House Republicans for a second time passed a stand-alone bill that would require proof of citizenship to vote in federal elections and impose voter roll purge requirements on states.
If the SAVE Act were enacted into law, it would be one of the worst voting laws ever passed by Congress. The Senate must vote to reject it.
-- Brennan Center (@brennancenter.bsky.social) April 10, 2025 at 12:23 PM
[image or embed]
"(b) Documentary proof of United States citizenship."As used in this Act, the term documentary proof of United States citizenship' means, with respect to an applicant for voter registration, any of the following: www.congress.gov
What connects any of those documents to your physical person?
@#18
btw, found this ...
Are Democrats Using Illegal Immigration to Build a Permanent Majority'?
www.rasmussenreports.com
... Preventing illegal immigrants from voting is very important, according to a majority of voters, who agree with Elon Musk that Democrats are encouraging immigration as part of a plan to gain a "permanent majority."
The latest Rasmussen Reports national telephone and online survey finds that 78% of Likely U.S. voters believe it is important to prevent illegal immigrants from voting in American elections, including 62% who consider it Very Important. Just 17% disagree. ...
Interesting ...
Birth Certificates (2018)
www.americanbar.org
... Maybe yours is tucked in a box or filed for safekeeping. The odds are that you have one: a birth certificate. On any given day, according to the U.S. Census Bureau, an estimated 10,800 babies are born in the United States, or one birth every eight seconds. Most, if not all, of them will be issued birth certificates. A birth certificate is a document issued by a government that records the birth of a child for vital statistics, tax, military, and census purposes. The birth certificate is among the first legal documents an individual might acquire. They are so common that we might even overlook their significance. In the United States, birth certificates serve as proof of an individual's age, citizenship status, and identity. They are necessary to obtain a social security number, apply for a passport, enroll in schools, get a driver's license, gain employment, or apply for other benefits. Humanitarian Desmond Tutu described the birth certificate as "a small paper, but it actually establishes who you are and gives access to the rights and privileges, and the obligations of citizenship."
A Decentralized System
In the United States, there is no national (federal) birth registry, as you might see in other nations, such as the United Kingdom. Instead, birth certificates are issued by the states, which are obligated under law to report annual vital statistics data to the federal government. (Note that if a baby is born to American parents overseas, the U.S. Department of State collects that data.) Within each state, the management of birth certificates might be further decentralized, with data collected and certificates issued at the county or municipal level. Birth data is submitted to the state, county, or municipality by parents, doctors, midwives, and hospitals, typically via paper or electronic forms. The state and federal governments use this data to understand population changes, childbirth trends, maternal and fetal health and mortality, new parent demographics, and other trends that inform policymakers.
...
Within this decentralized system, there is not a required standard birth certificate document that states must issue to individuals.
...
Not a Clear Paper Trail
The documentation of births and other vital statistics (e.g., birth, death, marriage, divorce) has been a long-standing tradition among populations for centuries, typically through individual families or their churches. The idea that a government should also record this vital information is a relatively modern development. ...
Proof of Citizenship
During World War II and the years after, employers increasingly asked prospective employees to offer proof of their citizenship status. Federal employment laws for certain industries, such as aircraft manufacturing, already mandated that employers hire citizens, and many Americans did not have any proof of their citizenship status. Many Americans trying to get jobs in the wartime economy expressed frustration at this seemingly bureaucratic hurdle. One Rhode Island man wrote, "This is America and it's not right to refuse me a job because I have not got my birth papers. I have a wife and child and I want a job." Grace Wilson, age 42, from Kansas, hoped to get a job in the aircraft industry but could not even enroll in the training school. "It is a bitter hurt feeling to know you are an American citizen whose grandparents as well as parents also were, and still not be able to establish citizenship." ...
U.S. Appeals Court Strikes Down North Carolina's Voter ID Law (2016)
www.npr.org
...The appeals court noted that the North Carolina Legislature "requested data on the use, by race, of a number of voting practices" -- then, data in hand, "enacted legislation that restricted voting and registration in five different ways, all of which disproportionately affected African Americans."[emphasis mine]
The changes to the voting process "target African Americans with almost surgical precision," the circuit court wrote, and "impose cures for problems that did not exist."
The appeals court suggested that the motivation was fundamentally political -- a Republican legislature attempting to secure its power by blocking votes from a population likely to vote for Democrats....
It just no longer seems to me like this bill is nearly as disenfranchising as some would have us believe if I will still be able to vote with my current ID card.
Nope.
Another option: require new voters to show proof of citizenship when they register. For most new voters, that isn't a problem; they show a birth certificate or passport at the bureau of motor vehicles to get a REAL ID, and that proof can be used for voter registration. (The REAL ID is not itself proof of citizenship, because they are available to noncitizens who are in the U.S. legally; it is the underlying document shown by a citizen to obtain a REAL ID that can be used for voting purposes.) www.ncsl.org
@#79 ... No evidence of any significant voting fraud, ...
Yup.
And the evidence that was surfaced seemed to involve Republicans committing the voting fraud.
Election Fraud Map
electionfraud.heritage.org
...The Election Fraud Map displays a sampling of proven instances of election fraud. Every case ended in a finding that the individual engaged in wrongdoing in an election hoping to affect its outcome"or that the results were sufficiently in question to be overturned. While not comprehensive, this map demonstrates vulnerabilities in the election process and the ways in which fraud is committed. ...
I think this will likely go to the USSC and this 'poll tax' nonsense will be tossed.
I wouldn't call it nonsense and I wouldn't be so certain.
In 2008 when the SC upheld voter ID it specifically noted that Indiana provided free ID because of that so does every state that requires ID. The absence of a fee avoided 1966 precedent that $1.50 to register is a "poll tax."
The burdens that are relevant to the issue before us are those imposed on persons who are eligible to vote but do not possess a current photo identification that complies with the requirements of SEA 483.[fn16] The fact that most voters already possess a valid driver's license, or some other form of acceptable identification, would not save the statute under our reasoning in Harper, if the State required voters to pay a tax or a fee to obtain a new photo identification. But just as other States provide free voter registration cards, the photo identification cards issued by Indiana's BMV are also free. For most voters who need them, the inconvenience of making a trip to the BMV, gathering the required documents, and posing for a photograph surely does not qualify as a substantial burden on the right to vote, or even represent a significant increase over the usual burdens of voting.[fn17] [*199] www.bloomberglaw.com
Racist Scott needs to learn how to internet:
The claim that Black people are inherently less intelligent than White people based on IQ tests is not supported by credible scientific evidence. Differences in average IQ scores between racial groups have been observed, but these differences are widely understood to stem from environmental, social, and cultural factors rather than genetics.
### Key Points on Race and Intelligence:
1. **Scientific Consensus**:
- The overwhelming consensus among scientists is that genetics does not explain differences in IQ test performance between racial groups[1][3]. Instead, environmental factors such as socioeconomic status, educational opportunities, and exposure to culturally relevant information account for disparities in scores[3][6].
2. **Bias in IQ Tests**:
- IQ tests have been criticized for cultural biases that favor the experiences and values of the predominantly middle-class, Anglo-American individuals who developed them[6]. These biases can disadvantage individuals from different cultural or socioeconomic backgrounds[4][6].
3. **Environmental Factors**:
- Studies have demonstrated that when given equal opportunities to learn the information measured by IQ tests, Black and White students perform equally well[3]. This suggests that disparities in test scores reflect unequal access to resources rather than inherent intellectual differences.
4. **Historical Context**:
- The idea of inherent racial differences in intelligence has roots in pseudoscientific theories like eugenics, which have been discredited[2][7]. Such claims have historically been used to justify discrimination and are considered scientifically invalid today.
5. **Complexity of Intelligence**:
- Intelligence is a multifaceted concept that cannot be fully captured by a single test. Modern research highlights the limitations of IQ tests in measuring diverse aspects of intelligence, including emotional and social intelligence[5].
### Conclusion:
The assertion that Black people are inherently less intelligent than White people is not accurate and reflects a misunderstanding or misuse of IQ data. Differences in average scores are better explained by systemic inequalities and biases rather than genetic factors.
Citations:
[1] en.wikipedia.org
[2] www.ebsco.com
[3] case.edu
[4] www.nea.org
[5] ectutoring.com
[6] www.ebsco.com
[7] en.wikipedia.org
[8] isreview.org
[9] nrcgt.uconn.edu
[10] psico-smart.com
Oh but wait...there's more!
[11] pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
[12] www.brookings.edu
[13] pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
[14] pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
[15] aads.uncg.edu
[16] www.popularmechanics.com
[17] pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
[18] www.facinghistory.org
[19] via.library.depaul.edu
[20] nrcgt.uconn.edu
[21] www.sciencedirect.com
[22] pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
[23] explorable.com
[24] www.philippevivier.com
[25] www.reddit.com
[26] library.fiveable.me
[27] www.reddit.com
[28] www.bps.org.uk
[29] www.sciencedirect.com
[30] hechingerreport.org
[31] www1.udel.edu
If $1.50 is considered a poll tax and illegal, then the same should be applied on all the gun ownership restrictions. Like I said, I think this will finally be challenged in court and tossed because it does not follow the precedents on any other rights.
Seems you know very little about the Court and even less about law. Voting regulations and gun regulations are judicially completely different animals. Guess you haven't noticed the ruling favorable to gun rights which I wholeheartedly support.
Btw, that $1.50 in today's dollars is $14.89. www.dollartimes.com
I ordered a birth certificate from the State of Texas about 15 years ago and it was about $20.00.
@#196 ... If you come to our country, follow the law or get deported. ...
I agree. (as I have stated many times before)
To wit ...
...
As i have often stated, anyone in the Country illegally should be deported.
Of course, that may affect the economy.
The industry is in a crisis:' Construction worker shortage delaying projects, driving up costs, experts say (February 2025)
www.clickorlando.com
So, what's yer point?
California Elections Code 2208 codes.findlaw.com
Jfc, you equate mental capacity with IQ. My prior speculation about your lack of knowledge about law is confirmed and can be expanded more generally. JFC
@#215 ... Mental capacity is not linked to IQ? Really? ...
How do intelligence tests correlate with realworld success in various professions?
psico-smart.com
... However, while intelligence tests can unveil cognitive strengths and weaknesses, they can also perpetuate societal inequalities. A study from the University of California found that standardized tests often reflect socio-economic disparities, with students from low-income backgrounds scoring, on average, 13 points lower than their affluent peers.
Moreover, the over-reliance on these tests in hiring processes has raised eyebrows; a 2019 survey indicated that 52% of hiring managers believed standardized test scores should not be a decisive factor in employment decisions. ...
""black and brown people are too stupid to take a photo."
On their Obamaphone?
#246 | Posted by snoofy"
You would have to ask the Democrats to clarify for you as it is their stance. Frankly, I think it is a bit racist to claim black and brown people are too stupid to find a DMV, but Democrats are going to be Democrats.
I suggest you watch this: www.youtube.com
If you are illiterate, I don't believe you should vote.
#258 | Posted by ScottS
There is no coherent reason to argue that illiterate individuals should be denied the right to vote. Such a stance conflicts with the fundamental principles of democracy, equality, and human rights.
### **Historical Context**
Literacy tests have historically been used to disenfranchise marginalized groups, particularly African Americans and immigrants, in the United States. These tests were often applied subjectively or unfairly, serving as tools of systemic discrimination rather than genuine assessments of voter competence. For example, Southern states employed literacy tests after Reconstruction to deny Black citizens their suffrage, often requiring them to interpret complex legal texts while allowing white citizens to pass with minimal effort[3][5]. This practice was abolished by the Voting Rights Act of 1965, which recognized literacy tests as discriminatory[5].
### **Democratic Principles**
The right to vote is a cornerstone of democracy and should not be contingent on literacy. Voting allows individuals to express their preferences and participate in shaping policies that affect their lives. Denying illiterate individuals the right to vote undermines the democratic principle of inclusivity and equal representation.
### **Legal Protections**
The Voting Rights Act explicitly protects individuals who struggle with literacy by allowing them to receive assistance at polling stations. Congress has affirmed that barriers such as literacy requirements disproportionately exclude certain groups from participating in elections, especially those affected by unequal educational opportunities[1][4]. Language minority provisions further ensure that election materials are accessible in multiple languages, addressing issues related to both literacy and language proficiency[4].
### **Practical Considerations**
Illiteracy does not equate to an inability to make informed decisions. Individuals who cannot read may still possess knowledge about political issues through other means, such as oral communication, community discussions, or media. Assistance at polling stations ensures they can cast their votes effectively without compromising their rights[1][6].
### **Conclusion**
Restricting voting rights based on literacy perpetuates discrimination and violates democratic ideals. Instead of excluding illiterate individuals from voting, efforts should focus on removing barriers and providing support to ensure that all citizens can participate in the electoral process equally.
Citations:
[1] www.propublica.org
[2] www.law.berkeley.edu
[3] en.wikipedia.org
[4] www.justice.gov
[5] www.britannica.com
[6] www.pbs.org
[7] ballotpedia.org
[8] www.archives.gov
[9] www.ebsco.com
[10] www.reddit.com
Oh, but wait, there's more!
[11] journals.sagepub.com
[12] aceproject.org
[13] www.pbslearningmedia.org
[14] www.un.org
[15] www.cbsnews.com
[16] publicintegrity.org
[17] www.idea.int
[18] cla.umn.edu
[19] aeon.co
[20] www.thirteen.org
[21] crsreports.congress.gov
[22] slate.com
[23] www.pbs.org
[24] licsjournal.org
[25] www.law.cornell.edu
[26] connecticuthistory.org
[27] www.carnegie.org
[28] www.justice.gov
[29] vote.uiowa.edu
[30] naacp.org
[31] www.reddit.com
[32] www.findlaw.com
[33] www.saturdayeveningpost.com
[34] www.propublica.org
[35] ocvote.gov
"It is the ability to access those DMVs, or other places to obtain an appropriate ID. Especially when you do not have a driver's license.
#265 | Posted by LampLighter"
I think you need to watch this as well: www.youtube.com
I know you are probably not trying to be racist...but, your statements are pretty racist nonetheless.
If you arrive at the airport without a REAL ID or any other TSA-approved identification, you may still be allowed to fly, but it depends on the circumstances and TSA's discretion. Here's how it works:
1. **Identity Verification Process**:
- If you lack proper ID, TSA officers may initiate an identity verification process. This involves providing personal information such as your name, current address, and other details to confirm your identity[1][3].
- You may be required to present secondary documents (e.g., a birth certificate or Social Security card) or answer questions about your identity[5].
2. **Additional Screening**:
- If your identity is successfully verified, you will undergo additional security screening, including a pat-down and thorough inspection of carry-on items[1].
3. **Risk of Denial**:
- If TSA cannot confirm your identity or if you decline to cooperate with the process, you will not be allowed to proceed through security or board the flight[1][3].
While this process provides an avenue for flying without approved ID, it is not guaranteed and can be time-consuming. It is strongly recommended to secure a REAL ID or alternative form of identification before traveling to avoid complications.
Citations:
[1] www.sportsdestinations.com
[2] www.npr.org
[3] www.reddit.com
[4] www.reddit.com
[5] www.tsa.gov
[6] www.dhs.gov
I missed this - what post number?
Bull F*****g s**. My post. drudge.com
Your post. drudge.com
F****g POS troll.
@#319 ... That ------- ...
Again, with the ad hominem attack.
Can you say "troll?"
I knew you could.
The Skillset alone that Republicans display in finding and propagandizing on things that ARE NOT actually problems.... like voting fraud, which is meniscal at best.
It's like their other Blowhard Beliefs based on the Cult's Lies; .5 percent of adults are Trans. 93+ percent of abortions are performed in 13 weeks or under.
Immigrants, including illegals, commit less crimes per capita than do citizens.
These are all FICTIONAL as major problems, and completely fixable.... other than for the Fact that they are useful scare tactics for Republicans.
As LBJ noted to Bill Moyer:
"We were in Tennessee. During the motorcade, he spotted some ugly racial epithets scrawled on signs. Late that night in the hotel, when the local dignitaries had finished the last bottles of bourbon and branch water and departed, he started talking about those signs.
"I'll tell you what's at the bottom of it," he said.
"If you can convince the lowest white man he's better than the best colored man, he won't notice you're picking his pocket. Hell, give him somebody to look down on, and he'll empty his pockets for you."
www.snopes.com
And Trump's best thing is giving people other people to look down on... so a Natural as the MAGA Cult Leader.
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