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Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Thursday, June 06, 2024

California has been a leader in the installation of solar power plants and wind power plants for many years now (despite its recent anti-rooftop solar shift via "Net Metering 3.0").

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... For 55 days in a row, electricity from solar, wind, and water (hydro) power exceeded 100% of power demand on California's main grid for part of the day. Also, going back further, that has been achieved in 80 out of the last 87 days. ...

As part of that, solar power recently hit record output, and it actually surpassed 100% of power demand briefly. ...

As you can see above, at its peak, solar power was providing 102.1% of electricity demand in California. Together, wind, water, and solar peaked at 136.4% of electricity demand!

Clearly, California's progress on renewables is proving pro-renewables advocates right. But what about the infamous "duck curve?" ...

California Quickly Solving the Duck Curve

The best news is that California seems to quickly be chopping the duck curve down to size. The duck curve basically comes down to this: "In some energy markets, daily peak demand occurs after sunset, when solar power is no longer available. In locations where a substantial amount of solar electric capacity has been installed, the amount of power that must be generated from sources other than solar or wind displays a rapid increase around sunset and peaks in the mid-evening hours, producing a graph that resembles the silhouette of a duck." ...


[see the article for all manner of data and graphs...]

#1 | Posted by LampLighter at 2024-06-05 10:41 PM | Reply

Now lets add up every ton of carbon that is produced from mining to manufacturing to maintenance to disposal of the green equipment and get a fair comparison. Then it would be nice to know where the disposal will take place, because it won't be cheap unless we just bury the ----.

#2 | Posted by lfthndthrds at 2024-06-05 11:51 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

What is the carbon footprint of solar panels?

Residential solar panels emit around 41 grams of CO2 equivalent emissions per kilowatt-hour of electricity generated. Most of these lifecycle emissions are tied to the process of manufacturing panels and are offset by clean energy production within the first three years of operation. The lifetime emissions of rooftop solar are 12 times less than electricity generated by gas plants and 20 times less than electricity generated by coal.

That's quite a mouthful " so let's break it down a bit further.

First off, life-cycle emissions refer to the total emissions " from mining to manufacturing to installation to maintenance to disposal " associated with creating energy. This measurement is standardized into grams of CO2 equivalents to account for the various types of emissions and their warming impacts.

According to the International Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), the total emissions associated with generating 1 kWh of electricity from rooftop solar adds up to 41 grams of CO2 equivalents " roughly the mass of a medium chicken egg.

www.solar.com

news.climate.columbia.edu

In the United States, the emissions intensity of electricity produced by natural gas-fired power plants is about 1,071 pounds per megawatt-hour (MWh) on a lifecycle basis, whereas the emissions intensity of solar PV is about 95 pounds per MWh, a difference of 976 pounds per MWh. According to the Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory, utility-scale solar power produces between 394 and 447 MWh per acre per year. Thus, when solar panels are installed to replace natural gas, an acre of solar panels saves approximately 385,000 to 436,000 pounds, or 175 to 198 metric tons, of carbon dioxide per year. By comparison, according to the EPA, the average acre of forest in the United States sequesters 0.84 metric tons of carbon dioxide per year. Thus, an acre of solar panels installed to replace natural gas reduces approximately 208 to 236 times more carbon dioxide per year than an acre of forest.

#3 | Posted by Nixon at 2024-06-06 08:08 AM | Reply | Funny: 1 | Newsworthy 3

Now lets add up every ton of carbon that is produced from mining to manufacturing to maintenance to disposal of the green equipment and get a fair comparison. Then it would be nice to know where the disposal will take place, because it won't be cheap unless we just bury the ----.

#2 | Posted by lfthndthrds

Of course you dont want to include those factors in fossil fuel energy though.

#4 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2024-06-06 05:41 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 5

Count me as one of those residents. My electric bill was negative this month and last. Nothing beats the feeling of driving around in a fast fun car powered by pure free sunshine.

#5 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2024-06-06 05:42 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Solar Passes 100% of Power Demand in California!

But what will they do when the Sun burns out? Riddle me that!

#6 | Posted by censored at 2024-06-06 06:02 PM | Reply

Count me as one of those residents. My electric bill was negative this month and last. Nothing beats the feeling of driving around in a fast fun car powered by pure free sunshine.

#5 | POSTED BY SPEAKSOFTLY

Yup. Solar is avoid investment and pays well in a warming climate.

I just cashed a check from The Redwood Energy Authority for $500 for the excess energy I produced last year.

#7 | Posted by donnerboy at 2024-06-06 06:06 PM | Reply

"Solar is avoid investment ... "

SB

Solar is a good investment.

#8 | Posted by donnerboy at 2024-06-06 06:07 PM | Reply

"That's quite a mouthful " so let's break it down a bit further."

Yup!

TMI!!!

You lost maga maroons at "What is the carbon footprint ..."

#9 | Posted by donnerboy at 2024-06-06 06:12 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

#2 | POSTED BY LFTHNDTARD

#10 | Posted by LegallyYourDead at 2024-06-06 06:22 PM | Reply

#10 | Posted by LegallyGivesHead

#11 | Posted by lfthndthrds at 2024-06-06 07:25 PM | Reply

#3
solar.com

"Get multiple solar quotes from vetted installers"

LOL Surely they wouldn't stretch the truth

#12 | Posted by lfthndthrds at 2024-06-06 07:29 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

LOL Surely they wouldn't stretch the truth

#12 | Posted by lfthndthrds

No one stretched it like these guys:

www.scientificamerican.com

Exxon Knew about Climate Change almost 40 years ago

A new investigation shows the oil company understood the science before it became a public issue and spent millions to promote misinformation

Exxon was aware of climate change, as early as 1977, 11 years before it became a public issue

#13 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2024-06-06 07:50 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

LOL Surely they wouldn't stretch the truth

#12 | POSTED BY LFTHNDTHRDS

It must be nice that global temperatures are not rising over there on Earth2.

And that your glaciers and ice sheets are not shrinking, or the river and lake ice is not breaking up earlier, and your plant and animal geographic ranges are not shifting, and plants and trees are not blooming sooner and the poor people of your island nations are not being forced to relocate because of rising sea levels.

Yeah. Earth2 sounds like a real nice place. Like the Rock Candy Mountains!

So is there a special portal to get there or certain drugs I have to take or do I just have to watch only Fuxed Spews 24/7 to get to there ?

I can trust them right? Fuxed Spews would never ever "stretch the truth" now would they?

#14 | Posted by donnerboy at 2024-06-06 08:34 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

-------- is showing off her extra chromosome.

#15 | Posted by LegallyYourDead at 2024-06-06 08:41 PM | Reply

-------- is showing off her extra chromosome.

#15 | Posted by LegallyYourDead at 2024-06-06 08:41 PM | Reply | Flag:

^ If Sam Kenison and Helen Keller had a lovechild.

#16 | Posted by lfthndthrds at 2024-06-07 12:28 AM | Reply

#6 Censored Won't matter because we'll all be dead.

#17 | Posted by Ronnie68 at 2024-06-07 12:50 PM | Reply

Good for them and for us as we no longer have to hear about their blackouts and brownouts.

#18 | Posted by MSgt at 2024-06-07 01:56 PM | Reply

The blackouts still happen. The tornado that came through Houston left most of the solar homes in the dark. Grid-tied, no hybrid inverter with propane/natural gas backup generator, no battery bank. Kind of a silly situation to be in but there it's a big upgrade in price to get the accessory gadgets that keep the lights on in emergencies. Gears in the trackers broke from the windows but the panels stayed on their frames. Pretty happy with how it worked out.

#19 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2024-06-07 02:58 PM | Reply

If you have solar and a battery, no problem. There aren't any "gadgets" involved.

#20 | Posted by LegallyYourDead at 2024-06-07 11:16 PM | Reply

You're dumb. You need at least a hybrid inverter. Plus trackers because only the yard space limited waste harvest power and roof mount.

#21 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2024-06-08 10:20 AM | Reply

Over 2k sq feet, you'll need 2 inverters like EG4s, plus 2 battery banks to the tune of $15k with all of a 5 year warranty.

Enormous carbon footprint. Pretty good in a disaster though.

#22 | Posted by sitzkrieg at 2024-06-08 10:21 AM | Reply

"Enormous carbon footprint"

Compared to what?

#23 | Posted by snoofy at 2024-06-08 10:27 AM | Reply

Compared to what?

Seems pretty small, compared to your ego.

#24 | Posted by snoofy at 2024-06-08 11:07 AM | Reply

"Grid-tied, no hybrid inverter with propane/natural gas backup generator, no battery bank."

A backup generator is way cheaper and easier to maintain until battery backup technology improves and the costs come down some.

One good solution is microgrids.

Blue Lake Casino here turned into microgrid that can operate off grid indefinitely in a disaster.

After a recent 6.4 earthquake power was down for almost a week in some areas (we have a generator just for that) but Blue Lake Casino continued to operate normally. We went for nice sushi dinner and some blackjack while the rest of the county was without power and lines for gas were around the block. It was a bit surreal.

#25 | Posted by donnerboy at 2024-06-08 01:18 PM | Reply

__________
For 55 days in a row, electricity from solar, wind, and water (hydro) power exceeded 100% of power demand on California's main grid for part of the day

The author of this article is a "renewable clean energy" investor and booster/influencer (Zachary Shahan is CleanTechnica... director, chief editor, and CEO) and has conclusions of a fifth-grader who either doesn't understand what his own charts show... or just playing with words - in short:

1. The "renewable" wind and solar intermittent supply was only sufficient for few hours of non-peak daily demand because the demand was at ~22GWh max - at the low end of CA normal range of 15GWh-61GWh of demand... IOW, it's due to a cooler weather that didn't require ACs.

thundersaidenergy.com - California power generation over time - report

|------- California's power grid ranges from 15-61GW of demand. Utility scale solar has almost quadrupled in the past decade, rising from 5% to almost 20% of the grid. Yet it has not displaced thermal generation, which rose from 28% to 36% of the grid. We even wonder whether wind and solar are entrenching natural gas generators that can backstop their daily, weekly and even seasonal volatility. -------|

2. Even with batteries / storage (which he erroneously thinks "solved" 'duck curve") it wouldn't be anywhere near enough for demand after sunset - what he actually discovered is that intermittent power NEEDS storage (and maintenance/disposal/recycling, toxicity, environmental issues and other costs that go with them) to be at all useful, which increase TCO of utility-scale farms substantially, which means an additional cost of generation (while others have to be idling on standby) for a few hours a day a few summer days a year - wind and solar generate 2x more energy in summer than winter.

3. So, increasing energy supply with intermittent "renewables" is impossible without first increasing energy supply with firm power (nuclear, hydrogen, natgas, etc.) - which makes you question if/why the utility-scale wind and solar (at cost of 2,900-4,200 acres/GW) may be needed or cost-effective, except possibly in very special circumstances - e.g., does it really make sense for CA to import wind energy from Wyoming? Here's more serious assessment:

ccst.us - CCST - KEY CHALLENGES for CA ENERGY FUTURE - [PDF, 108pgs]
ccst.us - CCST - Overview

|------- "Energy storage, demand response, and grid regionalization can alleviate some - but not all - of the challenges associated with intermittent renewable resources. A diverse portfolio that also includes clean, firm power - be it geothermal, nuclear, renewable hydrogen, natural gas with carbon capture and storage, or something else - would address seasonal fluctuations and extreme weather events and is predicted to result in significantly reduced system costs and therefore lower electricity rates..."
-------|

That's why wind and solar deployment dramatically slowed down in Europe (and several suppliers either ended up in bankruptcy or had substantial write-off losses) and [finally!] US Energy Secretary just called for tripling of US nuclear fleet, and restarting retired nuke plants. Japan and many Asian and European countries are also rethinking their nuclear energy taboos.

www.world-nuclear-news.org - Granholm calls for tripling of US nuclear fleet

Related news?: Merkel withheld information about Russia's intention to blackmail Europe with gas - report
__________

#26 | Posted by CutiePie at 2024-06-09 05:02 AM | Reply

"e.g., does it really make sense for CA to import wind energy from Wyoming?"

Why have a grid?
What a dumb question.
You talk a lot and say nothing.

#27 | Posted by snoofy at 2024-06-09 10:29 AM | Reply

__________
#27 | Posted by snoofy at 2024-06-09 10:29 AM
"e.g., does it really make sense for CA to import wind energy from Wyoming?"

- - - Why have a grid?
- - - What a dumb question.

"Why have a grid?" Sure is a dumb question!

https://www.latimes.com/environment/story/2022-08-23/wyoming-clean-energy-california - This power line could save California - and forever change the American West - Aug 23, 2022

FTA: |------- ... More than 800 miles from Los Angeles - on ranchland littered with so much cow dung it's hard not to step in it - the pastel-green hills are studded with wind giants. Before wind energy took off, there wasn't much going on in this corner of Wyoming cattle country, says Laine Anderson, director of wind operations at PacifiCorp, the company owned by billionaire investor Warren Buffett that built these turbines. ... But renewable power is also reshaping landscapes, ecosystems and rural economies - and not always for the better. ...

To understand why, look at a wind resource map of the United States. Most of the West is rendered in pale shades of green and light blue, meaning average wind speeds of 10 to 15 mph at best. But this part of southern Wyoming ... is streaked with thick veins of dark blue. For wind energy developers, that's the really good stuff: speeds of 20 mph and above.
-------|

You talk a lot and say nothing.

Funny, because you make hundreds of pablum posts over the same time I make one post.

Or is it your reflex response and you really don't have even a shred of long-term memory, because we discussed this recently?... Or it's weekend and you are drinking again?
https://drudge.com/read-comment/274684/6998215

Stop projecting... or drinking... or whatever it is... and just grow up already!

Goodbye boy, sorry (English translation)

So Long My Dear, Sorry... (English translation)

... The real life is not a movie

So long my dear! Sorry...
Oh, what a waste, Sorry!

Ciao, Bambino, Sorry
__________

#28 | Posted by CutiePie at 2024-06-09 12:42 PM | Reply

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