The Absurdity of the Dump-Biden Uprising

Wednesday, July 03, 2024

Stuart Stevens: What is it about the Democratic Party that engenders this kind of self-doubt and fear? At a moment when Democrats' instinct should mirror what Biden declared in a rally the day after the debate -- "When you are knocked down, you get back up" -- some in the party are seized by the urge to run, not fight. Think about how this would look: Hey, I guess Donald Trump is right; our guy isn't fit to be president. We'll give it another shot. Trust us, we''l get it right eventually. Madness.

Posted by retort at 04:31 PM | 178 COMMENTS | permalink

Democrats can win a race against him by offering Americans the opposite: steady, calm, and confident leadership. Joe Biden has provided that. His record is arguably the most impressive of any first-term president since World War II. My advice to Democrats: Run on that record; don't run from one bad debate. Show a little swagger, not timidity.

Comments

---- off. Get a new candidate now or lose.

#1 | Posted by NerfHerder at 2024-07-03 04:37 PM

The Democrats will try to gaslight you on anything-- from genocide to the mental state of the current POTUS.

How many USAs need to go belly-up before they realize the malignancy of their own hubris?

"Hey, I guess Donald Trump is right; our guy isn't fit to be president."

No guessing involved. Biden displayed it to a national audience for about 90 minutes straight.

Who are we going to believe? The press and spin doctors who have been hiding Biden's condition from us for years or our lying eyes?

"A new Reuters/Ipsos poll finds Joe Biden and Donald Trump tied at 40%, suggesting that Biden has not lost ground since the debate.

Among the names of top Democrats put before respondents, only Michelle Obama outperformed Biden and led Trump 50% to 39% in a hypothetical matchup."

politicalwire.com

Unless they can get Michelle to run, or find the Missing Unicorn other than her than could beat Trump... then Joe is still the way to go.

I'd love to have someone else... he looks better out on the Campaign now, but he prolly won't age any better.

Perhaps M Obama would take the VP spot, and that would be enough?

Mamala would be fine by me, and her popularity (not Pres race polling) is the same as Trump's at 43 percent.

She could take another position like Garland's job, and or be appointed the 10th justice on the SC.

Anyone who thinks the Democrats can dump Biden and win in November is out of their freaking mind. It would hand the election to Trump.

Every incumbent president in the last 30 years had a lousy first debate. Even Obama in 2012. Yet I don't remember Mitt Romney becoming president. Does anybody else? Seems like I'd remember that.

#6 | Posted by rcade

It all depends on Biden's on camera interview with Stephanopoulos and town halls scheduled in the next week.

Any decision should be based on public perceptions after that. And it will be his choice only to make.

If Biden does step aside, keep Harris as the VP and only replace the top with someone like KY Gov. Andy Beshear. He's 46, very intelligent, charismatic, and a candidate who'd excite the "double hater" voters who aren't happy with two 80-year-olds as well as appeal to Republican Haley voters who'd be more likely to vote for a red state Democrat.

And keeping Harris in the VP slot would avoid hurt feelings among her supporters.

PS - Beshear is term limited with 2 years remaining ...

"Every incumbent president in the last 30 years had a lousy first debate"

Every incumbent president in the last 30 years did not have progressive dementia... except for this one.

@#6 ... Anyone who thinks the Democrats can dump Biden and win in November is out of their freaking mind. It would hand the election to Trump. ...

While that may be true, what happens depends upon how Pres Biden moves forward from here and how the voters view it.

I don't think the panic over the completely manufactured hysteria about Biden extends too far...I think the NYT, CNN and other corporate media that need PO1135809 in the news cycle (or, perhaps, to appease their Russian overlords...) for ratings. It is so obvious that they are trying to destroy Biden through misinformation and disinformation, completely ignoring the absolute clown show that is PO1135809 and RFK Jr..

I'll take the geriatric guy with a speech impediment and the occasional senior moment over Orange Hitler with Alzheimer's every day and twice on Sunday.

Anyone who votes for PO1135809 wants fascism and religious theocracy. They can't handle freedom, and want to take mine away.

F--k DJT and anyone who enables him.

Michelle Obama would wipe the floor with Trump. Imagine all the minority women voters coming out of the woodwork to destroy Trump. I can.

The problem with establishment Democrats is that they are 50 years removed from any real street credibility and they no longer work creatively outside of their own narrow, limited comfort zone and hubristic and elitist power structure.

"I'll take the geriatric guy"

You go! You ride that feeble cuddy all the way to the glue factory!

Anyone who thinks the Democrats can dump Biden and win in November is out of their freaking mind. It would hand the election to Trump.
Biden winning the presidency? At this point, Dems are trying avoid Biden dragging down the House and Senate. ("Democrats fear 'MAGA trifecta' if Biden drags down House and Senate candidates" www.cnn.com).

Every incumbent president in the last 30 years had a lousy first debate. Even Obama in 2012. Yet I don't remember Mitt Romney becoming president. Does anybody else? Seems like I'd remember that. #6 | Posted by rcade
This was beyond lousy. It was embarrassing, like watching an elderly person not realize that he had soiled himself. Except this time it was on stage in front of millions.

A new Reuters/Ipsos poll finds Joe Biden and Donald Trump tied at 40%, suggesting that Biden has not lost ground since the debate [...] #5 | Posted by Corky
Meanwhile: "Trump Widens Lead to 6 pts After Biden's Debate Debacle" drudge.com

#12 | Posted by chuffy

Media certainly hasn't been focusing on Trump's train of lies, his plans for retribution and complete remaking of the federal government into a loyalist-only disaster, or his utter unsuitability to be president

Michelle Obama is 6 feet of statuesque, super sassy, ebony-shaded Trump kryptonite. The ultimate MAGA Pwn. Victory is right there for the taking! How in the hell can't the Dems come up with an offer that she can't refuse? Are they all brian-addled?

- progressive dementia

That's an opinion, and everyone has those.

It's not necessarily correct:

www.statnews.com

Dems would apparently have to guarantee the safety of her children, which is her stated concern.

And considering MAGAts, she has every right to be concerned.

More gaslighting. Don't believe your lying ears or your lying eyes!

Ceci n'est pas une pipe! -Corky

"Dems would apparently have to guarantee the safety of her children"

Life's full of tough choices. Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

And she gets to make those choices.

Respecting the one she's so far made is fair.

And expert opinion is now gaslighting?

Aren't their some nerfs somewhere that need herding?

Or is your time being taken up fully with telling women how to protect their children?

Every incumbent president in the last 30 years did not have progressive dementia... except for this one.

Biden doesn't have dementia. He has a case of being old. You know who also has the same condition and is in considerably worse physical condition because of a lifetime of scarfing down junk food and avoiding exercise? His 78-year-old opponent.

There was a democratic process for replacing Biden as the nominee -- the primaries. All the people who want to replace him now couldn't be bothered to do it then, but we're supposed to take their lead now and push him out? Pardon my language, but that's a bunch of malarkey.

#13 | POSTED BY NERFHERDER

You gonna put a gun to her head? Because that's what it's going to take. She's made it clear as day that not only will she not run for POTUS, she doesn't WANT to run for POTUS, let alone BE POTUS.

Swallow it.

And for those in denial about Biden's chances, the swing-state table I posted earlier from a poll that LampLighter referenced. Biden wasn't doing well to begin with, but after the debate even New Mexico is in play.

https://www.reddit.com/r/ezraklein/comments/1dttpiz/biden_plunges_in_swing_states_in_leaked/

And Pennsylvania? I guess they decided one mentally encumbered individual representing them meets their quota.

How did Hillary work out for you, Corky?

Can't teach an old dog new tricks!

This was beyond lousy.

It was a sub-standard debate against an opponent who lied constantly, spouted deranged nonsense, embraces fascism and wants to throw out democracy.

There's a right side and a wrong side here. Don't be like Jake Tapper and the rest of the TV bobbleheads. Focus on what actually matters.

Re 24

Because it's not her choice or her place to even suggest it at this point.

She is a normal decent human. Unlike magatonians.

Or weakass democrats who would abandon their team after one bad night.

She will keep that position and wait respectfully until or if Biden steps aside. Because this is up to him.

And for that I do not blame her.

I respect her even more.

"You gonna put a gun to her head? "

Nope, but a MAGA conceivably could if she doesn't run and Trump wins in November.

you aren't really much of a tough guy after all, are you?

Biden wasn't doing well to begin with, but after the debate even New Mexico is in play.

Dude, it is July 3. You're like a guy in the dugout who is telling everybody we've lost when it is only the fourth inning.

Michael Dukakis was leading big in the summer. Yet I don't remember his inauguration at all. Maybe a Dallas Cowboys game was on at the same time.

Polls are still stinky this far out... they mean very little other than a snapshot of now, they aren't considered predictive of 4 mos from now.

AND

- a democratic process for replacing Biden as the nominee

Here is, apparently, how it could werk right now, done within a week at the DNC.

How to Replace Biden & Beat Trump: Longtime DNC Member Jim Zogby Proposes Process to Pick New Nominee

www.democracynow.org

I'm not really a fan of any of that, having hopes of Michelle changing her mind ever since I heard Ted Cruz predict last year that she would be the Nominee coming out of the Convention.

He was clutching his pearls tightly as he said it, lol.

And you wonder why no fresh, young Democrats with ideas ever create accounts to post on this site-- the only new posters are the occasional MAGA sock puppet eager to hit their heads up against the walls of the ivory tower of the same tired, old, liberal guard.

#26

Telling a woman how to raise her children isn't your job.

If she changes her mind, great. If not that's not your business.

There are more nerfs now than ever that need herding.

Focus on what actually matters. #27 | Posted by rcade
Winning. Winning is what matters. If not the presidency, the House or Senate to stifle Hair Furor. At least until Trump starts executing them as his official acts.

Dude, it is July 3. [...] #30 | Posted by rcade
I don't see it getting better for Joe. Even if he performs as well going forward as at his State of the Union, the damage has been done. People see him as an old man who has good days and bad days. And the bad days are really bad.

Unless he digs up 2019 Joe that he's kept in the back of his closet, of course. Don't think that Joe is around anymore, though.

And you wonder why no fresh, young Democrats with ideas ever create accounts to post on this site ...

Democrats too timid to join a message board are supposed to be the ones we're listening to now about the next four years?

Even if he performs as well going forward as at his State of the Union, the damage has been done.

Nobody will be talking about this debate in a month.

Trump's "grab 'em by the -----" was a hundred times more damaging than a subpar debate performance and it came out one month before the election.

Do you remember Hillary Clinton winning that election? I don't. I must be having a senior moment. I hope fresh young Democrats don't throw me out as server admin.

Corky Your track record for picking winners is abysmal to say the least. What makes you think Michelle can win today??

"Is Michelle Obama going to run for president? No.

Is her polling lead over Donald Trump relevant anyway? Yes."

To hear Trump and his acolytes tell it, the former president isn't just a candidate, he's also the head of a powerful political movement. What's more, as far as Republicans are concerned, Trump's lead in the polls isn't rooted in an anti-Democrat sentiment; it's the result of an American electorate that loves the presumptive GOP nominee and is clamoring to vote for him.

Perhaps, though in a match-up against the former first lady, Trump not only trails by double digits, he also fails to crack 40%.

The point is, Michelle Obama's polling lead suggests there's a broad political appetite for someone other than the former president. The challenge for Democrats is presenting those voters with a ticket they'll be excited about."

www.msnbc.com

That's one point of view... though I hope it doesn't come to depending on this electorate voting for someone they prolly never heard of before (even if you and I may have).

"Telling a woman how to raise her children isn't your job."

LOL, they are adults-- 25 AND 23. They have already been raised-- and if they had sense they would encourage their mother to run.

- What makes you think Michelle can win today??

The stats at the link in #5 are pretty impressive.

#38

Maybe they are encouraging her to run. Sounds like you may not have any children if you think they become something else in their early 20's other than still your chidden.

One is still in school and the other working in filmmaking as I recall. I doubt they want to go back to a Secret Service Security Detail. It stopped when they were 16.

In the long sad history of open conventions, no nominee has gone on to win the general, so umm yeah, this would be suicide

Welp, according to BellRinger's comment here, it appears that replacing Joe in a number of states, including Georgia, Nevada, and Wisconsin, would be difficult at this late date, if not impossible.

So I guess we're stuck with him.

Yay!

The democracynow article linked in 31 would prolly disagree with that.

"The democracynow article linked in 31 would prolly(sic) disagree with that."

Probably.

The election is in four months.

Last weeks debate. While hard to recover from. Isn't the nail in the coffin everyone fears.

But, it's definitely the coffin.

Can Biden break out of it?

So I guess we're stuck with him.

Sorry you don't get your own sparkle pony unicorn that farts glitter, you'll just have to settle for the guy who got us out of Covid in better shape than any other country in the world, who isn't a convicted fraud, adjudicated rapist and doesn't owe Putin anything.

So sad for you. Maybe you'll get the unicorn pony next time.

The writer of this opinion piece asks "what engenders Democratic doubts". Well, duh. Current polling numbers and a visibly aged Joe Biden.

The democracynow article linked in 31 would prolly disagree with that.
#44 | #44 | Posted by Corky
Maybe. But from a quick search, looks like Heritage Foundation has already lawyered up for the challenges if Dems try to swap someone else in. And we know how those cases will turn out once it gets to SCOTUS.

Sorry you don't get your own sparkle pony unicorn that farts glitter, [...] So sad for you. Maybe you'll get the unicorn pony next time. #47 | Posted by chuffy
Sparkle pony? No, I was perfectly happy to vote for Joe, or anyone else that could keep Trump out of the White House. My paramount purpose being keeping Trump out of the White House.

Anyhow, it's kinda nice realizing we apparently no longer having another option. Must be similar to how Soviet citizens felt when they went grocery shopping and only got to select from one type of vodka and bread at the store. Or when they voted.

In Soviet Russia, the President selects you!

It would be great if there was someone waiting in the wings who can pull off what you are asking.

Like if there had been a legitimate primary challenger, which there wasn't. Presumably because nobody could run against him on policy or experience and it's impolite to run against age. Republicans didn't have any other contenders either, and mostly for the same reason Biden didn't, and though the media desperately wanted there to be a contest, there just wasn't.

It takes a lot to change the candidate.

Biden has built his political network over half a century. It's probably the #1 reason he's been so effective. His successor won't simply inherit all that goodwill, especially if it comes in a bitter live televised and inevitably highly embarrassing convention battle.

If this a thing that is going to happen, or not, the rabble clamoring for immediate change are not helping, now or come November, regardless of who's eventually on the ballot.

"Every incumbent president in the last 30 years had a lousy first debate.
#6 | POSTED BY RCADE"

I don't recall ANY candidate in the last 50 years (other than maybe Dan Quayle) that needed the debates to prove that his brain was not totally broken. All the others just had to state their policies, avoid too many zingers from the opponent, and avoid embarrassing themselves on stage.

This debate was totally different for Biden than any prior candidate and he failed miserably - not just on defending his current record but on looking fully sentient. If Trump maintains a lead and Biden is not swapped out, the 2nd debate will be cancelled as there is no upside for Trump and this will be the lasting memory for voters and the Dems lose in a landslide.

"Republicans didn't have any other contenders either, and mostly for the same reason Biden didn't, and though the media desperately wanted there to be a contest, there just wasn't.
#50 | POSTED BY SNOOFY"

The GOP could swap out Trump with DeSantis at any point and their lead would stay the same. If they are truly smart, they will get DeSantis on the ticket as VP now. However, I see DeSantis sitting out and waiting to win in 2028 - however, if the felony convictions would have had a major impact, it would have been relatively painless to swap in Ron. The Democrats don't have a Ron DeSantis on their bench and their VP is toxic to over half the voters. This is a problem unique to the Democrats due to how they run their party. This is why there is clamoring for Michelle Obama - someone with precisely ZERO experience at governing, running a business, or anything resembling the job of POTUS.

If the GOP swaps out Trump with DeSantis.

I'll consider voting for him.

The writer of this opinion piece asks "what engenders Democratic doubts".

In my experience as a Democrat since the age of 12, the answer to that question is "everything."

"If the GOP swaps out Trump with DeSantis.
I'll consider voting for him.
#53 | POSTED BY TOR"

My point exactly. You have to wait until 2028 though with the choice between Ron and AOC.

"#54 | POSTED BY RCADE"

What engenders the doubts is the fight over control of the Democrat party is open for all to see for the first time in decades. Even going back to Bernie - that was not a fight for control because it was the leadership vs. the people. This is a fight between the Biden faction and the Obama/Clinton faction. Usually, the Dems are great at keeping these fights internal so their party votes lockstep. Now the fissures are easy to see because, probably rightly, these factions see this as an existential threat not just for the party but for them personally.

IF you think the Supreme Court won't rule in a way that screws Democrats when the case(s) end up on their doorstep, you are nuts:

Heritage Foundation working on election legal challenges in case Biden pulled from DNC nomination

At least three swing states " Georgia, Nevada and Wisconsin " could restrict Biden's removal from the ballot
www.foxnews.com

Fred Wellman
@FPWellman

I've seen a lot of people telling me that this story means they think Biden is weak so they want him in the election. No...you're missing the goal here. What they are doing is declaring how they will conduct a coordinated lawfare campaign to screw the Democratic nominee.

First it will be this lawsuit. In close order various Republican AG's will sue the DNC on behalf of their citizens "who voted in good faith in the Primary for Joe Biden." Then they will launch coordinated campaigns to split the Democratic coalition. "See how they are treating Kamala?" "Why didn't they think California's governor leading the 3rd largest economy in the world should be nominee." it will be relentless and targeted to get people to stay home. Millions of dark money will go to third party candidates. Suddenly RFK Jr. will miraculously have the resources to get on every ballot...on and on and on.

They don't care who is on the ballot. They want us to spend time, money, and anger on each other and on defense so Trump simply strolls into the White House with 45% of the vote.

The Biden campaign needs to stop nevel gazing and get back in the fight. We all need to stop eating each other alive and remember the real enemy to our democracy is the one's cheering this on in Florida.

I don't recall ANY candidate in the last 50 years (other than maybe Dan Quayle) that needed the debates to prove that his brain was not totally broken.

Do you think Trump proved his brain is not broken? He's been up there at rallies spouting authentic frontier gibberish every time he veers off his teleprompter. And at the debate he gave us 90 minutes of deceit and nonsense, capped off by his claim that he has the cognition to be president because playing golf means you're "smart."

"Do you think Trump proved his brain is not broken?
#58 | POSTED BY RCADE"

Trump in the debate was exactly the same Trump we saw for the last 8 years. Either you like this Trump or you don't but there was no huge change. If anything, the debate format made him look more restrained - if there was no mute button, you could argue that he would have looked like he was beating up on Biden and gained some sympathy votes.

If this is the best argument you have - that both have broken brains when 90% of the GOP and 50% of Independents disagree with that assessment on Trump, then you must swap out Biden because it is a losing message.

I like this Trump in prison where he belongs after his very own hand-picked Trumper Aides and Lawyers, literally dozens of them, testified under Oath to his crimes while he was trying to overturn the Election, first with Fake Ballots, that his own DOJ wouldn't accept... and then with Fake Electors and a violent mob attacking the Capitol.

Apparently, and I may have mentioned all this before, lol, Trumpers believe all those other Trumpers were really Dem Crisis Actors... as they have no other explanation for those Aides and Lawyers telling the truth.

#58

The debate format was the big advantage for Trump. He had to behave. Joe wasn't able to have notes. Optics are as much or more important than substance in a debate.

That's why his interview with George won't be live. They can cut the freezes and the word salad.

We all need to stop eating each other alive and remember the real enemy to our democracy is the one's cheering this on in Florida. #57 | Posted by Gal_Tuesday

RCade?

Angry Staffer
@Angry_Staffer

If you're covering Biden's age issues without also acknowledging that Trump fell asleep and drooled on himself *every day* he was in court--or that he often didn't start working until noon when he was in the White House--you aren't being honest with the American people.

"That's why his interview with George won't be live. They can cut the freezes and the word salad.
#61 | POSTED BY WILLOWBY"

It took Joe 10 jump cuts to piece together his 30 second clip challenging Trump to the debate - I cannot image how many quick camera angle cuts we will have in this interview to try to make it seem more natural. Again, his last long form interview already had jump cuts and incoherent rambling even in the portion broadcast - remember this: "I No More Think Of Myself As Being As Old As I Am Than A Fly"?

So two things we know for certain:
1.) This interview will be HEAVILY edited
2.) It is not possible for the media to perform this level of editing and still maintain that they were unaware of his mental decline.

"If you're covering Biden's age issues without also acknowledging that Trump fell asleep and drooled on himself *every day* he was in court"

That is because Trump was ordered to attend a kabuki theater show trial and he displayed the utter contempt for it and all the participants as was fitting.

"--or that he often didn't start working until noon when he was in the White House
#64 | POSTED BY GAL_TUESDAY"

It is wildly reported that Joe Biden's "working day", for the days he is not on vacation, is from 11am until 4pm. This is entirely consistent with his sundowning that was witnessed at the debate. This is a guy blaming international travel from a fortnight ago for his jetlag at the debate. The claims are no longer believable.

At the Debate, Trump lied at least 30 times, and lied each time he was asked a question.

Which is something that professionals will tell you is problematic at least.

"Both candidates " Joe Biden, now 81, and Donald Trump, 78 " would set a record for the oldest president in office, and both have faced speculation about their cognitive abilities.

On the debate stage, Biden and Trump both displayed behaviors that raised red flags from their audience:

The current president had slurred speech, some garbled answers, a pause that resolved in a non sequitur;

his opponent offered answers that often bypassed logical reasoning, and lied about easily verifiable facts."

www.statnews.com

""Both candidates " Joe Biden, now 81, and Donald Trump, 78 " would set a record for the oldest president in office, and both have faced speculation about their cognitive abilities.
#67 | POSTED BY CORKY"

The speculation on Trump's cognitive abilities have been almost exclusively from people 100% committed to voting for Joe Biden so their opinions really don't matter - want proof of this?

Trump is up 6% nationally now and is crushing Biden IN EVERY SWING STATE and has turned a bunch of 'lean blue' into toss-ups for GOP leads: like Minnesota, New Jersey, Colorado, and New Mexico. This simply would not be the case if there was a legitimate call from outside of the already Joe Biden committed voters to dump Trump.

The real danger for the Dems is that the only candidate that they could insert and keep access to Joe's campaign war chest is Kamala (the current VP, not the Ugandan Giant for clarity). While the down ballot bloodbath is not currently showing in the polls, it will absolutely materialize on election day as a vast majority of voters are straight ticket and whether it is Biden or Harris, it will be an electoral landslide for Trump.

This has to be a propaganda piece.

These are legitimate concerns of registered voters.

Biden was just awarded a massive nuclear option by the SC. he's sorta in the position occupied by Truman in 1945...drop the bomb?

lots of folks said don't do it...Harry said "were going to stop this right now"

Biden can look to Chamberlain or to Truman for guidance. I hope he chooses Harry

"Biden was just awarded a massive nuclear option by the SC.
#71 | POSTED BY BRERRABBIT"

How so? The SC ruling just reiterated what has been understood from the founding of the Republic.

POSTED BY CLAUDIO AT 2024-07-03 11:18 PM | REPLY

Nixon proves that wrong. Please do try again for you know not what you speak about.

"Nixon proves that wrong. Please do try again for you know not what you speak about.
#73 | POSTED BY LAURAMOHR"

How so? How was covering up breaking into your opponents campaign office an 'official act'? Nixon played out exactly as the system should - Nixon would be impeached for his actions (making them unofficial by definition) and then he could face criminal prosecution unless pardoned. This ruling just cements that process.

Traitor Claudio... It does sorta have a ring to it.

A ring of truth.

What you won't hear him commenting on is #60.

"What you won't hear him commenting on is #60.
#75 | POSTED BY CORKY"

What is there to address in #60? This was the same argument Joe made during the debate and public reaction to it was coming to a near unanimous agreement that Joe has a broken brain and Trump going up +6% in the latest national polls.

Harris/Whitmer 2024.

Like I said, he's got nothing, ROFL

Your Cult Leader is a traitor to his country and a criminal, and you are one of his enablers.

Just another dumbass with no argument to the facts of the testimony of his own people.

This thread is hilarious. The debate fully exposed what any of us have been witnessing for years now - Biden has full blown dementia. It's sad, actually.

Yet replacing him at this late stage is very difficult. So the party hacks have to spin big time.

"Yet replacing him at this late stage is very difficult. So the party hacks have to spin big time.
#79 | POSTED BY BELLRINGER"

The way I see it is that the Dems have about 6 or 7 days to remove Biden so attacks on him by the Democrats and press will ramp up over this time. After 6 or 7 days, if Biden survives as the nominee - the press and party will circle the wagons around him and we will get the same nonsense of 'just a bad night' or 'jetlag' and they will beat the drum on that over and over until the public accepts The Big Lie.

Dems - especially establishment Dems like Biden - rarely do what i would consider to be the obvious and right thing. Therefore, half-dead Biden will be the candidate.

Seems like the only way Joe can be replaced is if he refuses to run and "Dr" Jill isn't having any of that.

Therefore, half-dead Biden will be the candidate.

#81 | Posted by JOE at 2024-07-04 07:51 AM | Reply | Flag:

And student loan forgiveness isn't going to be enough to hold the young vote. A lot of them are going to migrate to Warren and Kennedy.

#83 Most young voters are too stupid to realize that SCOTUS now controls the US, and that they'd be vastly better off with Biden's corpse making those appointments than Donald Trump and the Federalist Society.

Why are you childishly and moronically putting quotes around Jill Biden's professional title? She earned the title. It is proper to use it. She and others that have their PhD should be accorded that respect.

#85
Why? Bitterness. Ignorance. The usual MAGAtry.

"This has to be a propaganda piece."

It is. And that's why all the operatives that inhabit this site are here defending it.
It's a truly ugly thing when the truth is exposed as clear as the light of day and you witness political shills desperately trying to pull the curtain back closed.
It happened with Israel several months ago and now it's happening with Biden.

All shall be revealed.

I'm open on this end.
I'll get behind whoever can defeat Trump and isn't batsttt crazy.

- Biden has full blown dementia.

Dr. Belle hath spoken, lmao!

What a hack.

If he did, he wouldn't be doing so well campaigning post-debate.

Do you think Trump proved his brain is not broken?

#58 | POSTED BY RCADE AT 2024-07-03 08:27 PM

"Trump is broken, therefore it's okay if Biden is broken too."

Anti-Trump voters expect more than that.

RCP Poll Average 46.7 43.8 Trump +2.9
5-Way RCP Average 42.6 38.4 Trump +4.2
Top Battlegrounds 47.6 44.3 Trump +3.3
Favorability Ratings -11.4 -16.7 Trump +5.3
RCP Betting Odds 55.5 13.8

It wasn't travel. He wasn't sick. He prepped for a week. The damage of this debate performance is on par with Nixon sweating under studio lights.

It's a comic punchline come to life, to paraphrase "Trump tries to get in their head. You can't get in Biden's head. Joe's not even in there."

Wow... polls 4 mos out from the election reflect the snapshot in time of a poor debate performance.

Shocking, I tells ya!

Trump in the debate was exactly the same Trump we saw for the last 8 years.

You gotta be kidding me. Trump hasn't been the same for eight years. Anyone can tell the difference when they see his rallies. He is a 78-year-old man in significant mental and physical decline.

Part of the mental decline is the incessant lying; if you know your lies by heart, that's all you have to know because the facts don't matter.

And his Base has been fed the lies, so that's all he needs.

Indies otoh, aren't quite so gullible, and the debate was about moving Indies.

Neither candidate did that for a their final decisions.

Trump is broken, therefore it's okay if Biden is broken too

I don't think that was the argument. More that, if you're going to use "cognitive decline" as a basis to demand Biden drop out of the race, then there should be an equal if not louder drumbeat for Trump to exit the race.

Trump is held to a different standard because everyone knows he's a psychopath. So when he rambles on for ten minutes like the most senile grandpa you've ever encountered in your life, people don't bat an eye. Biden is unequally burdened with the expectation that he act normal.

When somebody goes on and on about Biden being old and never says a word about Trump, it should be obvious they are just spinning for one side instead of making any attempt to speak their mind honestly and truthfully.

"It's not fair!"

Yeah, no ----. Pray to all of the gods that Biden doesn't descend into mumbling stammers again in the next 4 months.

" When somebody goes on and on about Biden being old and never says a word about Trump, it should be obvious they are just spinning for one side instead of making any attempt to speak their mind honestly and truthfully".

Or they hate Trump so completely and are so fearful of another Trump presidency that they realize the only way to beat him at this point is for Biden to drop out and allow for another candidate. And in order to do that you have to focus solely on criticizing Biden's mental fitness. Sorry that bothers you so much, but it's the truth. I voted for the guy in 2020 because he had the best chance to beat Trump. He did. 2024 is a lot different than 2020 and at this point Biden stands no chance. Stop spinning like the local amusement park tilt-o-whirl and stick a fork in him, because he's done.

I don't have as much skin in the game as others. I am 32, single, and have dual citizenship and a Swiss passport and can go anywhere in the world to get far, far away from America after Trump takes office. I don't think others here have quite the same opportunity. The Democrats are gonna ruin a lot of Americans lives if they don't act ASAP.

"so fearful.. that they realize"

If fear-powered crystal balls worked, that would be nice.

- they realize the only way to beat him at this point is for Biden to drop out and allow for another candidate.

drudge.com

In my favorite movie (Animal House) there are two great American speeches by Eric "Otter" Stratton (Rush Chairman, Who's Damned Glad to Meet You).

In his post-Toga Party speech, Otter effectively argues that Trump and all of his depravities are merely reflections of a greater rot in our society that transcends the individual or group and are, in fact, institutionalized at the highest levels of power.

His post-Expulsion speech takes the rhetorical torch from Bluto's hand and asserts that the only way to truly protest oppression and affect positive change is "to go all out" and requires what many would deem a "really stupid and futile gesture".

Getting Michelle Obama to agree to run might be that type of gesture, but it is something that NEEDS to be attempted.

Michelle Obama will steer that Democrat Deathmobile at ramming speed toward and straight through that rickety grandstand that Donald J. Trump has constructed as his MAGA throne.

And when all is said and done, she'll come out on top and he'll be sitting below, vanquished and muttering incoherently, with not even the power to remove his thumb from his own ass.

What's with the Michelle thing?
Just about any Democrat governor makes more sense than Michelle Obama.

"A new Reuters/Ipsos poll finds Joe Biden and Donald Trump tied at 40%, suggesting that Biden has not lost ground since the debate.

Among the names of top Democrats put before respondents, only Michelle Obama outperformed Biden and led Trump 50% to 39% in a hypothetical matchup."

from the link at #5

Simple. They cannot and will not win.

Having picked the last two presidential winners and the last three World Series champs, I'm confident of the accuracy of my own crystal balls.

Have you asked Michelle if she wants to be President? I'm pretty sure she does not want that.

@#6 ... Every incumbent president in the last 30 years had a lousy first debate. Even Obama in 2012. ...

Poll numbers were different in 2012. Going into the October 3, 2012 debate, fmr Pres Obama had a three-to-four point lead. ( www.realclearpolling.com )

Compared to 2024 where Pres Biden seems to have been trailing fmr Pres Trump going into the debate. ( www.realclearpolling.com )

Plus, unlike Pres Biden, the debate performance did not seem to confirm what had been said about fmr Pres Obama leading up to the debate.

Will Pres Biden be able to have his poll numbers react in a similar manner to how the numbers reacted after the Obama-Romney debate?

I've not a clue. I'd say that tomorrow's interview may be a good starting point.

" Have you asked Michelle if she wants to be President?"

I'm not the one to be asking her- she needs to ask that question herself.

"Ask not what your country can do for you; ask what you can do for your country."
-some dead Democrat who gave his life for his country.

A new Reuters/Ipsos poll finds Joe Biden and Donald Trump tied at 40%, suggesting that Biden has not lost ground since the debate.

Among the names of top Democrats put before respondents, only Michelle Obama outperformed Biden and led Trump 50% to 39% in a hypothetical matchup."

from the link at #5

#103 | Posted by Corky

do you have an ap...something like "POLLS-R-US dot com ? and it searches until you find what you want /

not what is ? let's see what the "OLD GRAY LADY" has for us.

"Trump Widens Lead After Biden's Debate Debacle, Times/Siena Poll Finds"

--"Donald Trump is ahead of President Biden by six percentage points among likely voters in a new national survey. Overall, 74 percent of voters view Mr. Biden as too old for the job, an uptick since the debate."

www.nytimes.com

Overall, 74 percent of voters view Mr. Biden as too old for the job, an uptick since the debate."

--kiss of death for the brain dead geezer ?

or impetus for a cover up....of the cover up..

hopefully you're all with family / drinking good beer and stuffed with enough dogs to satisfy

joey chestnut to reply too soon...so for those of you with your laptop at starbucks

googling " latest trends in man buns and shoulder purses"

----in case you get your bowels in a leftist-dogma KLAN uproar over the statement "cover up of the cover up"...and want to get all

suck on this....

www.youtube.com

ShrimpDickDan is still fantasizing about how all those Trumpers who worked for Trump in the WH and then testified against him for his J6 crimes, including his daughter who said he KNEW he had lost the Election...

... that all those Trumpers are actually Dem Crisis Actors!

He's SURE of it!

"Or weakass democrats who would abandon their team after one bad night."
#28

And there it is in a nutshell... how we end up with Trump and Biden. Two extremist orgs, the far right and the far left viewing it their team, and not candidates that would sell them out in a second for a vote.

They're not on your "team", there on no ones team but their own and out for their own self interests. Perhaps if both sides have the balls to not show up and vote for either of these piece of sh333t candidates we could send a message to the puppet masters running the RNC and DNC that they can't keep trotting out the same pieces of trash. But no one will, because they have to support their team.

F*$%#ing cowards

... that all those Trumpers are actually Dem Crisis Actors!

He's SURE of it!

#111 | Posted by Corky

I'm sure you're either drunk....

or you're just meandering around desperate to move on from the polling beat down

you just suffered from me.

#112 | Posted by kwrx25 a

dayum...there's a lot to process there.

--Money is power / power corrupts / both parties run on money.

I reread "John Adams" by David McCullough recently for the third time and
if they would just do what he and the others did.

serve your country / then get the 'f' out and go home / do real work for a living and
more importantly...live under the laws you just passed for everyone else.

but alas.........

@#108 .... do you have an ap...something like "POLLS-R-US dot com ? ...

What I find useful is the page...

2024 General Election: Trump vs. Biden
www.realclearpolling.com

Data on the most recent polls (including links to the polls and, e.g., margin of error) are near the top of the page, with a short-term rolling average graph of the recent polls visible if you scroll down a bit.

Scroll down further, and older polls are shown.

congrats to Jill Biden..
after all these years...she's still the babysitter.

I'm glad that Nancy Reagan knew when it was time to shield her husband from
the world stage; then again...she loved her husband.

** #110------sorry for posting the utube twice.....watching and listening to the sycophant lying POS
morning joe once is enough to bring blood to your ears and understand that the democrat
cover up starts and ends at places like msnbc.

kilroy was here.

es-si

-30-

#96 | POSTED BY RCADE AT 2024-07-04 11:59 AM | FLAG: "

We saw the difference on split screen a week ago and it was stark. You are being delusional.

@#117 ... We saw the difference on split screen a week ago and it was stark. ...

So far, a one-time occurrence for Pres Biden, yet an ongoing occurrence for fmr Pres Trump.

I'm one of the first to ask (see my posts on this site) whether or not it was just a one-time occurrence for Pres Biden.

But I also ask, why does the GOP seem to put up with eight years of such incoherent ramblings from fmr Pres Trump?

Is it the usual ~GOP accusing others of things they themselves commit?~

"We saw the difference on split screen a week ago and it was stark. You are being delusional.
#117 | POSTED BY BELLRINGER"

The libs claim that Trump has shown the same type of decline as Joe - but, it can be easily argued that Trump's last debate performance (with no prep) was his best one to date. He spoke clearly, coherently, and was not rude to Joe or the moderators by talking over them. He looked more presidential than ever. That is not a decline in his mental abilities - it is the exact opposite.

@#119 ... The libs claim that Trump has shown the same type of decline as Joe ...

Is that what the "libs" claim?

Or are they saying that fmr Pres Trump has not declined since 2016, but that he has had a babbling issue?

I mean, when fmr Pres Trump was President, did you even listen to listen to is press conferences?

I did.

Rambling, incoherent and unable to maintain a train of thought are what come to mind.

That was four years ago.

He has not gotten better.

... He spoke clearly, coherently, ...

Coherently implies logically and consistently, that he did not speak of some alternate reality he imagines.

I did not see coherent in fmr Pres Trump during the debate.

But, yeah, fmr Pres Trump seems to have had a rare good night, as opposed to Pres Biden having a rare bad one.

What else yer got?

- He spoke clearly, coherently

At the Debate, Trump lied at least 30 times, and lied each time he was asked a question.

Which is something that professionals will tell you is problematic at least.

"Both candidates " Joe Biden, now 81, and Donald Trump, 78 " would set a record for the oldest president in office, and both have faced speculation about their cognitive abilities.

On the debate stage, Biden and Trump both displayed behaviors that raised red flags from their audience:

The current president had slurred speech, some garbled answers, a pause that resolved in a non sequitur;

his opponent offered answers that often bypassed logical reasoning, and lied about easily verifiable facts."

drudge.com

link should be

www.statnews.com

"Is that what the "libs" claim?"

That is what the lib in #93 clearly stated.

"Coherently implies logically and consistently, that he did not speak of some alternate reality he imagines."

What alternate reality? You are the type of ------- that wants to fact check a Packer fan when he claims Brett Favre is the greatest QB ever. It is an opinion - that cannot be fact checked by definition. Now, you may disagree with his statements but about half the country agrees as shown in the polls. Yes, Trump's economy was materially better than what Biden is delivering now. Was it the 'greatest' economy ever? Depends on your opinion and how you define an economy as great.

"But, yeah, fmr Pres Trump seems to have had a rare good night, as opposed to Pres Biden having a rare bad one.
#120 | POSTED BY LAMPLIGHTER"

Biden's night was a 'rare' one? If you -------- actually believed that to be the case, we would not have this thread to debate now.

@#123 ... That is what the lib in #93 clearly stated. ...

Was it clearly stated? I do not see that.

@#123 ... What alternate reality? ...

The one in which MAGA seems to reside. The one in which "alternate facts" rule.

Kellyanne Conway says Donald Trump's team has alternative facts.' Which pretty much says it all. (2017)
www.washingtonpost.com

... "Alternative facts are not facts. They are falsehoods," Chuck Todd tells Pres. Trump's counselor Kellyanne Conway this morning. ...

Do we really need to go into this again?

@#123 ... Biden's night was a 'rare' one? If you -------- actually believed that to be the case ...

OK, maybe the use of the word "rare" was not the best word to use.

But my point still holds.

Fmr Pres Trump shows similar behavior repeatedly.

Why doesn't your current alias seem to have an issue with that?

At this point it is looking like the MAGA GOP is looking to use one bad performance by Pres Biden to try to cover up a years-long continuing series of bad performances by fmr Pres Trump.

Do I need to talk about sharks and batteries?

"Was it clearly stated? I do not see that."

This was the exact statement: 'He is a 78-year-old man in significant mental and physical decline.' So, yes, he made exactly that claim.

"@#123 ... What alternate reality? ...
The one in which MAGA seems to reside."

'Alternate' does not denote 'alternate to reality' is simply means alternate to the reality in which liberal inhabit. For instance, liberals believe that they must mask while driving alone in their cars and take 6 boosters or they will die from covid. Conservatives believe this is not necessary. Liberals believe global warming will end the world within a decade - conservatives believe this is nonsensical alarmism. There are opinions on both sides that the liberals can't understand because they believe their opinions are facts.

Reagan said it best: The trouble with our Liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so.

"Fmr Pres Trump shows similar behavior repeatedly.
#125 | POSTED BY LAMPLIGHTER"

Provide link to this - specifically Trump falling down, Trump freezing up at a debate, Trump misreading a teleprompter cues like Ron Burgundy, or staff continually having to guide him around to prevent him from wondering off - including the Easter bunny.

Trump Rants About Sharks, and Everyone Just Pretends It's Normal (June 2024)
www.theatlantic.com

... Hours before meeting with his probation officer about his recent felony convictions, a leading candidate for U.S. president went on a bizarre rant about sharks.

Sharks, Donald Trump claimed, were attacking more frequently than usual (not true) and posed a newfound risk because boats were being required to use batteries (not true), which would cause them to sink because they were too heavy (really, really not true -- the world's heaviest cruise ship, the Icon of the Seas, managed to stay afloat because of the laws of physics despite weighing more than 550 million pounds).

Trump, undeterred by truth or science, invoked his intellectual credentials by mentioning his "relationship to MIT."

(Trump's uncle was a professor at the university, pioneering rotational radiation therapy, which seems a somewhat tenuous connection for conferring shark- or battery-related expertise to his nephew.)

If Trump had been able to ask his uncle about the risks of being electrocuted by a boat battery because, as Trump put it, "there's a lot of electric current coming through that water," perhaps the professor would have informed him that high-capacity batteries would rapidly discharge in seawater and pose minuscule risk to humans because the water conducts electricity far better than human bodies do.

Sharks appear to have troubled Trump's mind for years. On July 4, 2013, Trump twice tweeted about them, saying, "Sorry folks, I'm just not a fan of sharks -- and don't worry, they will be around long after we are gone." Two minutes later, he followed that nugget of wisdom with: "Sharks are last on my list -- other than perhaps the losers and haters of the World!"

These deranged rants are tempting to laugh off. They're par for the course.

Trump is Trump. But Trump may also soon be the president of the United States. Imagine the response if Joe Biden had made the same rambling remarks, word for word. Consider this excerpt:

"I say, What would happen if the boat sank from its weight and you're in the boat and you have this tremendously powerful battery and the battery's underwater, and there's a shark that's approximately 10 yards over there?' By the way, a lot of shark attacks lately. Do you notice that?

A lot of shark ... I watched some guys justifying it today: Well, they weren't really that angry. They bit off the young lady's leg because of the fact that they were not hungry, but they misunderstood who she was.' These people are crazy."

Coming from Biden, that exact statement might have prompted calls from across the political spectrum for him to drop out of the race. From Trump, it was a blip that barely registered. ...

[emphasis mine]

Wow.

@#126 ... 'Alternate' does not denote 'alternate to reality' is simply means alternate to the reality in which liberal inhabit. ...

Yup.

"Alternate facts."

Truth has a liberal bias.

Deal with it.

@#127 ... Provide link to this ...

As I said, fmr Pres Trump exhibits this behavior repeatedly.

Just look at the videos of his rallies. I doubt if I have to give your current alias links to those.

Trump. Rally. Insanity. Lies. Lies. Lies even about the crowd size, even stooping so low as to use a Rod Stewart concert image from Rio de Janerio courtesy of that degenerate Roger Stone:
www.usatoday.com

Biden was standing on the balconey of the WH about 905pm tonight pretending to be in awe of fireworks with large shxxt stain on his lower right suit coat. His servant came out and whispered about it. The grandkids all came out on command and gave him cover from cameras as the servant cleaned him up. LOL. Will the media cover it?

Biden is more concerned about pride month than July 4th. Our country is in a funk because of Biden a leader who doesnt lead.
www.msn.com

@#132 .. pretending to be in awe ...

You know he was pretending? How?

... Will the media cover it?

You say you saw it, so obviously, the question is moot.

"Lies even about the crowd size
#131 | POSTED BY YAV"

You -------- are stuck on stupid when it comes to crowd size. Even comparing Trump to Obama - I think an argument can be made that the total crowd (as in live attendance + TV + internet) was much larger than Obama's. Of course in liberal world, you want to define 'crowd' in a way to back your claims that Trump lies. The reality for most people is that there is a big difference between a liar and a ---------------------- - -------- used to understand this before their TDS set in.

Even when we have the actual authorities weighing in - like in New Jersey - -------- still claim he lied because MSNBC told you so. Yeah, the same MSNBC that told you Biden's brain was not broken right up to the debate. But, you believe them - those are liberal 'alternate facts'.

"You say you saw it, so obviously, the question is moot.
#133 | POSTED BY LAMPLIGHTER"

It is not moot. The media should highlight it so even the dull knives like yourselves can finally be awakened from your stupor. When the media realizes what they inadvertently allowed to air, they will censor it.

" I think an argument can be made that the total crowd (as in live attendance + TV + internet) was much larger than Obama's."

It can, but it wasn't. Spicer specifically claimed IN PERSON was largest.
amp.theguardian.com

Spicer specifically said he regretted saying that.
time.com

But Clod is here, to lie to us, about what Spicer already admitted.

" The reality for most people is that there is a big difference between a liar and a ----------------------"

Well, since Sean Spicer just proved your BS claim wrong, which one of those are you?

"It can, but it wasn't. Spicer specifically claimed IN PERSON was largest.
#136 | POSTED BY DANFORTH"

The claim was that Trump lied - not Spicer. I don't think you want to play 'which staff lies more' when you have Cringe Jean Pierre at the podium representing your team.

But to my earlier point - Democrats crying about Trump lying about crowd sizes is like Joe Biden trying to bring up golf scores at the last debate - it is a stupid argument to even bring up for the ------- Dems.

@#135 . ... The media should highlight ...

So, your current alias now admits, it was not that "media" did not cover it, but that your current alias did not like how the "media" covered it.

That's quite the retreat. Quite a significant retreat.

... When the media realizes what they inadvertently allowed to air, they will censor it. ...

OK. If your current alias says so.

Clodio is using "-------" a lot... this means he's melting down under the pressure of not having any arguments beyond debunked talking points from years ago.

@#138 ... Democrats crying about Trump lying about crowd sizes is like ...

How many times does fmr Pres Trump (or his surrogates) lie about crowd sizes?

Or is your current alias purveying yet another false equivalence?

@#140 ... Clodio is using "-------" a lot... this means he's melting down under the pressure of not having any arguments beyond debunked talking points from years ago. ...

Well, yeah.

Sometimes, I actually feel bad about asking that current alias to substantiate the nonsense it posts.

I mean, there is so much of it.

One side of me asks, does it post so much nonsense in order to try to normalize it, much as fmr Pres Trump has normalized lying?

" The claim was that Trump lied - not Spicer."

What a riot. Only a moron thinks Trump didn't INSTRUCT Spicer to tell that lie.

Are you such a moron you actually believe Spicer went rogue, on day one?!?

Sometimes, I actually feel bad about asking that current alias to substantiate the nonsense it posts.

As well you should. But don't let that stop you. :-)

"Clodio is using "-------" a lot...
#140 | POSTED BY REDIAL"

This is what happens when the % of posters that are -------s increases. Maybe I need to start clarifying by giving you a number like ------- 1 and ------- 2 so you feel more special.

"Only a moron thinks Trump didn't INSTRUCT Spicer to tell that lie.
#143 | POSTED BY DANFORTH"

1.) Link to your claim or admit that you are making ---- up
2.) Again, the claim was about what TRUMP said and you, again, failed miserably to prove your point

You are now officially ------- 1.

"Link to your claim or admit that you are making ---- up"

You're pretending Spicer went rogue.

Even you're not THAT dumb.

Optimism.
Always appreciated.

@#145 ... This is what happens when the % of posters that are -------- increases ...

So, your current alias seems to admit it has nothing besides name calling?

@#146 ... You are now officially ------- 1. ...

To my point.

Why not try to discuss the topic of the thread instead of the ad hominem attacks?

Is your current alias so unsure of the opinion it proffers?

Spicergate, explained: the controversy about Trump's press secretary and crowd size (2017)
www.vox.com

... "This was the largest audience to ever witness an inauguration, period. Both in person and around the globe."

The new White House press secretary, Sean Spicer, introduced himself to the American people this weekend with these words " words that came after a series of tendentious factual claims about attendance at President Donald Trump's inauguration and that made a remarkable contrast with readily available photographic evidence.

Spicer's statement made for a jarring introduction to the new Trump administration, and he came in for a good deal of condemnation from reporters and mockery from observers of all political stripes. A hashtag called #SeanSpicerFacts, in which pictures of Spicer at the briefing were posted alongside humorous false claims, trended on Twitter.

Two days later, when he was pushed at Monday's first full press briefing, Spicer said he was "not" saying Trump had the largest in-person inaugural crowd.

Indeed, he argued that he had never made such a claim, saying that he was only referring to the combined in-person, TV, and streaming global audience as the largest.

This claim about the total audience was also quite questionable, and as the Weekly Standard's Michael Warren archly observed, "Why it took Spicer two days to make this clarification wasn't clear." But the shift seemed sufficient to satisfy many reporters, many of whom publicly praised Spicer's performance Monday.

At its heart, this squabble about crowd size may not seem particularly consequential.

But this dust-up has broader implications for how the new Trump administration is shaping up -- in how it will deal with the press, in whether it can be trusted to provide basic factual information, and in just how hard the press corps is going to push back. ...

#150

Ooops, forgot to include...

Emphasis mine.

"The claim was that Trump lied - not Spicer. I don't think you want to play 'which staff lies more' when you have Cringe Jean Pierre at the podium representing your team."

So, in the same post Clod insists JP speaks for Biden, he contends Spicer wasn't speaking for Trump.

It's like the comedy writes itself!

"You're pretending Spicer went rogue.
Even you're not THAT dumb.
#147 | POSTED BY DANFORTH"

Yeah, because NO ONE ever went rogue in the Trump White House - right, ------- #1? General Milley is on line 1 for you along with Anthony Scaramouchi.

So, provide a link or admit that you lied.

"So, in the same post Clod insists JP speaks for Biden, he contends Spicer wasn't speaking for Trump."

That was never my claim ------- #1. My statement was that you don't want to play which Staff lies more with Cringe Jean Pierre at the podium. No where did I contend that Cringe speaks for Biden - although it is clear that someone tweets for him given his tweets during the presidential debate debacle.

"It's like the comedy writes itself!
#152 | POSTED BY DANFORTH"

It is like your total lack of logic gives you idiot's bliss.

"So, provide a link or admit that you lied."

I provided a link where Spicer made the statement. I provided a link where Spicer admitted embarrassment.

You want everyone to believe Spicer went rogue on day one, was talking out his azzzz, and not speaking for the President.

Everyone with a room temperature IQ or higher knows Trump TOLD Spicer to make that claim.

I guess that excludes you.

"Yeah, because NO ONE ever went rogue in the Trump White House - right ... ?"

Not on the first day, and kept his job, no.

Seriously ... this is where you're hanging your hat?!? That Trump DIDN'T tell Spicer to make that claim?!? You're using your entire life's worth of knowledge, every bit of your training, all your political intuition ... and that's your honest conclusion???

@#155 ... Everyone with a room temperature IQ or higher knows Trump TOLD Spicer to make that claim. ...

Donald Trump Rally Crowd Size Claims Have One Major Problem (June 2024)
www.newsweek.com

... Donald Trump's claim about the crowd size at his Las Vegas rally has one major problem"the venue doesn't accommodate the number of people he touted were there. ...

Fact check: Trump falsely claims police turned away thousands' from Manhattan courthouse and that supporters can't get near' (April 2024)

... Former President Donald Trump is a famed exaggerator of the size of his crowds. For years, he has lied about how many supporters attended his presidential inauguration and numerous campaign rallies.

Now he's pushing a wildly inaccurate claim about how many supporters have attempted to show up at his first criminal trial -- and he's making additional false claims about security measures around the Manhattan courthouse, which he is baselessly blaming for keeping these supposed supporters away.

After The New York Times published a story that said Trump was unhappy with the meager crowd he saw when he arrived at the courthouse for opening statements on Monday, Trump posted on social media on Tuesday to deny the story, denigrate a Times reporter and make this claim: "Thousands of people were turned away from the Courthouse in Lower Manhattan by steel stanchions and police, literally blocks from the tiny side door from where I enter and leave. It is an armed camp to keep people away." ...

[emphasis mine]

Trump inauguration crowd photos were edited after he intervened (2018)
www.theguardian.com

Etc., etc., etc., etc.

Yeah, fmr Pres Trump seems to have an issue about crowd sizes.