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Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Sunday, June 30, 2024

After years of reporting on forever chemicals, ProPublica reporter Sharon Lerner had one question that still nagged at her. She knew that a handful of 3M scientists and lawyers had learned in the 1970s that the chemical PFOS had seeped into the blood of people around the country and that company experiments around that time had shown that PFOS was toxic. But the company kept making the compound until 2000. How, she wondered, had 3M kept its dark secret for decades?

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to make enough money to last your family for generations, you just ---- up other peoples families for generations

#1 | Posted by brerrabbit at 2024-06-30 05:06 PM | Reply

Will this turn into for 3M what PCBs turned into for General Electric?

Hudson River cleanup: Why Scenic Hudson claims GE could owe Hudson Valley billions (2022)
www.poughkeepsiejournal.com

... Three years ago this week, the Environmental Protection Agency announced it would not require General Electric to continue dredging toxic PCBs from the Hudson River, and certified that the company "properly performed" the restoration steps with which it was tasked.

Amid widespread criticism from environmental groups and government leaders, then-EPA Regional Administrator Pete Lopez asserted the certification does not "let GE off the hook," promising studies in the coming decades will fully evaluate if those steps were effective in remedying the harm the company caused. ...


So, we don't yet know if GE is really off the hook of responsibility for their pollution of the Hudson River with PCBs. fwiw, the first decision against them occurred in 2002.

Hudson River PCB cleanup timeline: How GE cleanup began (2019)
www.poughkeepsiejournal.com

... Here's a timeline of the cleanup:

2002 " The EPA releases a Record of Decision, identifying the impact and remedies for cleanup of the Hudson River. It identifies PCBs as contamination and called for dredging.

2006 " GE signs a consent decree with the EPA, an agreement for a cleanup. While responsible for the entire 197-mile Superfund site, the cleanup is focused on 40 miles of the Upper Hudson.

2009-2015 " GE performs dredging. ...


Also, fwiw, this is why Republicans are so against Federal agencies. Those agencies hold corporations accountable for the actions of those corporations.



#2 | Posted by LampLighter at 2024-06-30 07:07 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

I worked at 3M and it was well known in the 80's that people had low concentrations of the things in their bodies. There was just no data to indicate they were toxic in the concentrations people had in their system. In fact for a long time it was difficult to detect and the guy who worked down the hall from me developed methods to pick it up back then. I know they are toxic for people who have high exposure to the compounds like people that drink well water near the manufacturing plants but for the general public it isn't there. They should definitely do everything they can to replace the compounds with other material, especially in the food packaging applications they use it for and I know they dropped one of the compounds which was more toxic in the 90's but they are important compounds to people in the fire fighting business and I think still for fabric treatments.

#3 | Posted by danS at 2024-06-30 11:27 PM | Reply

@#3 ... I worked at 3M and it was well known in the 80's that people had low concentrations of the things in their bodies. There was just no data to indicate they were toxic in the concentrations people had in their system. ...

How 3M Executives Convinced a Scientist the Forever Chemicals She Found in Human Blood Were Safe (May 20, 2024)
www.propublica.org

... Decades ago, Kris Hansen showed 3M that its PFAS chemicals were in people's bodies. Her bosses halted her work. As the EPA now forces the removal of the chemicals from drinking water, she wrestles with the secrets that 3M kept from her and the world. ...

If there was no data to indicate they were toxic, then why did 3M execs apparently try to suppress that information?

#4 | Posted by LampLighter at 2024-06-30 11:36 PM | Reply

"There was just no data to indicate they were toxic in the concentrations people had in their system."

There was no data saying they were toxic.

Sounds like there was also no data saying they were safe?

#5 | Posted by snoofy at 2024-07-01 12:04 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

@ Lamplighter
I am pretty sure they did animal studies on the materials when they first came out with them and the conclusion was drawn from the result. I do know in the late 90's they did an animal study on the PFOA's versus a similar compound PFBA and found the PFOA's to be more toxic than the PFBA's and they decided to stop manufacturing the PFOA's It could be why they were more sensitive about releasing data on the PFOA's. They could have handled it better but in the long run I think you are going to find this is treated like the PCB problem with GE. Almost no one is being exposed to toxic levels of this stuff and so once it drops out of the news cycle for a while not much is going to be done.

#6 | Posted by danS at 2024-07-01 12:33 AM | Reply

"...o once it drops out of the news cycle for a while not much is going to be done"

Not true at all. PFAS are becoming an issue at the State regulatory level. The compounds are being handled like any other contaminant-though remediation is more difficult.

#7 | Posted by truthhurts at 2024-07-01 12:36 AM | Reply

@#6 ... I am pretty sure they did animal studies on the materials ...

"I am pretty sure..."

So, you got nothing besides what you might want to believe?

What else yer got?

Links would be helpful.

thx.




#8 | Posted by LampLighter at 2024-07-01 12:40 AM | Reply

@#7 ... Not true at all. PFAS are becoming an issue at the State regulatory level. ...

Yeah.

And, also to the comment you are replying to, GE's PCBs are still an issue.

GE's PCBs may not be headlines, but the reporting is still with us.

For starters, see my #2.

Another example, less than a year old...

In Albany, Gillibrand Demands The EPA Take Action To Clean Up PCB "Forever Chemicals" In The Hudson River (February 2024)
www.gillibrand.senate.gov

#9 | Posted by LampLighter at 2024-07-01 12:47 AM | Reply

No links on the study. They are company documents. I am assuming they did because the results for the animal studies were reported extensively in the 90's and the chemicals were (are?) used in food contact applications so the FDA would require it. But the premise for the EPA spending 12 billion to clean these up is they "may" be harmful. They have no evidence that they are toxic in the levels they are found in our water. I wish they or 3M would do a study to definitivly determine they are or are not harmful to humans in levels commonly seen in peoples water.

#10 | Posted by danS at 2024-07-01 11:07 AM | Reply

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