I'm trying to make this clear. You are being obtuse. I would not have voted for Hillary,she has shown bad judgement on many things in my opinion. Both as SOS and as a co equal partner with Bill. That said,if the election had been seen as close I would not have voted for Trump.

That doesn't mean I would have voted for Hillary even if I knew Trump would win.

I just don't like the Clinton's,I'm glad the back has been broken on their dynasty.

Was it worth it,given the horrors of Trumpism? I'm not sure.

I still never would have voted FOR her even if I knew the future.

I just wouldn't have voted.

Libya,the Serbian bombing by NATO,the Rwandan massacres,Waco. NAFTA, Glass Steagal, Bill Clinton was a fool and debauched to boot.

Hillary enabled it all. Her judgement was shown to be totally lacking. She ran on Bill's coattails,not as a person in her own right. She never renounced the Clintonian worldview.

So no, I don't feel that she would have necessarily been better than Trump.

She might have started a major shooting war in Iran or elsewhere.

Even if not,she's a turd. Arrogant, hypocritical, totally full of her own self importance, she's no better than the Dotard himself.

I should have stood down in disgust in 2016.

There was no one running worth voting for.

The 100,000,000 people who stayed home that year were the wise ones.

Like Venezuela,they should have declared the elections invalid due to low voter turnout.

The USA,some beacon of democracy,what a sad joke that is.

The polls said Hillary,"couldn't" lose,that she had a lock on victory. I figured, who could it hurt? Obviously,I was seriously wrong.

I have always felt, since I that vote, like someone who voted for HITLER in 1932 must have felt when they realized they had unleashed a Moloch on the world. Many in Germany committed suicide from that shame. Many others were haunted for life by the guilt of their actions.

I understand the gravity of my error. I voted half cocked,without reflection about the consequences.

This will not happen again. I will never vote frivolously and carelessly again.

I will admit I knew little about Trump's past in 2016, I don't have a TV and don't follow celebs much. He was seemingly antiwar and humbled the Bushes,which I loved. I did detect some things about him that were suspect and I only voted for him because I hated Hillary and everyone said she had no chance of losing.

In fact, Hillary won the state of Virginia,so my vote never actually helped Trump,but I still bear that stain. I should have abstained from voting for president that year.

I would never have voted for Hillary.

My "support" of Trump was purely negative in nature,defined more by who he ran against than who he was.

Any other democrat,but Hillary, would have gotten my vote.

No doubt about that.

You hate Trump? Blame the corruption of the DNC, that's why we got the Dotard.

Any other democrat would have kicked his ass.

Why not? Sentience is ineffable,even minerals could be sentient in a way we cannot understand.

Even the coal you mine could have awareness that is unmeasurable. I'm not saying that's the case.

Only that we don't know.

Solipsism,the belief,that only YOU exist,that only your mind is real, or has any meaning, sums you up pretty well. Self centered to the core.

Looks like I pegged you dead on,even Trump himself isn't that stupid,I hope.

I looked it up, solipsism has got to be the most bullshit, unrealistic, philosophy I have ever heard of. Of course other minds exist and have meaning. How could they not?

No man is an island,however much he might want to be. I live a largely solitary life,and I can say with conviction,that solipsism is not reality. It is a pipe dream cooked up by solitary thinkers who can't get over themselves.

Sound familiar?

One vote, 4 years ago, that I deeply regret,that I have never lied about casting,does not a Trumper make. You claim to be above pigeonholing people, that's a laugh. You are sanctimonious,vain and never admit error,all character flaws displayed abundantly by the Dotard.

You think you're way more clever than you actually are. It's a common failing.

Fact is, you bring something,but no more than anyone else here.

Get over yourself little Donnie. You have all of his flaws with none of his charisma.

Pot calling the kettle black,snoofster,you're insulting as hell all the time. Willowby has a valid point,you sanctimonious piece of shit.

What do You bring besides tiresome sanctimony to the conversation?,oh,I forgot,bad sarcasm.

She be smokin', smolderin', too bad the Dotard can't touch that.

He's not her type.

It's a ---- and ass world, guy,she's got a bright future ahead if she stays out of prison,which I doubt.

We need de-trumpification now. Without it, all hope is lost. The monsters are waiting,they will be back,Bwaa-ha-ha!

One less.

That ancient -------- is more valuable than Trump's whole presidency.

One small -------- for dinosaurs,one great ------- for humanity.

It's the schools man,we need re-education, we need to get people to see their own self interest,not be dopes for Trump. Larn'em,larn'em good. Then they'll vote correctly,for their corporate servitude,oops,that's all there is on offer anyway. Corporations are people too,my friend. They own the government and most of the populace already.

We need to find a way to destroy corporations,they have already destroyed our society,and the consolidation of their influence is only accelerating,by the day.

I did,to my shame.But it was less about liking Trump in ANY way than HATING all things Clinton.

Trump did build that type of coalition,so clearly it CAN be done.

The Dems just need to bottle the lightening,get our own demigogue,like you have been saying for a while,hopefully they wouldn't be a total ----------- Trump.

Just kidding,a demigogue is the last ------- thing we need. However,if there has to be one,I'd rather he or she was liberal and environmentally correct than not,LOL.

They need to build a diverse coalition of rich and poor. But how? You tell me?

If the Dems could get the poor whites,they would be unstoppable. But they despise poor whites. It's not the poor ------- the unwoke socially conservative part. If they could focus on economic issues and cut abortion,and social uplift loose,they would be more able to win and make policy.

Shaming people doesn't win votes,it earns enemies. The poor of all races have more in common than the poor do with the rich.

Use that.

Trump is untouchable? He is our true leader! The steal must be stopped and reversed! A restoration of the true president is at hand.

Who's gonna be Oliver Cromwell in this?

It's a punishment for crimes. Also a crime in itself,which is perverse in a way. But then murder is a crime that is punished with death,so there's that,I guess?

All slavery is bad? Who knew?

Bork em', no military leaders at the DoD.

Liz Cheney should be primaried,any reason will do,or none at all. People seem to forget what turds the Cheney's are. Just about anyone would be an improvement. Even if they're worse they're still not her.

It's all good.

Umm,No. I don't think so.

Are you a hater? Snoof? Seems to me you are,should I ---- your feelings? Why on earth would anyone want to do that?

Bit big fer yer britches,buckwheat. Don't you think?

---- off.

Bingo.