" run some numbers using that info?"

Okay, let's add stuff:

Still using 70yr olds w/max SS. $122,600.

Add $13,000 in wages, add $2,400 in overtime, add $25,000 in tips.

$163,000 of income. ZERO federal income taxes due.

===

That said, the above scenario would pay $3100 in PAYROLL taxes during the year.

"Multiple advanced warnings 12+ hours in advance"

Idependant, everything you posted in #8 was spot-on. Nice analysis; It shows you've got a full understanding.

Frankly, I'm a bit stunned by the numbers I'm running; they're from BEFORE the additional 12K reduction of taxable income for seniors.

WITH the higher deduction, the qualified dividends could be $28,500, in addition to the $122,600 Social Security ...

And ZERO income taxes due.

Holy Fakk!

For a married couple, I ran the most extreme numbers I could find: maxing out every year, waiting until 70 to start ...

Just under $122,600 income. ZERO federal taxes due.

Even another $6,250 in interest wouldn't trigger income taxes.

Or $10,000 in dividends ... as long as at least $6900 are qualified dividends (Abbott, J&J, Walmart, et Al=all 100% qualified)

"How is it a contradiction?"

Well, Paul is saying "Let them die".

Bill is saying Jesus taught otherwise. Contradiction.

Actually, I think the two of you agree.

" it's not because I want it to. It's because people keep hammering away at me. Mocking God, calling Jesus a myth, acting like faith is for the weak and gullible. And the more I hear it, the more I feel like I'm being worn down."

Bill, I'm sure I'm one of the many you feel are "beating you down". For that, I apologize. I always try to have solid reasoning behind my questions, but I'm sure I fail at times.

Your faith is strong, for good reason. Don't give up hope.

"How is it misleading when nearly 9 in 10 (88%) Social Security beneficiaries won't pay income taxes on their benefits in the future?"

Because folks who ONLY get social security already pay ZERO federal income taxes. Even a couple getting the max $5,108/mo, total ~$122,500 income; ZERO income taxes. That's CURRENT law.

It takes other income to make Social Security taxable.

Also...be careful about the results the Trump Administration is claiming: everything in the BBB assumes 4% annual growth.

One analyst company admitted it was "many times the projections". Meanwhile, Deloitte is predicting growth lower than inflation.

One more thing: the income level at which SS becomes taxable has remained unchanged since the inception ... while most other caps and provisions are tied to COLAs, and rise every year.

Refusing to raise the cap is a de-facto annual tax increase.

It's the same thing I see on a state level, when year after year, refund credits (eg, for property taxes) keep the same income cap. More folks cease to qualify every year simply because they got a bump in Social Security.

" Even a pair of 70 yr olds getting the max $5108/mo CURRENTLY pay ZERO in federal income taxes."

Two things.

One, that's how it already is: if your only income is SS, you pay no federal income tax.

Two, if you have other income, it starts making SS taxable very quickly, where the first level is 35% of SS becomes taxable, then 50% taxable at the second level, then 85%. And if you're in a pocket where that percentage jumps levels, you might go from an expected 12% marginal rate to, say, a 31% rate on that last $1000.

Bottom line: Social Security, by itself, isn't taxable. It's OTHER income which makes it taxable. Generally speaking, the higher the other taxable income, the larger percentage of SS will be taxable.

"You get a tax credit. If you qualify."

There is no specific tax break for Social Security.

There will be a temporary $6K additional standard deduction for those 65 or older, whether they're on SS or not. That, along with income caps, means the benefits are limited. They'll also expire before Trump leaves office, just like with tips and overtime.

BTW, anyone who ONLY gets Social Security will owe no income tax. Even a pair of 70 yr olds getting the max $5108/mo CURRENTLY pay ZERO in federal income taxes.

On $122,000 of income.

" Now do the "democrats wanted to raise them (taxes)" part."

Why blame Dems, instead of the authors who wrote the rates returning?

And if you're running deficit budgets, and extend expiring tax cuts ... aren't you just borrowing more and more???

" Yep. The Holocaust was just a bunch of Jews enjoying a sauna compared to J6."

You're the only one making that dishonest claim, and always when you don't want to deal with the fact the J6 riot was 100% violent (based on the BLM barometer), while the BLM protests were only 7% violent.

You've even been dishonest enough to compare damage done in 11,000 protests versus ONE J6.

And underlying it all: your refusal to differentiate between a legitimate protest against second-class citizenry, and a riot based on a lie, purposely designed to overturn a legitimate election.

" be sure to keep a count Corky, I know how you kept track of the 835 brown kids Biden actually killed."

What a riot. The last thing you want is for Corky to keep track. 835 will be a pittance to Trump's millions.

And your reasoning itself is bogus: you want others to be VERY UPSET (rightfully) at those deaths ... but only so you can excuse much worse.

It's the putrid intersection of Whataboutism and Watercarrying.

"Today Trump announced plan to charge international tourists more than citizens to enter USA parks."

FINALLY! A tariff NOT paid by Americans.

"The Trump administration is sending 200 Marines to Florida"

Notice it's a red state, run by a Republican Governor, and (if they're in Miami) a Republican Mayor.

"Biden was an objectively terrible president."

Absolutely!

He inherited Trump's Covid disaster, and handed off full employment, and an economy "the envy of the world".

Terrible!

He brought down inflation further and faster than any of the G7 nations.

Unforgivable!

(Meanwhile, Trump wanted the third stimulus to be 42% larger than Biden's. What would've happened to inflation, class? HIGHER than it was, or LOWER than it was?)

"You are actually one of the individuals who probably will benefit off Trump the most."

Total nonsense. Her facility is likely one which will be closed. And she has no income tax to "save".

What moron "news" outlets are feeding you this crap?

"Did you know that some people on Social Security and Medicaid would get tax breaks? "

There are no tax breaks for folks on Social Security. There's an additional standard deduction for folks 65 and older, but that's subject to income limits, and expires the month Trump is set to leave office. Same with overtime and tips: any breaks end three weeks before Trump's term ends. Meanwhile, the corporate tax cuts, and the cuts aimed at the wealthiest, have been made permanent.

And virtually no person on Medicaid pays income taxes. Medicaid benefits are not treated as taxable income. They'd have to have "other" sources of income, like wages. Any "investments" would've had to be spent before qualifying for Medicaid.

What moron "news" outlet is claiming otherwise? Let me guess: it's one of the ones who only give you HALF the equation.

" ... if you Democrats really care about the debt - which you don't - you will now push for cuts in government spending. "

You're cheering an additional $4-$6 Trillion in new borrowing, mostly going in tax cuts for the world's wealthiest.

Yes or no: if you extend expiring tax cuts while running annual deficit budgets,, does that represent trillions of NEW borrowing?

These morons are acting like tax cuts are free.

Tax cuts while running deficits represent government spending.

"Trump racked up $4T."

Sorry. No Republican Math allowed.

Your claim a lie.

" Trump's tariffs could cut deficit by $2.8 trillion over next decade - with caveats"

The caveat being 100% of those tariffs are taxes, and 100% are paid by Americans.

"the debt grew by $8.4 trillion during Trump's first term"

I stand corrected.

ScottS is trying to say $9 trillion is HORRIBLE. But a number that rounds to $9 trillion with interest, is Trumpian!

"not only did (Biden) add $9T to the federal debt..."

What a riot.

Trump added $7.8 Trillion, and he didn't have to pay interest on Trump's debt like Biden had to pay.

" Where the fiscal conservatives pushing back on this?"

Turns out they were never fiscal conservatives. They were partisan hacks.

These are the same folks who would be SCREECHING if Biden had suggested these deficits.