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Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Tuesday, November 26, 2024

President-elect Trump's pick for "border czar," Tom Homan, on Sunday threatened funding for states that refuse to cooperate in the federal government's deportation plans.

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Now that the Deportation program is seemingly going to happen I think it needs to be discussed, like in detail.

Like who will be deported, using what criteria?

What defines someone eligible for deportation.

I want to put some stuff out there for context

Fourth Amendment The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

People NOT citizens, PEOPLE

Fifth Amendment No person shall {SNIP} be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; {SNIP}

People NOT citizens, PEOPLE

Thus, we have established that every single person that will be subject to deportation will have protection of these 2 rights.

Let it also be stated that immigrants (documented or undocumented) who have committed a crime are already prioritized for deportation.

A significant cause of the number of documented or undocumented immigrants who have committed crimes remain in America is that the US has not set up a trial system with adequate capacity to handle the number of cases. this was something proposed to be addressed with the scuttled border bill

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So, we have a number of people who have committed crimes who are either already detained (generally speaking those that have committed violent crimes) or are released with limits (generally for non-violent crimes).

It is presumable that the new deportation plan will prioritize these people.

So, I ask, how will this be accomplished? How does one square the stated goals with a system wholly inadequate to provide for the administration of this process while also respecting the rights of the people. I'd imagine that even at least some of the hardline immigration opponents would think that people are entitled to due process prior to deportation, that way people being deported meet the stated parameters for deportation.

I would also be curious to know what specific criteria will be used to determine who will be deported. I have heard various things. I have heard the President and VP-Elect state that in their opinion even some legal immigrants (like the Haitians in Springfield OH) are here illegally. I have heard they will deport people regardless of their status including US citizens. I have heard plans to ignore their rights.

Who is here legally and who is not? Who will make the determination? What rights' protections will be afforded each individual?

#1 | Posted by truthhurts at 2024-11-25 03:36 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

All good questions. We will need a huge federal bureaucracy to write all the procedures and implement the policy. So, instead of DOGE the first order of business for the Trump administration will be to expand the federal footstep.

#2 | Posted by mattm at 2024-11-25 03:45 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

a very, very powerful weapon that the Democrats, when they're in power, use against Republican administrations, state and local, all the time

Did he provide any examples of that?

#3 | Posted by REDIAL at 2024-11-25 03:45 PM | Reply

Then there is this:

Fourteenth Amendment
Section 1

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.

This is birthright citizenship. The president elect has in the past and has promised in the future to attempt to remove this right. And to be perfectly clear this includes children and adults who have known no other home and may have lived here for decades.

He has used the justification that the immigrants are an invading force (thus his violent rhetoric describing immigrants-despite the fact that the VAST number of immigrants are not criminals whatsoever-with the exception of possible criminality of entering illegally-asylum being an obvious exception to criminality).

Thus, it is very likely he will attempt to deny US citizens of their birthright citizenship as they are an 'invading force'.

So, we could have the end goal of removing 10s of millions of people (those are the President Elects figures) subject to deportation including people here legally or with birthright citizenship being stripped from them.

Is this what you voted for?

Can you explain how something of this magnitude could be accomplished without massive human misery? In 2017 the former president separated around 5,000 children from their parents and the outrage was enormous. We are talking several magnitudes worse in the number of people. We are talking 10s of thousands of images like the jackbooted thugs pointing a gun at Elian Gonzalez (a child) cowering in a closet.

Do you not believe it will happen? Do you not believe the misery will occur? Do you want the misery?

#4 | Posted by truthhurts at 2024-11-25 03:45 PM | Reply

Then there is the threat of this article. The proposed head of this deportation is threatening to keep funding appropriated by Congress from the states. If that is not a usurpation of Congress' power I don't know what is.

BTW that is yet another of the president elect's plans-Impoundment-LOOK IT UP>

#5 | Posted by truthhurts at 2024-11-25 03:46 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

All good questions. We will need a huge federal bureaucracy to write all the procedures and implement the policy. So, instead of DOGE the first order of business for the Trump administration will be to expand the federal footstep.

#2 | Posted by mattm a

They already exist. Well within the existing framework. There is a whole process to detain, process, try and deport or grant asylum to undocumented immigrants. The problem exists because there is a massive backlog to processing the cases, because the border bill was scuttled.

The current framework may change dramatically if some of what has been promised occurs including ignoring legal immigrants (asylum seekers, those with temporary protected status) as those will necessarily be extra legal or if they just grab people and fly them to another country-a blatant disregard for their basic rights.

#6 | Posted by truthhurts at 2024-11-25 03:50 PM | Reply

a very, very powerful weapon that the Democrats, when they're in power, use against Republican administrations, state and local, all the time

Did he provide any examples of that?

#3 | Posted by REDIAL

Of course not, because he lives in the fever dream swamps of right wing grievance politics.

#7 | Posted by truthhurts at 2024-11-25 03:51 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

FTA

Trump transition team spokesperson Karoline Leavitt has also said the president-elect "will marshal every federal and state power necessary to institute the largest deportation operation of illegal criminals, drug dealers, and human traffickers in American history while simultaneously lowering costs for families."

Like, ummm, what?

Here is some advice, when someone speaks to you like this, they are lying-full stop.

As an aside, what this statement actually says is that they will deport criminals, drug dealers and human traffickers while making crime, drugs and human trafficking cost less for American families.

#8 | Posted by truthhurts at 2024-11-25 03:53 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

"I'll say this: President Trump has made it clear, we're going to prioritize public safety threats and national security threats right out of the gate [because] they pose the most danger to this country. What governor or mayor doesn't want public safety threats and national security threats out of their neighborhoods, out of their communities?" Homan said Sunday.

"That's their number one responsibility. So you can hate Trump all you want, but you gotta love your community more than you hate President Trump," he added.

And this is the tell at what their game is.

They are posing a nonsensical choice. Protest the removal of the worst of the worst and you are anti-American. That will justify their use of force against those protestors which will justify further and harsher deportation

When the reality of the situation is that there are no public safety threats or national security threats that are being ignored. That is an out and out lie.

The reality is that this incoming administration can either respect the rights of people OR they can do mass deportation, they CANNOT do both.

And to be clear the rights of the people extend FAR broader than the nasssty criminals and nassssty national security threats.

#9 | Posted by truthhurts at 2024-11-25 03:57 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

... President-elect Trump's pick for "border czar," Tom Homan, on Sunday threatened funding for states that refuse to cooperate in the federal government's deportation plans. ...

So, in the case of abortions, it should be left up to the states.

But in the rounding up of immigrants and placing them in deportation camps, the states cannot opt out?

#10 | Posted by LampLighter at 2024-11-26 06:55 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

...the states cannot opt out?

Federal authority over the border and immigration is for real now, not just pretend like before.

#11 | Posted by REDIAL at 2024-11-26 06:59 PM | Reply

@#11 ... Federal authority over the border and immigration is for real now, not just pretend like before. ...

I do not disagree.

But I do have to ask why MAGA now seems to want to step all over states' rights in this instance, when they espouse states' rights in so many other instances?


At this point, the only rationalization MAGA seems to be abe to proffer is "it's the law."

And I will state, I do not disagree with that statement.

I guess my question becomes, why does MAGA want to follow the law in this particular instance, and yet ignore the law in so many other instances, e.g. 34 felony convictions for the next President?



#12 | Posted by LampLighter at 2024-11-26 07:10 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

But I do have to ask why MAGA now seems to want to step all over states' rights in this instance, when they espouse states' rights in so many other instances?

Because they are --------? Florida and Texas were only too happy to step on Federal rights with their immigrant transportation stunts.

#13 | Posted by REDIAL at 2024-11-26 07:15 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

MAGATS are FAGATS

#14 | Posted by LegallyYourDead at 2024-11-26 09:40 PM | Reply

@#14 ... MAGATS are FAGATS ...

So, you think MAGA folk are good people?


You are sending a confused message.

#15 | Posted by LampLighter at 2024-11-26 10:20 PM | Reply

" Because they are --------? Florida and Texas were only too happy to step on Federal rights with their immigrant transportation stunts.
#13 | POSTED BY REDIAL AT 2024-11-26 07:15 PM | FLAG: "

So they offer up voluntary flights to so-called sanctuary cities and THAT is a violation of federal rights but the existence of sanctuary cities in NOT?

#16 | Posted by BellRinger at 2024-11-27 01:06 AM | Reply | Funny: 1

@#16 ... So they offer up voluntary flights ...

Voluntary?

Flights?

#17 | Posted by LampLighter at 2024-11-27 01:33 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

It's BullBringer.

You can't expect anything from him but lies and bullshht.

#18 | Posted by ClownShack at 2024-11-27 01:40 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Clan Of Xymox - Imagination (album version) (1989)
www.youtube.com

My album says only "Xymox" fwiw. That is how the area college station announced the song back in the day.

Lyrics excerpt...
genius.com

...
I have come to indecision
Someone is pushing me
All the cities, subways, rivers
No direction left for me

I have lost my way home early
I don't care cause I won't stay there
All I hear is this silent whisper
Will you be here again?

[Chorus: Anka Wolbert]
Imagination takes the shadows away
Every day I've been without you
Imagination keeps the shadows away
Every day I stay without you
Too many times - without you
...


#19 | Posted by LampLighter at 2024-11-27 01:40 AM | Reply

Illegal foreigners have no right to invade and stay in the USA and cause crime and cheapen labor along with harming our already costly but diminished failing public education system. These non native born people need deported from USA unless they offer needed skills and assets and are financially secure and more than enough to pay for what they cost us. There are no countries throughout the world that would accept invasion by millions of welfare needing foreigners that stress out their already stressed indebted national government. Where did this Biden - Harris idea come from that indebted Americans ($35T) owe foreign invaders room and board and a paid vacation.

#20 | Posted by Robson at 2024-11-27 11:55 AM | Reply

#20 | Posted by ROBSON

Biden - Harris? No, no, no - this all started under Trump. He said so himself.

"At this very moment, large well-organized caravans of migrants are marching towards our southern border. Some people call it an invasion."

"We now have 25 or 30 million people in this country illegally."

- Donald Trump, 2018

PBS News

#21 | Posted by Derek_Wildstar at 2024-11-27 02:15 PM | Reply

Create an army of law abiding patriots and vigilantes and make all Americans safe. Nothing should be more important.

#22 | Posted by Robson at 2024-11-27 05:55 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

"Homan said Sunday that Democrats needed to put aside their feelings about Trump and cooperate."

Sorry our consciences don't stop functioning with the election of a Fascist! What is wrong will syill be wrong, Trump may have the power to do evil things but he will never have the moral authority to make those thing right.
And who is looking out for the farmers who need these immigrants to plant andharvest crops, pivk fruit, etc. MAGAts will be the first ones whining about higher food costs, construction costs, roofing costs.
And what about the stresses put on the governments of Mexico, Guatemala, Haiti, Colombia, noy to mention Cuba? If he goes through with his deportation plans I hope he starts with the Cubans who are a reliable Republican voting block and who helped elect this Fascist so let them feel no different than any other undocumented immigrant. I really am tired of seeing them come here with a "get out of jail free card" when the persecution they endure in their home countries is no worse than many other countries.

#23 | Posted by danni at 2024-11-28 09:44 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Danni raises another great point.

Many of the Central and South American countries' economies rely on money sent home by the migrant workers. Not only will the people deported have no work when they return home (thus taxing their social safety nets), those countries' economies will be seriously hit, causing a stronger incentive for migrants to come back to America for work.

#24 | Posted by truthhurts at 2024-11-28 11:35 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

And yet ANOTHER side effect of mass deportation

www.msn.com

The last time Donald Trump was president, rumors of immigration raids terrorized the Oregon community where Gustavo Balderas was the school superintendent.

Word spread that immigration agents were going to try to enter schools. There was no truth to it, but school staff members had to find students who were avoiding school and coax them back to class.

"People just started ducking and hiding," Balderas said.

Educators around the country are bracing for upheaval, whether or not the president-elect follows through on his pledge to deport millions of immigrants who are in the country illegally. Even if he only talks about it, children of immigrants will suffer, educators and legal observers said.

#25 | Posted by truthhurts at 2024-11-28 01:19 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Immigration officials have avoided arresting parents or students at schools. Since 2011, U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement has operated under a policy that immigration agents should not arrest or conduct other enforcement actions near "sensitive locations," including schools, hospitals and places of worship. Doing so might curb access to essential services, U.S. Secretary of Homeland Security Alejandro Mayorkas wrote in a 2021 policy update.

But the Heritage Foundation's policy roadmap for Trump's second term, Project 2025, calls for rescinding the guidance on "sensitive places." Trump tried to distance himself from the proposals during the campaign, but he has nominated many who worked on the plan for his new administration, including Tom Homan for "border czar."

#26 | Posted by truthhurts at 2024-11-28 01:20 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#16 Bellringer The flights aren't voluntary. Also most are a publicity stunt. In FL, they asked legal immigraants if they wanted jobs at a specific location, then they sent them to Martha's Vineyard. They lied to them about jobs and where they were going.

#27 | Posted by Ronnie68 at 2024-11-28 01:43 PM | Reply

First end the biden run flights of illegals into the country at the taxpayers expense, then just start with deporting the criminals and work on down from there....

#28 | Posted by MSgt at 2024-11-28 01:51 PM | Reply

Yes!

As Martin Lawrence used to say:

Get To Steppin!

#29 | Posted by THEBULL at 2024-11-28 03:41 PM | Reply

Stupid is as stupid does. They who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

#30 | Posted by LauraMohr at 2024-11-28 03:49 PM | Reply

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