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Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Saturday, July 12, 2025

The preliminary report into the Air India Flight 171 crash indicated that both engines on the plane were almost simultaneously flipped from run to cut-off.

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Was the flipping of the switches intentional or accidental?

If the former ... why?

If the latter ... were the switches located where they are easy to accidentally flip?


#1 | Posted by LampLighter at 2025-07-11 05:44 PM | Reply

Guessing the switches are not placed in a position on the control panels or overhead switch-bays where they can be be accidentally flipped to "Off" setting.

#2 | Posted by Wardog at 2025-07-11 05:45 PM | Reply

Guessing the switches are not placed in a position on the control panels or overhead switch-bays where they can be be accidentally flipped to "Off" setting.

They are guarded and have spring loaded latches to prevent accidental operation. Very unlikely to have been both shut off by accident.

#3 | Posted by REDIAL at 2025-07-11 05:54 PM | Reply

@#3 ... They are guarded and have spring loaded latches to prevent accidental operation. ...

That's pretty much what I thought.

So, then... intentional?

#4 | Posted by LampLighter at 2025-07-11 06:01 PM | Reply

So, then... intentional?

Or the switches never moved in the first place, but the signals they generate did. Apparently the switches were found in the "run" position in the wreckage.

The timing is very suspicious. Both engines shut off within a second of each other just at the critical point when the plane is lifting off?

#5 | Posted by REDIAL at 2025-07-11 06:10 PM | Reply

@#5 ... Or the switches never moved in the first place, but the signals they generate did. Apparently the switches were found in the "run" position in the wreckage. ...

OK, I should have added that third option in #1.

thx for the follow-up.



#6 | Posted by LampLighter at 2025-07-11 06:22 PM | Reply

thx for the follow-up.

Voice recorder data released says one pilot asked the other why he cutoff the engines and the other pilot said he didn't.

Flight data recorder says both engines were shut down and then restarted, but there was not enough time for them to generate enough thrust to keep the plane in the air.

#7 | Posted by REDIAL at 2025-07-11 06:27 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Air India crash linked to sudden fuel switch shutdown
www.dw.com

... A preliminary report into the June 12 crash in Ahmedabad shows the fuel control switches, used to shut down the engines, were moved to the cutoff position.

A preliminary report

into last month's Air India plane crash in Ahmedabad found the aircraft engines' fuel control switches shifted from "run" to "cutoff" within a second of each other, causing a loss of thrust.

Only one person out of the 242 people on board the airplane survived, and at least 19 people died on the ground where the plane crashed moments after takeoff.

According to a preliminary report by the Aircraft Accident Investigation Bureau (AAIB) released on Friday, the plane reached 180 knots indicated airspeed (IAS), and "immediately thereafter, the Engine 1 and Engine 2 fuel cutoff switches transitioned from RUN to CUTOFF position one after another with a time gap of 1 second."

The Boeing 787 Dreamliner immediately began to lose thrust.

Questions about the pilots' actions

The report did not provide a reason for why the switch could have flipped to the cutoff position.

"At this stage of investigation, there are no recommended actions to Boeing 787-8 and/or GE GEnx-1B engine hoperators and manufacturers," India's Aircraft Accident Investigation Bureau said., suggesting no technical issues with the engines or the aircraft.

The bureau also explained that the Engine and Flight Data Recorder (EAFR) " more commonly known as the aircraft's "black box" " was "substantially damaged," to the extent that its data "could not be downloaded through conventional means."

In the cockpit voice recording retrieved from the black box, the report said "one of the pilots is heard asking the other why did he cutoff," and the other pilot "responded that he did not do so." ...

How did the fuel switch get flipped?

US aviation safety expert John Cox told Reuters news agency that it would not be possible for a pilot to accidentally move the fuel switches. "You can't bump them and they move," he said.

Flipping the fuel switch from "run" to "cutoff" almost immediately cuts the engine.

It is mostly used to turn engines off after an aircraft has reached its gate and in certain emergency situations like an engine fire.

The report did not provide any information that an engine cutoff was required because of any emergency. ...



#8 | Posted by LampLighter at 2025-07-11 07:36 PM | Reply

Bad business in any case. They don't even train for an event like that since there ain't much you can do.

#9 | Posted by REDIAL at 2025-07-11 08:05 PM | Reply

@#9

OK, so based upon #8, the switches seemed to have been moved to the cut-off position.


#10 | Posted by LampLighter at 2025-07-11 08:10 PM | Reply

the switches seemed to have been moved to the cut-off position.

Yep. And then back to the run position some 10 seconds later.

#11 | Posted by REDIAL at 2025-07-11 08:21 PM | Reply

@#11

Why?

#12 | Posted by LampLighter at 2025-07-11 08:32 PM | Reply

Why?

That would be the big question.

#13 | Posted by REDIAL at 2025-07-11 08:44 PM | Reply

Another mass casualty event caused by crap "agile" software development, it seems.

#14 | Posted by sentinel at 2025-07-11 10:30 PM | Reply

I believe these switches are behind cages. You can't accidentally flip them, without accidentally lifting the cage first.

However if this happened purely in software then that's another story and a much harder to figure out than an angry suicide, which happens once a decade or so.

#15 | Posted by snoofy at 2025-07-12 09:08 PM | Reply

I believe these switches are behind cages.

They are toggle switches that have both side guards and a "pull to move" detent on the switch.

if this happened purely in software then that's another story

They are directly and independently connected to each engine controller. Both engines are independent of the aircraft systems.

#16 | Posted by REDIAL at 2025-07-12 09:59 PM | Reply

Fuel cutoff switches on the 787 are located right below the throttles. You have to pull on the fuel switches in order to flip them on or off. Also, the captain will keep a hand on the throttles to prevent them from moving during takeoff. One of the first things they teach you in flight school is to keep a hand on the throttle during takeoff to prevent a sudden cut of fuel to the engine(s).

PIC: i.ytimg.com

Here's an airline captain explaining how they couldn't have accidentally been switched to the off position:

Air India 171 Update: Fuel Cutoff Switches in 'Cutoff' Position according to WSJ
www.youtube.com
IMO, this was an intentional act. There's no way to do this accidentally.

The only conclusion is the co-pilot committed suicide and killed everyone else in the process.

#17 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY at 2025-07-13 02:01 PM | Reply

The only logical conclusion ...

#18 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY at 2025-07-13 02:01 PM | Reply

Is there video in the cockpit? There should be.

#19 | Posted by snoofy at 2025-07-13 02:13 PM | Reply

Update ...

Amid Air India probe, US FAA, Boeing notify fuel switch locks are safe, document, sources say
www.reuters.com

... The U.S. Federal Aviation Administration and Boeing have privately issued notifications that the fuel switch locks on Boeing planes are safe, a document seen by Reuters showed and four sources with knowledge of the matter said.

The FAA's Continued Airworthiness Notification on July 11 came after a preliminary report into Air India's Boeing 787-8 crash, which killed 260 people last month, raised questions over engine fuel cutoff switches.

The FAA's notification to Civil Aviation Authorities, seen by Reuters, said: "although the fuel control switch design, including the locking feature, is similar on various Boeing airplane models, the FAA does not consider this issue to be an unsafe condition that would warrant an Airworthiness Directive on any Boeing airplane models, including the Model 787."

When asked for comment, the FAA said it did not have anything to add beyond the notification. ...


#20 | Posted by LampLighter at 2025-07-13 08:09 PM | Reply

Is there video in the cockpit?

There is not.

#21 | Posted by REDIAL at 2025-07-13 08:27 PM | Reply

PS #17 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY

You have to pull up on the switch's knob before it can be moved up or down to the ON or OFF position. It will not move otherwise.

#22 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY at 2025-07-14 03:00 AM | Reply

I just read the first officer (co-pilot) had the controls during takeoff, and that the captain was having mental health issues and could have easily shut off the fuel supply while the first officer was busy at the controls.

#23 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY at 2025-07-14 11:53 AM | Reply

I'm sure MTV Duffy will get to the bottom of this.

#24 | Posted by reinheitsgebot at 2025-07-14 11:56 AM | Reply

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