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Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Tuesday, March 14, 2023

Illinois will become one of three states to require employers to offer paid time off for any reason ...

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Illinois Democrat Governor protecting workers rights.

Arkansas Republican Governor feeding children to industrial machinery.

The two parties are the same, right?

#1 | Posted by Sycophant at 2023-03-14 10:18 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

Is this paid time off for any reason above and beyond vacation time? Hourly workers?

How is forcing paying an employee who isn't working a workers right?

I haven't heard the details of this, and can't open the article atm.

#2 | Posted by kwrx25 at 2023-03-14 11:45 AM | Reply

Sick day, day off to care for sick children or spouse, nunyer bizness day.

You really are an idiot.

#3 | Posted by LegallyYourDead at 2023-03-14 11:53 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

Do you know how to f'n read... I opened with asking if it was for time off above and beyond that you freaking idiot. Just how f'n stupid are you?

#4 | Posted by kwrx25 at 2023-03-14 11:55 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

Stay home and slip the tongue fun day.

#5 | Posted by LauraMohr at 2023-03-14 12:06 PM | Reply

I haven't heard the details of this

Looks like about 6 days off per year based on 8 hour days and 40 hour weeks.

#6 | Posted by REDIAL at 2023-03-14 12:23 PM | Reply

#6 thanks. Is that above and beyond sick and vacation time, or the minimum that must be offered... or some weird combo of the two?

#7 | Posted by kwrx25 at 2023-03-14 12:33 PM | Reply

#6

In modern social democracies it's 30 something days off per year based on a 30 hour werk week.

Not to mention 12-14 mos off for the birth of a child.

So we still have a long way to go, baby.

#8 | Posted by Corky at 2023-03-14 12:38 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

or the minimum that must be offered

It looks like it's a minimum standard.

#9 | Posted by REDIAL at 2023-03-14 12:43 PM | Reply

mandatory vacation, with a finite number seems pretty reasonable. Even as a teenager, bagging groceries I was given 5 days paid leave.

#10 | Posted by kwrx25 at 2023-03-14 12:53 PM | Reply

Where was that and when? I don't find that to be credible. Chapter and verse, company and location with dates, or your FOS.

#11 | Posted by Effeteposer at 2023-03-14 01:23 PM | Reply

Our starting minimum is 80 hours per year. Goes up as far as 240.

#12 | Posted by REDIAL at 2023-03-14 01:50 PM | Reply

I've argued for my employer to just move to a PTO system.

But we're very generous with all of it including a donation bank for sick time.

#13 | Posted by eberly at 2023-03-14 02:06 PM | Reply

Just how f'n stupid are you?

#4 | POSTED BY KWRX25

A helluva lot smarter than you, dumbfuq. Go pound it, loser.

#14 | Posted by LegallyYourDead at 2023-03-14 02:29 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

"But we're very generous with all of it including a donation bank for sick time."

Love it when an employer puts the onus on the employees to cover an unavoidable absence for any given employee and has the nerve to look at it as generosity.

#15 | Posted by Hagbard_Celine at 2023-03-14 02:39 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

Mandatory paid leave to interview for another job?

#16 | Posted by censored at 2023-03-14 03:39 PM | Reply

#11 Shaw's ... Like I would need to make that up?

#17 | Posted by kwrx25 at 2023-03-14 05:13 PM | Reply

#14 do you add anything of value to a discussion ever legallyaloser?

#18 | Posted by kwrx25 at 2023-03-14 05:13 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

San Francisco reparations idea: $5 million per Black person
apnews.com

...Payments of $5 million to every eligible Black adult, the elimination of personal debt and tax burdens, guaranteed annual incomes of at least $97,000 for 250 years and homes in San Francisco for just $1 a family.

These are just some of the recommendations made by a city-appointed reparations committee tasked with a thorny question: What would it take to atone for the centuries of U.S. slavery and generations of systemic racism that continue to keep Black Americans on the bottom rungs of health, education and economic prosperity, and overrepresented in prisons and homeless populations?...



#19 | Posted by LampLighter at 2023-03-14 08:30 PM | Reply

@#18 ... do you add anything of value to a discussion ever? ...

At times, the alias does. Unlike the implicit ad hominess attacks usually present in the comments your current alias posts.


:)

Dave Mason - Let It Go, Let It Flow
www.youtube.com



#20 | Posted by LampLighter at 2023-03-14 08:33 PM | Reply

JB is soft running for pres.
come visit illinois.

#21 | Posted by visiter at 2023-03-15 12:45 AM | Reply

@#21 ... JB is soft running for pres....

Yeah, the presidential season tends to make possible candidates say and do strange things.

I mean, just look at what Gov DeSantis is doing to his state to garner attention.

I mean, killing education? Really?


#22 | Posted by LampLighter at 2023-03-15 01:03 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

#20 show me an example where I'm not replying but initiating

#23 | Posted by kwrx25 at 2023-03-15 06:24 AM | Reply

Good. It's a start.

#24 | Posted by earthmuse at 2023-03-15 06:35 AM | Reply

#1 POSTED BY SYCOPHANT... Illinois Democrat Governor protecting workers rights.
Arkansas Republican Governor feeding children to industrial machinery.

yeah...Arkansas Gov abducts children from playgrounds...takes them to Arkansas gulags

I need off tomorrow...my son has an audition to perform as a 'transkid'

#25 | Posted by rhymegunfighter at 2023-03-15 09:52 AM | Reply

"Illinois Democrat Governor protecting workers rights."

No, the Illinois democrat governor is offering another handout, albeit a small handout.

It plays well with the left, while having little likely impact on employers.

#26 | Posted by madbomber at 2023-03-15 08:52 PM | Reply

"No, the Illinois democrat governor is offering another handout"

How's it compare with the handouts you get from Uncle Sam?

#27 | Posted by snoofy at 2023-03-15 09:00 PM | Reply

Love it when an employer puts the onus on the employees to cover an unavoidable absence for any given employee and has the nerve to look at it as generosity.

#15 | POSTED BY HAGBARD_CELINE

Employee donation bank doesn't kick in until the 4 weeks of vacation and 3 months of sick are exhausted.

So, basically 4 months are available for most folks before that would be necessary.

But you can cry about that if you want.

#28 | Posted by eberly at 2023-03-15 09:03 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

I am sure this won't play well with the people of Illinois!

- - a gaggle of internet jackass's not in Illinois

#29 | Posted by ChiefTutMoses at 2023-03-15 09:20 PM | Reply

"This is great!!"

-worthless min wage morons who would never be a valuable enough employee to earn paid time off

#30 | Posted by eberly at 2023-03-15 09:34 PM | Reply

"How's it compare with the handouts you get from Uncle Sam?"

I haven't gotten any. Yet.

Maybe the Illinois governor can get me some.

#31 | Posted by madbomber at 2023-03-15 11:36 PM | Reply

"-worthless min wage morons who would never be a valuable enough employee to earn paid time off"

Yeah. This whole thing is a bit silly. After a year, a worker would have 52 hours of paid time off available.

If you're an employee worth your salt, is your employer going to fire you because you need to take a day off for a sick kid? Or because you want to go do something fun? Of course not.

That's why this is much ado about nothing.

#32 | Posted by madbomber at 2023-03-15 11:41 PM | Reply

Rwingers prefer big handouts to Big Corporations.

Because, you know, the benefits will trickle down.... ha.

hahahaha!

trickle down has never werked, btw

"In a 2020 research paper, economists David Hope and Julian Limberg analyzed data spanning 50 years from 18 countries, and found that tax cuts for the rich only succeeded at increasing inequality and making the rich wealthier, with no beneficial effect on real GDP per capita or employment.

According to the study, this shows that the tax cuts for the upper class did not trickle down to the broader economy.[31][32][33][34]"

en.wikipedia.org

#33 | Posted by Corky at 2023-03-15 11:43 PM | Reply

"Rwingers prefer big handouts to Big Corporations."

If this was a handout funded by the taxpayers of Illinois...who gives a ----?

But it's not. It's a mechanism to force employers to do something that they may not otherwise do.

#34 | Posted by madbomber at 2023-03-15 11:48 PM | Reply

#33

From an economic perspective, why would "trickle down" work. Just because I am making more money does not mean I am going to pay more for the goods and services I purchase. The fact that I make more money does not explicitly affect the labor value of those whom I would employ.

That said, if I make more money, I am willing to pay more for those goods and services. If the supply doesn't change relative to the demand, then those who are providing goods and services gain an edge in pricing power, and they will have the ability to charge more. And we have seen this occur at both the regional and national levels.

#35 | Posted by madbomber at 2023-03-15 11:52 PM | Reply

It's a mechanism to force employers to do something that they may not otherwise do.

The BC government did that here last year... all workers got 5 paid sick days per year. For our operation that amounts to over 6,000 missed shifts per year.

#36 | Posted by REDIAL at 2023-03-16 12:06 AM | Reply

- From an economic perspective, why would "trickle down" work.

All of your economic Heroes said it would.

"Trickle-down economics is a term used in critical references to economic policies to say they disproportionately favor the upper end of the economic spectrum, i.e. wealthy investors and large corporations.

In recent history, the term has been used broadly by critics of supply-side economics.[1] Major US examples of what critics have called "trickle-down economics" include the Reagan tax cuts,[2] the Bush tax cuts,[3] and the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act of 2017.[4]

Major UK examples include the tax cut policies of Margaret Thatcher,[2] the economic policies of Friedrich Hayek,[5] and Liz Truss's mini-budget tax cuts of 2022.[6]

As of 2023, a number of studies have failed to demonstrate a link between reducing tax burdens on the upper end and economic growth."

en.wikipedia.org

#37 | Posted by Corky at 2023-03-16 12:27 AM | Reply

Anyone else notice that in #35 the poster is talking like they own a company but in #31 they are talking as though they do not?

Another "capitalist" with zero capital..

#38 | Posted by tres_flechas at 2023-03-16 06:47 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

If you're an employee worth your salt, is your employer going to fire you because you need to take a day off for a sick kid? Or because you want to go do something fun? Of course not.
That's why this is much ado about nothing.
#32 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER

You know so little about the private sector. Stick to your government job, government PTO, government healthcare and government pension, loser.

#39 | Posted by JOE at 2023-03-16 08:15 AM | Reply

government job,

#39 | POSTED BY JOE AT

That can't be. He is clearly talking about what a savvy business owner he is and what he does with the profits from said business in post #35...

#40 | Posted by tres_flechas at 2023-03-16 09:00 AM | Reply

"All of your economic Heroes said it would."

Like JFK?

#41 | Posted by madbomber at 2023-03-16 10:50 AM | Reply

"Trickle-down economics is a term used in critical references to economic policies to say they disproportionately favor the upper end of the economic spectrum, i.e. wealthy investors and large corporations."

Of course.

YOu can't really cut taxes for those who don't pay them in the first place.

#42 | Posted by madbomber at 2023-03-16 10:52 AM | Reply

"You know so little about the private sector."

I don't?

I'm an investor. So I'm kinda interested.

#43 | Posted by madbomber at 2023-03-16 11:00 AM | Reply

As for trickle-down working, consider this. The president of American Airlines recently released a memo to it's pilots indicating that their salaries were going to go up. A lot. For a narrow-body captain at the top of the scale, salary increases would be $135k per year ($470k total per year). Salaries for wide-body captains would increase by $170k per year to $590K. This was largely in response to Delta's recent agreement with it's pilots to also increase salaries.

I wouldn't call it trickle-down personally, but there is some mechanism that has driven these firms to drastically increase salaries for their pilots. Additionally, this letter coresponds with a three-point drop in the price of the stock.

#44 | Posted by madbomber at 2023-03-16 11:08 AM | Reply

#44

Anecdote as evidence? Not hardly.

5 Reasons Why Supply-Side Economics Does Not Work

www.investopedia.com

The Problem With Supply-Side Economics

www.forbes.com

#45 | Posted by Corky at 2023-03-16 11:43 AM | Reply

I'm curious how much time the objectors to this law think employers should be legally permitted to extract from their employees regardless of circumstance. Apparently it's "100%."

#46 | Posted by JOE at 2023-03-16 11:51 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

As for trickle-down working, consider this. The president of American Airlines recently released a memo to it's pilots indicating that their salaries were going to go up. A lot. For a narrow-body captain at the top of the scale, salary increases would be $135k per year ($470k total per year). Salaries for wide-body captains would increase by $170k per year to $590K. This was largely in response to Delta's recent agreement with it's pilots to also increase salaries.
I wouldn't call it trickle-down personally, but there is some mechanism that has driven these firms to drastically increase salaries for their pilots. Additionally, this letter coresponds with a three-point drop in the price of the stock.

#44 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER

Ha ha ha. No.

This is a UNION negotiating with American Airlines during a small pilot SHORTAGE and American Airlines trying not to lose pilots to Delta and other carriers. The "mechanism that has driven" this is fierce competition for pilots and a strong union.

But good job! You literally just proved the importance of Unions!

#47 | Posted by Sycophant at 2023-03-16 11:56 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

The article doesn't say specifically, how many workers this will impact. Or at least I didn't find it. However, the article does point out this does not impact people in the Chicago area because this rule was already in place.

I would think this would mostly impact small employers

#48 | Posted by eberly at 2023-03-16 11:59 AM | Reply

#44

"Supply side economics invokes the most basic element of human nature: self-interest. We all seek to improve our material circumstances. The tinier the tax man's bite, the greater is our incentive to produce. As tax burdens lighten, motivation heightens, sparking a robust economy. Allowing producers to enjoy their hard earned gains is both just and effective.

Contrasted with demand side economics it's a no-brainer. It is neither just nor effective to funnel public money to political favorites hoping they will spend lavishly and thus stimulate production. Paying people not to produce inspires little effort. Depriving producers of needed capital so it can instead be transferred according to political whim ridicules the very pretense of stimulus.

Even calling political waste "investments" merely makes the semantics more palatable to gullible voters. Rather than paying people to consume others' wealth hoping this will rejuvenate production, it obviously works far better to let producers enjoy their gains. We will always direct our own resources better than will politicians or their bureaucratic henchman. It's not rocket science. Tax cuts incent production; profligate spending enables sloth and encourages corruption."

Did you even read the article before you posted it?

#49 | Posted by madbomber at 2023-03-16 12:18 PM | Reply

-You literally just proved the importance of Unions!

It's also the reality of a competitive marketplace.

#50 | Posted by eberly at 2023-03-16 12:18 PM | Reply

"I'm curious how much time the objectors to this law think employers should be legally permitted to extract from their employees regardless of circumstance."

Exctract?

#51 | Posted by madbomber at 2023-03-16 12:18 PM | Reply

This is a UNION negotiating with American Airlines during a small pilot SHORTAGE and American Airlines trying not to lose pilots to Delta and other carriers. The "mechanism that has driven" this is fierce competition for pilots and a strong union."

A strong union has nothing to do with it. It is the need for pilots that drives up their pricing power. No matter how strong the union, they would not have been able to negotiate this deal in August of 2020. Or probably August of 2021 for that matter.

Furthermore, this is a perfect use case for why income isn't distribute equally. It's becuase skills are not distributed equally, which means that the ability to earn an income isn't distributed equally. In this case, both narrow and wide-body captains are sitting solidly in the much derided top 1% of income earners, and seeing incomes rise by 40%. And let's not forget that many airline pilots are retired military, getting an additional $60k per year or so in military retirement pay.

FA's have demanded a 35% increase, but they are unlikely to get it. There is an endless list of applicants for those positions, and it only takes a few weeks to produce a new FA. It takes years to train a pilot. And baggage handlers are likely in even less of a position to demand higher wages, as they can be replaced by nearly anyone.

OUr friends in the Piketty camp would tell you this is just another example of the top 1% skimming what should rightly go to lower income earners, but the economic realities paint a different picture.

#52 | Posted by madbomber at 2023-03-16 12:43 PM | Reply

"The article doesn't say specifically, how many workers this will impact."

It states the type of workers. Part-time workers, students, and government employees are exempt from this rule.

Which really means that employers could minimize the effects of the new legislation, if they cared, by limiting the number of full-time employees they hired.

#53 | Posted by madbomber at 2023-03-16 12:45 PM | Reply

this is much ado about nothing.
#32 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER

#26 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER
#31 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER
#34 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER
#35 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER
#41 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER
#42 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER
#43 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER
#44 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER
#49 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER
#51 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER
#52 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER
#53 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER

Jesus christ, lmao

#54 | Posted by JOE at 2023-03-16 02:25 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#49

Yeah, I've read both previously and another dozen like them.

But I went with the conclusions, not just cherry-picking parts.

#55 | Posted by Corky at 2023-03-16 03:42 PM | Reply

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