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Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Friday, September 15, 2023

Margaret Sullivan: US news organizations have turned Biden's age into a scandal and continue to cover Trump as an entertaining side show

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Trump continues to be covered mostly as an entertaining side show - his mug shot! His latest insults! - not a perilous threat to democracy, despite four indictments and 91 charges against him, and despite his own clear statements that his re-election would bring extreme anti-democratic results; he would replace public servants with the cronies who'll do his bidding

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Read: The mainstream media needs to downplay issues effecting progressive politicians in order to not influence moderates who may in turn not vote for progressives.

"We have to be truthful, not neutral," she urged. "I would make sure that you don't just give a platform ... to those who want to crash down the constitution and democracy."

Neutral is truthful.

#1 | Posted by madbomber at 2023-09-16 03:47 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

The drama never ends.

Save Democracy! Part Deux! The Mugshot

#2 | Posted by oneironaut at 2023-09-16 07:29 AM | Reply

Neutral is truthful.

#1 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER

No it is certainly not

One side says sky is blue other side say sky is yellow. Neutrality is not truth. One side is truth and one side is lie

Now do that with

2020 election
Reason for Biden impeachment
Stealing classified documents
January 6
Etc

#3 | Posted by truthhurts at 2023-09-16 09:44 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 7

Neutrality often serves the fascists purpose

#4 | Posted by truthhurts at 2023-09-16 09:45 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

He's too old but he's not Fascist. I'll stay with the one who still stands for democracy.

#5 | Posted by danni at 2023-09-16 10:02 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

"One side says sky is blue other side say sky is yellow. Neutrality is not truth. One side is truth and one side is lie"

Neutrality would be reporting what both sides were saying. If there were conclusions to be drawn, it would be drawn by the viewers.

You seem to be saying that only one side should be presented by the media. Am I interpreting you correctly?

#6 | Posted by madbomber at 2023-09-16 10:50 AM | Reply

"Neutrality often serves the fascists purpose"

And subjectivity often serves what exactly?

#7 | Posted by madbomber at 2023-09-16 10:53 AM | Reply

I mean, I have no doubts that Putin would agree with you completely. People exposed to different position might not make what you would see as the "correct" decision. And then you would need to spend money to imprison them.

That's especially true right now, no? A few polls show Biden losing to Trump in the next election.

What I'm less clear on is whether you think media outlets should choose what to report, or whether the government should regulate what they report.

I'll wait for my answer offline.

#8 | Posted by madbomber at 2023-09-16 11:02 AM | Reply

Neutrality often serves the fascists purpose"
And subjectivity often serves what exactly?

#7 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER

Reality is not subjective.

Reporting without pointing out the lie gives validity to the lie-see the past 30 years of reporting.

The sky is not yellow.

The sky is blue.

When one side says the sky is yellow, they are lying.

It is journalism's responsibility to report reality-that the side saying the sky is yellow is lying.

#9 | Posted by truthhurts at 2023-09-16 11:26 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

"One side says sky is blue other side say sky is yellow. Neutrality is not truth. One side is truth and one side is lie"
Neutrality would be reporting what both sides were saying. If there were conclusions to be drawn, it would be drawn by the viewers.
You seem to be saying that only one side should be presented by the media. Am I interpreting you correctly?

#6 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER

I am saying that presenting lies as anything other than lies is legitimizing the lies.

By legitimizing lies you are actually tilting the field to the liars.

That isn't neutrality.

This is so obvious it makes me wonder why you don't understand it.

Example of how it should be done:

Biden says the sky is blue, ------- (the sexual predator) says the sky is yellow. You can look outside and see the color of the sky. When you were in kindergarten or at latest 1st grade you were taught what is blue and what is yellow. As you can see with your own eyes and we can confirm, the sky is blue. ------- (the sexual predator) is lying to you.

THAT is truthful.

#10 | Posted by truthhurts at 2023-09-16 11:32 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

As opposed to:

Biden says Sky is blue

------- (the sexual predator) says the sky is yellow

You decide

The color blind, the regular blind and the magat stupid will believe the sky is or may be yellow.

THAT is NOT truth, but may be considered neutral

#11 | Posted by truthhurts at 2023-09-16 11:34 AM | Reply

progressive politicians
#1 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER

Biden is not a Progressive.
Biden is an Incrementalist.

#12 | Posted by snoofy at 2023-09-16 11:54 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

And subjectivity often serves what exactly?
#7 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER

Whatever the one using it wants to serve.

#13 | Posted by snoofy at 2023-09-16 11:56 AM | Reply

"You seem to be saying that only one side should be presented by the media."

With your Blue Sky Yellow Sky example, the media should report there sides. What both "sides" are saying, plus the actual sky color they observed.

#14 | Posted by snoofy at 2023-09-16 11:59 AM | Reply

Neutral is truthful.
#1 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER

Parroting a lie isn't truthful.

#15 | Posted by snoofy at 2023-09-16 12:02 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Back in the day, news reporters and opinions reporting was mostly separate.

And the corporations that owned the outlets would lose their best journalists and news anchors if they dared to interfere.

This arrangement was based on the fact that the People owned the public airways, and the right to demand quality unbiased reporting.

Now the media is corporate owned and profit is the motivation, not truth

Of course, it got this way because corporate owned politicians sell air time for pennies on the dollar of what it's worth.

On of the best ideas for campaign finance reform is charging what air time is really worth to pay for public financing.

#16 | Posted by Corky at 2023-09-16 12:10 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

Media of any size is overall just another corporation whether it is "mainstream" or otherwise. Corporations need to make money to survive and please investors. Drama draws viewership/readership whatever the media that means revenue. Mainstream media will do as necessary not as needed.

That said, Biden is too old but too old is better than a wannabe fascist dictator any day. The Democrats don't have another viable candidate IMHO. Neither party has viable candidates any more.

#17 | Posted by GalaxiePete at 2023-09-16 01:27 PM | Reply

#16 | Posted by Corky

And who undid what we had back in the day? It was called the Fariness Doctrine btw. Shortly after it was undone the Fox News platform came into being.

#18 | Posted by GalaxiePete at 2023-09-16 01:29 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

The problem is the media, even the liberal media wants a horse race election. Democratic Landslide victories are not good for ratings. Trump/MAGA is going to lose bigly.

#19 | Posted by a_monson at 2023-09-16 04:13 PM | Reply

18 & 19

Are both spot on.

#20 | Posted by Corky at 2023-09-16 04:21 PM | Reply

If we ever needed the Fairness Doctrine, and I firnly belirve we did, we need it even more today!

#21 | Posted by danni at 2023-09-16 11:06 PM | Reply

"On of the best ideas for campaign finance reform is charging what air time is really worth to pay for public financing."

Absolutely Brilliant! I never heard that before.

#22 | Posted by danni at 2023-09-16 11:17 PM | Reply

@#6 ... Neutrality would be reporting what both sides were saying. ...

Neutrality would also report the substantiation, or lack thereof, for the assertions both sides were saying.

Should the news reporting say...

Some people think the sky is blue, and here are the facts behinds what they say. While others think the sky is yellow, but they've not been able to provide any facts to back up their assertion, so we cannot report any.

Or should the news say...

Some people think the sky is blue. Other think it is yellow. You decide.

????



Should the news encourage knowledge or ignorance?


#23 | Posted by LampLighter at 2023-09-16 11:19 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

@#1 ... Neutral is truthful. ...

That's a pretty substantial comment.

One that needs a lot (A LOT) more substantiation.

Please provide your reasoning.

#24 | Posted by LampLighter at 2023-09-16 11:21 PM | Reply

Some people think the sky is blue, and here are the facts behinds what they say. While others think the sky is yellow, but they've not been able to provide any facts to back up their assertion, so we cannot report any.
Or should the news say...
Some people think the sky is blue. Other think it is yellow. You decide.
????

- gaslighter.

This is biased. 99% of the time both sides have facts.

#25 | Posted by oneironaut at 2023-09-16 11:42 PM | Reply

@#25 ... This is biased. 99% of the time both sides have facts. ...

Really?

99% of the time both sides have facts?

Please show the facts to substantiate that.


#26 | Posted by LampLighter at 2023-09-16 11:51 PM | Reply

Republicans have Alternative facts.

Like the ones OneNut utilizes.

#27 | Posted by ClownShack at 2023-09-16 11:53 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

Alternative facts
en.wikipedia.org

... "Alternative facts" was a phrase used by U.S. Counselor to the President, Kellyanne Conway, during a Meet the Press interview on January 22, 2017, in which she defended White House Press Secretary Sean Spicer's false statement about the attendance numbers of Donald Trump's inauguration as President of the United States. When pressed during the interview with Chuck Todd to explain why Spicer would "utter a provable falsehood", Conway stated that Spicer was giving "alternative facts". Todd responded, "Look, alternative facts are not facts. They're falsehoods."[1]

Conway's use of the phrase "alternative facts" for demonstrable falsehoods was widely mocked on social media and sharply criticized by journalists and media organizations, including Dan Rather, Jill Abramson, and the Public Relations Society of America. The phrase was extensively described as Orwellian, particularly in reference to the term doublethink. Within four days of the interview, sales of George Orwell's novel Nineteen Eighty-Four had increased 95-fold, which The New York Times and others attributed to Conway's use of the phrase, making it the number-one bestseller on Amazon.com.[2]

Conway later defended her choice of words, defining "alternative facts" as "additional facts and alternative information".[3] ...


#28 | Posted by LampLighter at 2023-09-16 11:59 PM | Reply

#24

If Bernie Sanders came out and said the earth was flat, how should the media handle it? reporting that Bernie Sanders thinks the earth is flat, or by not reporting anything on Bernie Sanders said.

If Bernie Sanders says that the rich are getting rich at the expense of the poor, should those words not be repotred?

#29 | Posted by madbomber at 2023-09-17 08:52 AM | Reply

I apologize for my terrible grammar.

#30 | Posted by madbomber at 2023-09-17 09:00 AM | Reply

I often feel like I'm exchanging ideas with a 5 year old who just walked up to me and asked me why he can't walk inside of a mirror when I post here.

#31 | Posted by tres_flechas at 2023-09-17 09:35 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Democracy on the ballot - LOL!

#32 | Posted by MSgt at 2023-09-17 11:31 AM | Reply

" Democracy on the ballot - LOL!"

Please explain why over half your Republican compatriots believe the 2020 election was stolen from Trump.

#33 | Posted by Danforth at 2023-09-17 11:33 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Democracy on the ballot - LOL!

#32 | POSTED BY MSGT

Democracy! What a joke.

-maga maroons.

#34 | Posted by donnerboy at 2023-09-17 11:33 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"With Democracy on the Ballot, the Mainstream Press Must Change Its Ways"

Looks like I'm going to have to reiterate this from now until Nov 2024:
Capitalism does not require Democracy. It can work just fine under Fascism.

Now if you believe the lifeblood of America is not so much Capitalism, but more accurately Free Enterprise, as pimped by the American Enterprise Institute -- then you would want to ensure America remains a Democracy.

#35 | Posted by snoofy at 2023-09-17 11:37 AM | Reply

#33 | Posted by Danforth

Can't, won't, believes it anyway.

#36 | Posted by Angrydad at 2023-09-17 12:00 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Neutral is truthful.
#1 | POSTED BY MADBOMBER

So if one person says Donald Trump is a rapist and another person says Donald Trump is not a rapist then how does neutrality on those positions equal truthfulness?

Do you not believe there is a journalistic obligation to point out the fact that a New York court found Trump to be a rapist?

#37 | Posted by johnny_hotsauce at 2023-09-17 12:27 PM | Reply

Sometimes neutrality is tantamount to stupidity.

#38 | Posted by moder8 at 2023-09-17 12:45 PM | Reply

Republicans have Alternative facts.

Like the ones OneNut utilizes.

#27 | POSTED BY CLOWNSHACK

Makes one wonder when the Alternate MAGAGoogle will make its appearance.

It return searches with "maga facts" only.

#39 | Posted by donnerboy at 2023-09-17 12:46 PM | Reply

Truth is absolute. It never is up for debate. The political class and media that now works for them, instead of exposing them, kinda like that concept of selective reporting.

#40 | Posted by Robson at 2023-09-17 01:31 PM | Reply

"Truth is absolute. It never is up for debate."

Prove it:
Why did Russia invade Ukraine?

#41 | Posted by snoofy at 2023-09-17 01:33 PM | Reply

Back in the day, news reporters and opinions reporting was mostly separate.

#16 | POSTED BY CORKY AT 2023-09-16 12:10 PM | FLAG:

This is historically illiterate nostalgia fallacy.

#42 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2023-09-17 01:39 PM | Reply

This is a dumb thread, as most progressive ones are.

Until I hear a progressive/liberal media outlet report that a man is physically incapable of being a woman (which is fact), they have no credibility with me.

#43 | Posted by boaz at 2023-09-17 01:43 PM | Reply

This is a dumb thread, as most progressive ones are.
Until I hear a progressive/liberal media outlet report that a man is physically incapable of being a woman (which is fact), they have no credibility with me.

#43 | POSTED BY BOAZ

See boaz, this is a YOU problem and not a we problem.

You see, the experts, you know the one's who study the matter have concluded, based on many studies, lots and lots of data, that gender and sex are different things. I get it, you cannot accept that. Many people can't. But that does not make them not facts. You are not entitled to facts that are not facts. Your opinion is wrong. Period full stop. You do not get to define gender vs sex. Society does. and society has weighed in on the matter and using reason and the scientific method has concluded that gender and sex are different things.

I get it truth hurts.

#44 | Posted by truthhurts at 2023-09-17 01:51 PM | Reply

"a man is physically incapable of being a woman (which is fact)"

Which physical capability did you have in mind, and is that all it means to be a man to you?
Is a boy physically incapable of being a man?
How about a man that has been castrated?

#45 | Posted by snoofy at 2023-09-17 01:55 PM | Reply

#43 | POSTED BY BOAZ

We've seen the trash you post here and know what you think is valid "news".

You are an insurrection supporting traitor who spreads nothing but lies and hate.

#46 | Posted by johnny_hotsauce at 2023-09-17 02:04 PM | Reply

"Truth is absolute. It never is up for debate."

lol. Are you absolutely sure of that?

Define "Truth".

There are some absolute truths like gravity and math (2+2 always equals 4) and then there are relative truths like beauty or religion. Christianity can be truth for you but false for me. A religion and it's dogma can be an absolute truth for some but a relative truth for others. Depending on what country or century you are born into as to how "true" it really is at the time.

Relative truths basically are conditional, subjective, varying and contradictory, and change over time.

#47 | Posted by donnerboy at 2023-09-17 02:34 PM | Reply

If Trump somehow gets reelected, I will very seriously have to consider early retirement, and moving to Ireland or Canada. I will be DONE with a people so stupid as to reelect him again, and doing so will destroy this nation, so it will be time to leave anyways...

#48 | Posted by earthmuse at 2023-09-17 02:57 PM | Reply

I'm not sure it's possible for corporate media to be more Pravda for the left and Dems than they are now.

Think about this: When the impeachment inquiry was launched the White House wrote an open letter to the media instructing then to scrutinize the ---- out of the inquiry. A functional media would have screamed, "How dare you assume we are going to do your bidding???!!!!???" So far they've said nothing and a few outlets followed their marching orders.

Now it's being put forth that they are insufficiently carrying water for Democrats???

Jesus.

#49 | Posted by BellRinger at 2023-09-17 04:22 PM | Reply

A functional media would have screamed, "what is the evidence of a crime? Any crime?"

#49 | POSTED BY BELLRINGER

They did.

And what was the response?

They also asked why the honorable speaker didn't follow through with his pledge to have a vote instead of just launching it.

What was his answer?

#50 | Posted by tres_flechas at 2023-09-17 04:54 PM | Reply

www.axios.com

Ken Buck (R - -------------) seems to think the honorable speaker is 20 votes light, #49.

I wonder why he'd say such a thing, #49.

#51 | Posted by tres_flechas at 2023-09-17 05:01 PM | Reply

The Americans who vote for Trump don't realize that of he wins it is the LAST election their vote will matter. You put him in - he's there entrenched for life. Like a good facsist dictator there is absolutely no way to get rid of him. He will have the Supreme Court votes to rig elections and destroy democracy. Fox and the army of right wing media that rule most of this countries airwaves are already on board with the coordinated widespread relentless deception. Plenty of seditious traitors to carry out his plan.

#52 | Posted by AlternateFacts at 2023-09-17 05:05 PM | Reply

Trump and his minions know the establishment media traditionally follow a both-sides approach to the news. They have found that consumers of right-wing media are easily manipulated and that truth is no longer the key to winning the argument.

Thanks to the cover given them by inherently dishonest right-wing media such as Fox, Newsmax, talk radio, Alex Jones, etc., constantly broadcasting the kind of paranoid, conspiratorial garbage that was once found only in the outer-space-alien pages of grocery store tabloids, the Trumpian strategy is simply to stop doing business in the marketplace of ideas and peddle thinly disguised partisanship instead.

Since lazy mainstream media insist on "equal" treatment, Trump's GOP knows that their lies will receive coverage more or less equivalent to the facts. So the millions of people trained to disbelieve everything they see or hear from the mainstream media or established sources in government, science, history, or education simply ignore it and go along with whatever claims right-wingers make, no matter how obviously false it is. Fighting this nakedly cynical strategy is tough.

#53 | Posted by cbob at 2023-09-17 05:10 PM | Reply

" Trump and his minions know the establishment media traditionally follow a both-sides approach to the news."

Not for the last couple of decades. Not even close. NYT is barely distinguishable from MSNBC or Fox on the right. It's ridiculous.

#54 | Posted by BellRinger at 2023-09-17 05:53 PM | Reply

Not for the last couple of decades. Not even close. NYT is barely distinguishable from MSNBC or Fox on the right. It's ridiculous.
#54 | POSTED BY BELLRINGER

How lazy can you be? Provide specifics.

#55 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2023-09-17 05:54 PM | Reply

Provide specifics.

#55 | POSTED BY RSTYBEACH11

There's the rub.

He wants them to report that the politicians he supports are sane and rational instead of telling the wide world that they are 1 rung on the ladder above -------- in their hands, rubbing it on face, and then telling the media that it's war paint.

And then he wants the media to dutifully report that his brave heroes are wearing war paint to go to battle against the communist heathens.

#56 | Posted by tres_flechas at 2023-09-17 06:01 PM | Reply

Just know that over the next few weeks when you see the honorable speaker of the house walking around with shame in his eye waiting for the day when the lunatics finally put him out of his misery that he's a brave warrior fighting the pedophile groomer demonrats!

#57 | Posted by tres_flechas at 2023-09-17 06:20 PM | Reply

Get out of your ideological bubbles. You'll see it.

#58 | Posted by BellRinger at 2023-09-17 09:29 PM | Reply

Re read #49. How in the world does the WH issue a demanding letter dictating how an issue should be covered and not only wows there are zero pushback but some actual compliance *cough* *CNN* *cough*

#59 | Posted by BellRinger at 2023-09-17 09:32 PM | Reply

Imagine the reaction had a GOP WH sent that letter.

You're probably thinking, "What message?" And are proving my point bigly.

#60 | Posted by BellRinger at 2023-09-17 09:34 PM | Reply

#60 | POSTED BY BELLRINGER

Now YOU'RE going to play the "imagine if the other party did this!" canard?

Thought you were better than that. Fooled me!

#61 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2023-09-17 09:36 PM | Reply

#56 | POSTED BY TRES_FECES

Oh please Feces, all he/she/they is implying is that the media has a liberal leaning bias and tends to stick to the same narratives.

Have you noticed the trend to dump Joe Biden? Morning Joe? WaPo? NyTimes?

Have you ever heard of the Journolist?
en.wikipedia.org

You think today it doesn't exist? If you believe that, your alias should be QuatreFeces

Why is the same thing always the headlines?

#62 | Posted by oneironaut at 2023-09-17 10:17 PM | Reply

Side note of some concern to those on the left...several left leaning sites
Rawstory, Alternet, etc... seem to have been either hacked or suddenly shut down.
Both reporting error code... will have to checknother sites out as well. See if this is a coordinated attack....

#63 | Posted by earthmuse at 2023-09-17 10:24 PM | Reply

#62

Nobody cares, stooge. You're toast.

#64 | Posted by LegallyYourDead at 2023-09-17 10:28 PM | Reply

It does seem to be a coordinated attack on left leaning news sites....Commondreams.org seems to be affected too...

#65 | Posted by earthmuse at 2023-09-17 10:31 PM | Reply

" Thought you were better than that. Fooled me!

#61 | POSTED BY RSTYBEACH11 AT 2023-09-17 09:36 PM | FLAG: "

Did you read the letter? Did you see the complete lack of reaction? Did you see a few outlets take their marching orders?

You have no idea what I'm talking about; which is hilarious and telling. It happened this past week.

#66 | Posted by BellRinger at 2023-09-17 10:46 PM | Reply

You have no idea what I'm talking about
#66 | POSTED BY BELLRINGER

I know exactly what you're talking about, which was the contextual basis of my response.

WTF?

#67 | Posted by rstybeach11 at 2023-09-17 11:00 PM | Reply

If you know what I'm talking about then how in the hell are you not ripping our media to shreds for a complete lack of a response to a letter that is so incredibly condescending to their industry?

That letter is straight up giving marching orders and at least one outlet was very happy to oblige with a couple of others like WaPo chipping in.

Pravda was more subtle.

#68 | Posted by BellRinger at 2023-09-18 05:36 AM | Reply

You think today it doesn't exist?

#62 | POSTED BY ONEIRONAUT AT

I think the fact that the media doesn't tell the wide world that the politicians he supports are lunatics who are 1 rung on the ladder above -------- in their hands, rubbing it on face, screaming that it's war paint, and then marching off to fight the groomer, pedo, demonrats!!! is a sure sign that there is bias in the media.

#69 | Posted by tres_flechas at 2023-09-18 08:16 AM | Reply

It's the same thing, over and over.

Remember the lead up to the Iraq war?

The Bush administration would leak BS to their stenographers at the New York Times and then The New York Times would dutifully report it every Sunday.

Then Bush administration officials would make their rounds on every Sunday talk show and say things like "even the liberal New York Times is reporting that...."

Even after this scheme was exposed idiots who post here still pretend that the media is in the bag for Democrats.

#70 | Posted by tres_flechas at 2023-09-18 08:42 AM | Reply

NBC and meet the press had 3 full days to facts check the lies in the Trump interview that they aired yesterday.

They did t even give so much as a warning that it was full of lies.

They just dutifully showed it to the masses.

#71 | Posted by tres_flechas at 2023-09-18 10:57 AM | Reply

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