was safe before using it in a scene"

That is not, never has been, and never will be the protocol.

Actors do not have the same expertise as firearms experts, nor should it be their responsibility versus the seasoned pros required on set.

#59 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 12:09 PM | Reply

My guess would be the brunt (if not all) legal consequences will fall on the idiot who loaded a real gun with live ammo on a movie set.

#60 | Posted by jpw at 2021-10-22 12:09 PM | Reply

" It's still very strange tho. The director that was killed was reportedly behind the camera."

The shot was supposed to be towards the camera's POV.

#61 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 12:15 PM | Reply

#58
That's better than the dRat 1st commandment
1. Kiss all criminal --- thoroughly and open the jail doors.

#62 | Posted by phesterOBoyle at 2021-10-22 12:42 PM | Reply

If her were a commoner, he would be charged with involuntary homicide.

The actor Michael Massee was never charged for firing the prop gun that killed Brandon Lee. No one else was charged either.

Expecting every accidental death to lead to manslaughter or involuntary homicide charges is unrealistic. It doesn't even happen all the time when parents leave a loaded gun around and a kid dies.

#63 | Posted by rcade at 2021-10-22 12:45 PM | Reply

Actors do not have the same expertise as firearms experts, nor should it be their responsibility versus the seasoned pros required on set.

I didn't say it was his sole responsibility. But any actor working with something dangerous like a prop gun ought to know as much as they can to be safe.

If an actor was doing a fight scene they would be expected to know enough not to stupidly injure someone. The same principle applies here.

Baldwin reportedly said after the accident, "In all my years, I've never been handed a hot gun." Any actor should know enough to be able to inspect a prop gun before firing it to see if anything looks wrong.

Baldwin's also a producer on the film, which is a second way in which he's responsible.

#64 | Posted by rcade at 2021-10-22 12:49 PM | Reply

Baldwin reportedly said after the accident, "In all my years, I've never been handed a hot gun." Any actor should know enough to be able to inspect a prop gun before firing it to see if anything looks wrong.

Rough situation, especially if the scene called for actually firing a projectile, such as a blank/wad. A clearing chamber on set wouldn't have made a difference in that type of case.

#65 | Posted by GOnoles92 at 2021-10-22 12:51 PM | Reply

I was talking with a tv producer last week who said that so many shoots are happening all at once that it's hard to find qualified crew. People with zero experience are getting hired without knowing what they're doing.

#66 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-10-22 12:53 PM | Reply

Killing someone by accident still has legal consequences (if you're a commoner).

#55 | POSTED BY BELLRINGER

What about if you kill a half million people by telling them a pandemic is no big deal and they shouldnt trust health authorities?

#67 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-10-22 12:54 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

In all his years of trying to take fire arms away from commoners, he never learned enough about them to operate one safely. He's the idiot that makes warning labels on consumer products necessary, while lacking the humility to recognize it.

#68 | Posted by visitor_ at 2021-10-22 01:05 PM | Reply

if the firearm was a semi which has to be modified to cycle blanks, was there a muzzle restrictor?

Given the film is set in 1880 it was more than likely a revolver.

#69 | Posted by REDIAL at 2021-10-22 01:15 PM | Reply

The claim it is hard to find experienced people to check prop guns on set is absurd. There are tens of millions of people in this country who would know how and many of them probably make less than that prop guy.

Operationally, a gun is not a complex instrument. A car is more complicated than a gun. Knowing how to properly use and be safe with a gun is much easier than learning how to safely drive. Maybe that's one reason why they kill several times more people than guns.

#70 | Posted by jakester at 2021-10-22 01:16 PM | Reply | Funny: 2

The Director of Photography was killed as Baldwin was aiming at the camera to film the shot. The director was wounded standing behind the camera. Those types of shots happen all the time. It's an unfortunate accident.

#71 | Posted by lee_the_agent at 2021-10-22 01:16 PM | Reply

What about if you kill a half million people by telling them a pandemic is no big deal and they shouldnt trust health authorities?

If you're the President of Brazil, you get accused of Crimes against Humanity, which is a criminal charge.

#72 | Posted by YAV at 2021-10-22 01:17 PM | Reply

In all his years of trying to take fire arms away from commoners, he never learned enough about them to operate one safely.

In all your years of discussing gun control, you never learned it isn't about taking guns away.

#73 | Posted by rcade at 2021-10-22 01:18 PM | Reply

Why do guns have to loaded with anything like blanks or wadding? Use a gun with a plugged barrel (any gun ignorant, idiot actor could recognize that) and insert the bang sound during editing.

#74 | Posted by jakester at 2021-10-22 01:20 PM | Reply

Here's a gun law for you: Require a fire arm safety course for anyone handling a firearm or prop-firearm in a movie.

#75 | Posted by visitor_ at 2021-10-22 01:36 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

#36

All you folks with the inside scoop on how moving pictures is made, ---- you and your Alec Baldwin jokes. That man is very likely devastated today.

#76 | Posted by lee_the_agent at 2021-10-22 01:37 PM | Reply

" any actor working with something dangerous like a prop gun ought to know as much as they can to be safe"

True. But as you pointed out, final responsibility falls to the guy hired to be responsible.

#77 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 01:40 PM | Reply

Here's a gun law for you: Require a fire arm safety course for anyone handling a firearm or prop-firearm in a movie.

#75 | Posted by visitor_

How come repubs want tougher regulations for movie guns than for real guns?

#78 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-10-22 01:49 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

#70 | POSTED BY JAKESTER AT 2021-10-22 01:16 PM | FLAG: BRAINLESS BUFFOON

#79 | Posted by LegallyYourDead at 2021-10-22 01:49 PM | Reply

@#21 ... That's how it works with LEO. fired, sent home, on trial for their life. Tried by the press. ...

Perhaps in the factually-bereft world of the Alternate Facts Republicans.

But in the reality of the real world - not really. For starters: qualified immunity.


#80 | Posted by LampLighter at 2021-10-22 01:49 PM | Reply

"The most recent analysis shows that in 2014, gun deaths outpaced motor vehicle deaths in 21 states and the District of Columbia."

vpc.org

#81 | Posted by LegallyYourDead at 2021-10-22 01:51 PM | Reply

#74

It was a POV shot. The blocked barrel wouldn't be effective for the illusion to work. He was pointing the gun at a camera, which the DP and director often stand behind. All of you asking why it was pointed at a crew member are not aware of how filming works.

#82 | Posted by lee_the_agent at 2021-10-22 01:52 PM | Reply

Speaksoftly: For one, movie guns kill.

#83 | Posted by visitor_ at 2021-10-22 01:54 PM | Reply

Expecting every accidental death to lead to manslaughter or involuntary homicide charges is unrealistic. It doesn't even happen all the time when parents leave a loaded gun around and a kid dies.

#63 | POSTED BY RCADE AT 2021-10-22 12:45 PM | REPLY

We don't have all the details at the moment. But someone, somewhere down the line is negligent and it cost at least one person their life. If not Baldwin, someone had to put live ammo in that gun. What responsibility did Baldwin have to check the weapon prior to firing it? Was that someone else's responsibility? I don't know those answers but I do know my spouse or child was shot with a live round on a movie set "accident wouldn't be an acceptable term to me.

#84 | Posted by BellRinger at 2021-10-22 01:54 PM | Reply

#81: Meanwhile here in the present, and using data from all 50 states (not only a cherry picked 21 states)

www.businessinsider.com

www.usnews.com

Thanks for playing, though.

#85 | Posted by jakester at 2021-10-22 01:57 PM | Reply

"someone had to put live ammo in that gun."

Bingo. We have a winner.

#86 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 02:00 PM | Reply

Speaksoftly: For one, movie guns kill.

#83 | Posted by visitor_

What do real guns do? Tickle?

#87 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-10-22 02:01 PM | Reply

"#70 | POSTED BY JAKESTER AT 2021-10-22 01:16 PM | FLAG: BRAINLESS BUFFOON"

That is your entire rebuttal? Seriously? This is all your brain could come up with? Perhaps some serious introspection would identify the true buffoon.

#88 | Posted by jakester at 2021-10-22 02:04 PM | Reply

The actor Michael Massee was never charged for firing the prop gun that killed Brandon Lee.

#63 | POSTED BY RCADE AT 2021-10-22 12:45 PM | FLAG:

Unless Massee manufactured the dummy rounds for that revolver, why would they charge him with anything? Those rounds were designed using real ammo without primers, if I remember correctly, for the the close up scenes of the gun.

Also, things have drastically changed in the last 30 years. The courts as well as the public don't view "accidents" the same way today. 30 years ago people were still getting out of prison time for deaths that occured because of impaired driving.

#89 | Posted by BellRinger at 2021-10-22 02:05 PM | Reply

That man is very likely devastated today.

#76 | POSTED BY LEE_THE_AGENT

Definitely. I can't begin to imagine the feeling of doing something you love, that drives you, in this case bringing together a team to create something from a 0 to 1 state, and have it result in an accident causing death and injury. Horrific.

#90 | Posted by GOnoles92 at 2021-10-22 02:07 PM | Reply

"What responsibility did Baldwin have to check the weapon prior to firing it?"

According to set rules, none. He isn't supposed to f^^k with the gun AT ALL except when specifically directed.

I've had to wear a gun on set, as an FBI agent with the job requirement of a sidearm. If I were to screw with the gun AT ALL, I'd be soundly reprimanded, at the very least.

I've also been killed on set. Before every take, the firearms expert would dismantle parts of the gun so I could see it was safe. That was after going through the same steps with my shooter. We NEVER "fired" during rehearsal; we'd use "bang-BANG", with the second one coming very quickly after the first.

Extra set points if you know why.

#91 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 02:10 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"things have drastically changed in the last 30 years."

The vent gun surprised me the most. It's basically a starter pistol designed so the discharge is at ~45 degree angles backwards, off the middle of the gun. For closeup shots on the body.

#92 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 02:17 PM | Reply

"Maybe that's one reason why they kill several times more people than guns."

Per use?

#93 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 02:18 PM | Reply

i.imgur.com

Just sAyin

#94 | Posted by phesterOBoyle at 2021-10-22 02:19 PM | Reply

Per user?

#95 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 02:21 PM | Reply

NM ^^ bad link

#96 | Posted by phesterOBoyle at 2021-10-22 02:21 PM | Reply

"All of you asking why it was pointed at a crew member are not aware of how filming works."

(Unrecognized) Newsworthy flag.

#97 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 02:24 PM | Reply

Speaksoftly: For one, movie guns kill.
#83 | Posted by visitor_
What do real guns do? Tickle?

What's your ------- point? Someone died while play acting. Given the event of yesterday and subject of this blog, you wouldn't favor a gun safety course for anyone handling a "real" firearm or prop firearm? Apparently this one was "real" but intended to be used as a prop. Maybe this should be an OSHA regulation.

#98 | Posted by visitor_ at 2021-10-22 02:25 PM | Reply

#93 - what is a "use"? That is a vague term.

Is one use driving a mile to the store? Is one use driving 3,000 miles cross country on vacation? Or does it become multiple uses because you stop for gas and restart the car?

How would the application of the word "use" vis-a-vis death due to heart disease based on poor diet work? Is one use one bite? One meal? A lifetime of poor diet? Does eating a leftover pork chop count as one or two uses?

"Use" as you are using it is a nebulous term and a very poor argument, especially to an indisputable fact.

#99 | Posted by jakester at 2021-10-22 02:30 PM | Reply

What are prop guns and why are they dangerous?
www.bbc.com

...Yes. You may remember Brandon Lee, the actor son of martial arts legend Bruce Lee.

Brandon Lee died aged just 28 in 1993 while filming The Crow, when a prop gun which mistakenly had a dummy round loaded in it was fired at him.

Dummy rounds contain no explosive charge and in this case were used to film a close-up. When blanks were loaded part of the dummy round remained in the gun.

After Lee was shot, the cameras kept rolling. It was only when he did not get up at the end of the scene that those on set realised something was wrong.

In another incident, in 1984, US actor Jon-Erik Hexum started joking around on the set of a television show after being frustrated by delays in filming.

He loaded a revolver with a blank, spun the chamber, put the gun to his temple and fired.

Unlike Lee, he was not killed by a projectile, but rather the force of the blast was strong enough to fracture his skull. He died days later in hospital. ...

A common shot in film shows an actor firing into the camera and Steven Hall, who has worked on films such as Fury and The Imitation Game, says it only happens with safeguards.

"If you are in the line of fire... You would have a face mask, you would have goggles, you would stand behind a Perspex screen, and you would minimise the number of people by the camera, " he said.

"What I don't understand in this instance is how two people have been injured, one tragically killed, in the same event."

Others working in film wondered why, at a time when gun effects can be cheaply added using computers, blanks are still being used at all.

"There's no reason to have guns loaded with blanks or anything on set anymore. Should just be fully outlawed," tweeted Craig Zobel, an actor and director whose credits include Westworld and Mare of Easttown. ...



#100 | Posted by LampLighter at 2021-10-22 02:49 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

What's your ------- point? Someone died while play acting. Given the event of yesterday and subject of this blog, you wouldn't favor a gun safety course for anyone handling a "real" firearm or prop firearm? Apparently this one was "real" but intended to be used as a prop. Maybe this should be an OSHA regulation.

#98 | Posted by visitor_

Same point i orginally made when you said there should be training and regulations to prevent movie gun deaths - something your cult opposes to prevent non movie gun deaths.

Yes gun training is good. So why is your cult busy CUTTING gun regulations to let any untrained idiot buy a gun and carry it wherever they want?

fortune.com

#101 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-10-22 02:49 PM | Reply

www.msn.com

Texas Moves to Eliminate Firearm Licenses Amid Heated Gun Debate

#102 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-10-22 02:50 PM | Reply

Red votes for gun control would obviously matter in New York.

#52 | POSTED BY RCADE AT 2021-10-22 11:38 AM | FLAG:

That's very aspirational but false. Check your Political Party Strength table for NYC. It is one of three benchmarks for Democrat dominance. No, Red Votes Do Not Matter there. Ample gun control laws. Probably worth checking that it was legal to hand a firearm to somebody that was court assigned anger management classes in fact.

#103 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2021-10-22 02:53 PM | Reply

" what is a "use"? That is a vague term."

No it's not. Nor is user. It's just either one of those eviscerate you're stupid insinuation.

#104 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 02:54 PM | Reply

^Your stupid insinuation.

Me and my self-retorting retort!

#105 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 02:55 PM | Reply

"No it's not.'

Then define what one use of a car is. Is driving to the store one mile one use? Is driving 400 miles non stop one us? Obviously the latter has a higher risk of an accident.

So no, "use" is not a nebulous term in the context you aare using it.

"It's just either one of those eviscerate you're stupid insinuation."

Does condescension make you feel all warm and fuzzy and self righteous as it does so many others who vainly depend on it in an argument?

I'll wait for your description of what one use of a car is.

#106 | Posted by jakester at 2021-10-22 03:44 PM | Reply

"Then define what one use of a car is."

Pick any damn definition you want. Then admit 2/3rd of Americans are only contributing to ONE of your sets of numbers.

The pretense cars are more dangerous than guns because more deaths are associated annually with the former requires ignoring the participation rate entirely.

#107 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 03:49 PM | Reply

"The pretense cars are more dangerous than guns..."

I never said that. Condescension. Strike one. Putting words into my mouth. Strike two. Can you get the third strike and back to killfiles all in the matter of a few hours? I don't come here for that ----. I come here for honest debate which you have twice proven to me in the matter of an hour.

"Pick any damn definition you want."

I have. I asked you your definition. Apparently you are not intellectually honest enough to provide it. You'd rather be condescending and put words into people's mouths.

#108 | Posted by jakester at 2021-10-22 03:53 PM | Reply

Does condescension make you feel all warm and fuzzy and self righteous as it does so many others who vainly depend on it in an argument?

#106 | Posted by jakester

FLAG - too dumb to see the irony in posting that

#109 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-10-22 03:53 PM | Reply

I never said that. Condescension. Strike one. Putting words into my mouth. Strike two. Can you get the third strike and back to killfiles all in the matter of a few hours?

#108 | Posted by jakester

You actually think that's a punishment?

That's like threatening someone with a -------.

You and your precious killfiles. Whatever it takes to hide from people who spank you all over every thread.

#110 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-10-22 03:55 PM | Reply

On users:

What is a gun user, Danforth? I have guns, but haven't fired any of them in years. Am I a gun user in your opinion? If so, how long do I have to go without firing a gun before I cease to be one? If not, how often do I have to fire it to be one?

A car user. What's that? The driver only? Or the passengers as well? They are using the car even if they aren't driving it. That's a very important question if one is comparing death per use ratio as you are.

You fail to understand you are using undefined and nebulous variables to make your argument. When one does that, they of course form the definitions to whatever suits their argument. That's not an accurate way to come to a logical conclusion.

#111 | Posted by jakester at 2021-10-22 03:58 PM | Reply

No, Red Votes Do Not Matter there.

Minority votes matter everywhere. Politics isn't just about passing legislation one vote past 50%.

#112 | Posted by rcade at 2021-10-22 04:04 PM | Reply

You fail to understand you are using undefined and nebulous variables to make your argument. When one does that, they of course form the definitions to whatever suits their argument. That's not an accurate way to come to a logical conclusion.

#111 | Posted by jakester

When you're on the wrong side of an arugment, semantics are the weapon of last resort.

If I was trying to argue that guns aren't a problem, I'd probably try and just argue semantics like you do. But I dont undertake stupid arguments like that.

#113 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-10-22 04:11 PM | Reply

You fail to understand you are using undefined and nebulous variables to make your argument. When one does that, they of course form the definitions to whatever suits their argument. That's not an accurate way to come to a logical conclusion.

#111 | Posted by jakester

Further proof that you're goatman. Another coward who'd retreat into semantic arguments.

Maybe it's time for another new username loser.

#114 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-10-22 04:11 PM | Reply

Goatblat be trippin.

#115 | Posted by LegallyYourDead at 2021-10-22 04:35 PM | Reply

"I have guns, but haven't fired any of them in years."

Risky choice for a convinced felon.

#116 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-10-22 04:43 PM | Reply

"Probably worth checking that it was legal to hand a firearm to somebody that was court assigned anger management classes in fact."

So you're supposed to know what classes someone is taking before you hand them a gun... LOL.

#117 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-10-22 04:49 PM | Reply

"Can you get the third strike and back to killfiles all in the matter of a few hours?"

I don't GAF, Goatman.

#118 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 04:58 PM | Reply

Minority votes matter everywhere. Politics isn't just about passing legislation one vote past 50%.

#112 | POSTED BY RCADE AT 2021-10-22 04:04 PM | FLAG:

Feels like Manchin disagrees with you.

#119 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2021-10-22 04:58 PM | Reply

but anyways, terrible idea handing a firearm to somebody with a history of assaults.

Everybody knows you don't point a gun at somebody or something unless you intend to kill it. Playing pretend bites another.

#120 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2021-10-22 04:59 PM | Reply

"Everybody knows you don't point a gun at somebody or something unless you intend to kill it."

Yep. That and making sure you know what your target is are the fundamental rules of gun safety. Another one is to always assume a gun is loaded -- even when you are sure it's not.

#121 | Posted by jakester at 2021-10-22 05:03 PM | Reply

People who are not smart enough to know whether a gun is loaded or not should not be handling them. Nor should people who don't check to see if they are loaded when taking possession of one.

#122 | Posted by jakester at 2021-10-22 05:05 PM | Reply

JAKESTER
Absolutely, consider is ALWAYS loaded.

#123 | Posted by Doc_Sarvis at 2021-10-22 05:06 PM | Reply

"You fail to understand you are using undefined and nebulous variables to make your argument."

Compare the average person's contact with cars vs. the average person's contact with guns.
Include the fact 91% of households have cars, while 44% report having guns.

CDC Stats from 2019

Motor vehicle traffic deaths
Number of deaths: 37,595
Deaths per 100,000 population: 11.5

All firearm deaths
Number of deaths: 39,707
Deaths per 100,000 population: 12.1

Source: National Vital Statistics System " Mortality Data (2019) via CDC WONDER

#124 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 05:09 PM | Reply

JAKESTER
Absolutely, consider is ALWAYS loaded.

#123 | POSTED BY DOC_SARVIS AT 2021-10-22 05:06 PM | FLAG:

If only Alec Baldwin had taken an NRA sponsored firearm safety class.

#125 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2021-10-22 05:12 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"People who are not smart enough to know whether a gun is loaded or not should not be handling them."

Thanks to the Second Amendment, it's illegal to prevent such people from handling guns.

#126 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-10-22 05:13 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"If only Alec Baldwin had taken an NRA sponsored firearm safety class."

Thanks to the Second Amendment, it's illegal to require anyone to take a class in order to handle guns.

#127 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-10-22 05:15 PM | Reply

#124 - 24,000 of those 39,000 you cite were suicides. Suicide by car (typically CO poisoning) is not included in the number you cited. It specifically says "Traffic deaths".

So either include suicide by automobile in your numbers, or exclude suicide by firearms. Do not do so is intellectually dishonest.

#128 | Posted by jakester at 2021-10-22 05:35 PM | Reply

forgot my citation

www.cdc.gov

#129 | Posted by jakester at 2021-10-22 05:36 PM | Reply

"24,000 of those 39,000 you cite were suicides."

So? Does that make guns less dangerous? Or are you cheering for the efficacy of education classes?

"include suicide by automobile in your numbers"

Knock yourself out. You're still ignoring the average uses of a car vs. the averages uses of a gun.

And if you're looking for more specific interactions, count one "use" for every human the gun-carrier encounters, and one for every car the driver encounters.

#130 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 05:51 PM | Reply

Thanks to the Second Amendment, it's illegal to require anyone to take a class in order to handle guns.

#127 | POSTED BY SNOOFY AT 2021-10-22 05:15 PM | FLAG:

He could just google it.

Gun safety knowledge has never been easier to access.

#131 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2021-10-22 05:58 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"You're still ignoring the average uses of a car vs. the averages uses of a gun."

That is not true.

You have proven your dishonesty by not acknowledging the lack of suicide rates by automobiles. (to paraphrase your own words, "Does that make cars less dangerous"? It works both ways)

I have no wish to go down the Danforth rabbit hole, especially when you can't acknowledge the facts of the suicide issue.

Consider your tractor beam of dishonestly out of service.

#132 | Posted by jakester at 2021-10-22 06:00 PM | Reply

A group that's a marketing firm for ammo consumption is also the best resource for firearm safety.

Not the people that license you to possess one.

You have to go to the Parks & Wildlife/Conservation to take Hunter's Safety. It's not free, but it's cheap enough and has firearm safety in it.

#133 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2021-10-22 06:02 PM | Reply

You know, I actually read this whole long thread.

The events sound like the premises of the comedy Only Murder in the Building. Really funny, Steve Martin, Martin Short, and Selina Gomez.

The events are just clich enough to deserve the movie that will definitely be made, is prolly already in production, about these events.

Bad luck for the victims and their families. And whomever f-d up the safety protocols.

But hey, because Balwin is a common target of The New America First Movement/Fascists, LLC, the usual suspects here get to pretend their Hero and His Big Lie isn't the problem, it's someone else.

It's always someone else.

#134 | Posted by Corky at 2021-10-22 06:11 PM | Reply

#131 - and it can be free. The state of Texas offers a free course online, and being online means everyone has access to it. THere are probably many other free courses to be found. There is no excuse for an inexperienced gun owner to not take a firearms safety course.

Fortunately, I was taught gun safety from a very young age. No one has anything to fear from me or my guns unless I find you in my house uninvited with ill intent.

"Free Gun Safety Course

Whether you are a new shooter, or just want to brush up on the fundamentals, gun safety is more important than ever in America. From protecting loved ones to maintaining traditions of hunting and recreational shooting, we want to do our part to reduce accidental injury from firearms. So we offer our class Introduction to Handgun Safety completely free of charge to anyone who is interested, from individuals to college classes to hunt clubs. Every year American Firearms Training gives away almost 5000 free gun safety classes."

www.concealedcarryonline.com

#135 | Posted by jakester at 2021-10-22 06:13 PM | Reply

but anyways, terrible idea handing a firearm to somebody with a history of assaults.

#120 | Posted by sitzkrieg

What about handing the presidency to someone with a history of crimes, scams, and scandals?

#136 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-10-22 06:16 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Good point Speaksoftly, everything Brandon (The Big Guy) has turned crap. Hopefully our elites will do a better job selecting our next President than they did with His Fraudulency.

#137 | Posted by visitor_ at 2021-10-22 06:58 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

What about. ... how about...what if...ya but
How about this?
~lifts up *Braaaap

#138 | Posted by phesterOBoyle at 2021-10-22 07:01 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

Good point Speaksoftly, everything Brandon (The Big Guy) has turned crap. Hopefully our elites will do a better job selecting our next President than they did with His Fraudulency.

#137 | Posted by visitor_

Let me know when he gets a half million americans killed with lies and incompetence, then tries to end democracy because he lost.

Until then, your cult leader is the worst president in history.

#139 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2021-10-22 07:38 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#120 but anyways, terrible idea handing a firearm to somebody with a history of assaults.
Does that apply to soldiers?
I guess that is why they keep the guns locked up on base.

#140 | Posted by bored at 2021-10-22 07:49 PM | Reply

This would not have happened if the directors were armed.
- NRA douche nozzles

#141 | Posted by bored at 2021-10-22 07:49 PM | Reply

That will teach her to film Alec's bad side.

#142 | Posted by bored at 2021-10-22 07:50 PM | Reply

Alec should get a teardrop tattoo

#143 | Posted by GOnoles92 at 2021-10-22 07:52 PM | Reply

"I have no wish to go down the Danforth rabbit hole..."

...he says, from the bottom of the Goatman rabbit hole.

Comparing the safety of cars to the safety of guns is moronic, unless participation rates are factored in.

And anyone who can't stipulate interactions with cars are MUCH more common than interactions with guns is a fekkin' moron.

#144 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 08:21 PM | Reply

"Consider your tractor beam of dishonestly out of service."

Posts the guy who lies about formerly posting as Goatman.

Thanks, dude, but I'll take my common sense approach over your "Let's first pretend we're all stupid" approach any day.

FTW: How much more often do you use your car than your guns? Now add to that the fact almost everyone (over 9/10) has access to cars, and 1/3rd of Americans own guns. Do YOU need a definition of "use" to admit interactions with cars are MUCH more common than interactions with guns?

Or, like Goatman, are you going to pretend to be (beyond) stupid?

#145 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 08:39 PM | Reply

With the advent of CGI, there is no reason whatsoever to have a gun on set that fires blanks. The muzzle flash and "boom" can be inserted during post editing. The only reason they still use blanks is to startle the actors and provide more realistic stimuli to react to ... .and that is not a good enough reason to risk their safety.

#146 | Posted by Miranda7 at 2021-10-22 09:05 PM | Reply

Look at all these righties worried about the safety of Hollywood elite liberals. Touching.

#147 | Posted by bored at 2021-10-22 09:33 PM | Reply

Table 1
Deaths due to carbon monoxide (CO) poisoning by source of CO and manner of death, US, 1998

Manner of death No (%) motor vehicle source* No from all sources
*Deaths with underlying causes of ICD9 E868.2 (unintentional), E952.0 (suicide), and E982.0 (undetermined).
Deaths with underlying causes of ICD9 E868.2, E868.3, E868.8, E868.9 (unintentional); E952.0, E952.1 (suicide); and E982.0, E982.1 (undetermined).
Unintentional 190 (48) 396
Suicide 1329 (79) 1690
Undetermined intent 42 (57) 74
Total 1561 (72) 2160

There you go, 1329 motor vehicle carbon monoxide suicide deaths in 1998.

#148 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-10-22 10:04 PM | Reply

#148 Don't you have to count a lot of single vehicle accidents. That is how my neighbor ended it. At least they didn't hit anyone, just a rock wall.

#149 | Posted by bored at 2021-10-22 10:34 PM | Reply

Absolutely, all manners of suicide by car should be counted. But there's still orders of magnitude more accidental car fatalities than deliberate car suicides.
Which stands in stark contrast to guns.

#150 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-10-22 10:41 PM | Reply

CORRECTION:

In post #5, I posted "... the crew is not a "Tier-1" crew"

The concept is correct, but my nomenclature was wrong.

The production is a "Tier 1" production, which is a SAG-AFTRA designation as a low-budget (>$6MM) film. That means day rates for everyone from performers to grips to...propmasters...are lower. Naturally, this attracts a lower level of crew, especially in a bustling film area like Santa Fe.

My apologies for my error.

#151 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 10:53 PM | Reply

Update from my SF insider:

The entire camera crew had quit that day.

#152 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 11:23 PM | Reply

^Production had problems. No real armorer, only a young 2 person non-union prop department. Entire camera dept quit that day as they hadn't been paid except for Halyna and the Steadicam Op. And of course, gun fired during a rehearsal? Not allowed per safety protocols.

#153 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 11:24 PM | Reply

The entire camera crew had quit that day.

Why?

#154 | Posted by REDIAL at 2021-10-22 11:25 PM | Reply

Oh, FFS.

Crew hadn't been paid, and crew loads live ammo?? Paging Jessica Fletcher!

#155 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-22 11:26 PM | Reply

The entire camera crew had quit that day.
#152 | POSTED BY DANFORTH

I'm not saying this is a crime scene, but there's certainly no shortage of motive.

#156 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-10-23 03:01 AM | Reply

The entire camera crew had quit that day.
#152 | POSTED BY DANFORTH

I'm not saying this is a crime scene, but there's certainly no shortage of motive.

#157 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-10-23 03:02 AM | Reply

Is this what they mean when they say "Shot on location"?

#158 | Posted by TFDNihilist at 2021-10-23 03:45 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

If only there were groups that taught you to treat every gun like it's loaded. Donating an NRA membership to Mr. Baldwin so he can educate himself.

#159 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2021-10-23 08:23 AM | Reply

Why not cut to the chase and just send that NRA dough directly to Wayne LaParee's taxidermist?

#160 | Posted by Doc_Sarvis at 2021-10-23 08:36 AM | Reply

"Look at all these righties worried about the safety of Hollywood elite liberals. Touching.
#147 | POSTED BY BORED"

Nope..
THIS Rightie is concerned that before this is over, the blame will be on honest gun owners, the NRA and Trump.
Put the blame on the loader. Someone suggested this was a 44 magnum. Impossible.
Maybe 45 long Colt.
In either case, real ammo had to be brought in by someone and loaded.
The difference between a blank and live ammo is huge.

#161 | Posted by phesterOBoyle at 2021-10-23 08:37 AM | Reply

A car can generate more KE than a bullet from a handgun so obviously it's more dangerous. Science.

#162 | Posted by visitor_ at 2021-10-23 09:52 AM | Reply

Why not cut to the chase and just send that NRA dough directly to Wayne LaParee's taxidermist?

#160 | POSTED BY DOC_SARVIS AT 2021-10-23 08:36 AM | REPLY | FLAG

It's a free membership...

#163 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2021-10-23 10:14 AM | Reply

The NRA gives them away for free to pad membership numbers.

#164 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2021-10-23 10:14 AM | Reply

How much did Russia donate to the NRA/GQP after this high profile shooting?

#165 | Posted by reinheitsgebot at 2021-10-23 10:27 AM | Reply

One of my favorite pastimes is reading the back-and-forth between site users which always gets down to the number of angels dancing on the head of a pin, or else, "So's your mom!" RETORT is one of my favorite time-holes.

#166 | Posted by john47 at 2021-10-23 11:33 AM | Reply

If only there were laws that taught you to treat every gun like it's loaded.

Sitzkrieg, care to explain why you oppose those laws?

#167 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-10-23 12:07 PM | Reply

I'm not much of gun person but here's a hypothetical. Someone hands you a pistol and tells you it's not loaded. You never confirm it and consequently shoot and kill someone. What's your liability?

#168 | Posted by visitor_ at 2021-10-23 12:12 PM | Reply

Someone hands you a pistol and tells you it's not loaded. You never confirm it and consequently shoot and kill someone. What's your liability?

That's an interesting question in a case like this. Are actors allowed to fiddle with prop guns set up by the prop guy?

#169 | Posted by REDIAL at 2021-10-23 12:33 PM | Reply

Someone hands you a pistol and tells you it's not loaded. You never confirm it and consequently shoot and kill someone. What's your liability?
#168 | POSTED BY VISITOR_

I'd say it's anywhere between 0 and 100, based on circumstances and intent.

In the scenario you describe, the shooter did not seem to display any malicious intent at all. So I'd say, manslaughter at most.

Now, if the person who handed him the gun knew it was loaded, that person can probably be charged with murder.

If a third party surreptitiously loaded the gun to hopefully achieve a murder, that third party can certainly be charged with murder. Assuming they can be identified.

I am pretty sure the shooter will face no charges here.

#170 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-10-23 12:54 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"Are actors allowed to fiddle with prop guns set up by the prop guy?"

Absolutely not. We are NOT TO TOUCH props unless they're ours, and then only when directed.

Other absolutes: no live rounds, and no explosives (including gunshots) during rehearsal.

#171 | Posted by Danforth at 2021-10-23 01:02 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

This reminds me of when Kurt Russell accidentally smashed a priceless antique Martin guitar on set.

Except the right didn't politicize that.

#172 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-10-23 01:07 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

We are NOT TO TOUCH props unless they're ours, and then only when directed.

I suspected as much. I just looked at some of the Canadian rules for film use of firearms and they go on for a long time... you even have to guard against ejected shell casings from semi-autos. Gun handlers do all the loading and unloading and take possession between takes.

Be hard not to check them though. It's pretty unusual for a gun to be loaded in Canada in the first place, but most people who have them would reflexively check anyway.

#173 | Posted by REDIAL at 2021-10-23 01:11 PM | Reply

Look at all these righties worried about the safety of Hollywood elite liberals. Touching.

#147 | POSTED BY BORED AT 2021-10-22 09:33 PM | REPLY

In my 50+ years of gun ownership I've literally owned over 30 firearms and shot at least a metric ton of ammunition. Not one of my guns have ever "accidently" killed anyone and none of my buddies guns I've shot have ever killed anyone.

It would be impossible for me to kill anyone on that set as an actor because I cannot allow myself to point a firearm at anyone who's not trying to kill me or anyone else deserving my protection.

So go ahead and shill. But please hold your liberal god to the same standards as you hold responsible gun owners to.

#174 | Posted by BellRinger at 2021-10-23 01:25 PM | Reply

"Not one of my guns have ever "accidently" killed anyone and none of my buddies guns I've shot have ever killed anyone."

Most gun deaths are suicides, and those aren't considered accidents.

Good luck!

#175 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-10-23 01:36 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

This low budget movie brought in scabs to bust the union and a negligent scab caused injury and death.
Greed kills.

#176 | Posted by bored at 2021-10-23 01:45 PM | Reply

It would be impossible for me to kill anyone on that set as an actor because I cannot allow myself to point a firearm at anyone who's not trying to kill me

Then you wouldn't get the part.

#177 | Posted by REDIAL at 2021-10-23 01:59 PM | Reply

"It would be impossible for me to kill anyone on that set as an actor because I cannot allow myself to point a firearm at anyone who's not trying to kill me or anyone else deserving my protection."

How about Tamir Rice, could you gun him down?
How about Ahmaud Arbery?

#178 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-10-23 02:00 PM | Reply

"negligent"

This is looking more like a setup, than an accident.

As in, a union worker with a grudge decided to teach someone a lesson on their way out the door.

But that's just my opinion.

#179 | Posted by snoofy at 2021-10-23 02:03 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

A brief history of meester ballswine:

1. June 1992: Baldwin called a horse-drawn carriage driver a "f&ggot"at a City Council hearing. The driver supported expanding the carriage routes outside of Central Park.
2. October 1995: After covering his vehicle in shaving cream, Baldwin slapped and broke the nose of a photographer Baldwin was eventually forced to pay damages.
3. December 1998: At the end of an interview on NBC's Late Night with Conan O'Brien, Baldwin exploded into a rant of wishful thinking about joining a mob to murder Republican Henry Hyde and his family:
4. May 2007: Baldwin attacks his own 11 year-old daughter as a "pig":
5. September 2011: In defense of convicted cop-killer Troy Davis, Baldwin lashed out at conservative commentator Michelle Malkin as a "crypto-fascist hater."
6. September 2011: Angry at Starbucks server, Baldwin names the man on Twitter and attacks him as an "uptight queen."
7. December 2011: Baldwin again makes life miserable for the working class with a tantrum on an American Airlines flight
8. April 2012: Baldwin attacks a female news photographer as a "nutty -----."
9. June 2012: Baldwin physically assaults a photographer.
10. June 2012: Baldwin physically and verbally attacks another photographer. After grabbing the man by the arm ...
11. February 2013: Baldwin launches a racist rant against a black photographer who identified himself to Baldwin as a former-New York City police officer
12. June 2013: Baldwin hurls anti-gay slurs at an openly gay reporter, threatens to physically harm him and then calls on his Twitter followers to "straighten out this fv*king little -----."
13. November 2013: Baldwin is caught on video hurling anti-gay slurs at a photographer. Baldwin later claimed he didn't use the word "f&g" (although his story kept changing), and that he didn't know "c**ksucker" was a slur.
14. April 2014: Baldwin tweets homophobic insults to former Mitt Romney aide Garrett Jackson.
15. December 2014: Baldwin attacks the late-Andrew Breitbart, a dead man who cannot defend himself

#180 | Posted by phesterOBoyle at 2021-10-23 03:42 PM | Reply

The director will often take a position directly behind the cinematographer in order to get a better feel of how the scene was playing out.

#181 | Posted by STombs at 2021-10-23 05:49 PM | Reply

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