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Drudge Retort: The Other Side of the News
Monday, September 09, 2024

"Without involving the Afghan government, [Trump] and his Administration negotiated a deal with the Taliban that freed 5,000 Taliban fighters and allowed them to return to the battlefield, ... Then, he left President Biden and Vice President Harris with no plans to execute a withdrawal, and with little time to do so. This chaotic approach severely hindered the Biden-Harris Administration's ability to execute the most orderly withdrawal possible and put our service members and our allies at risk."

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The Military Brass is just waiting for this ----- to try another insurrection... as we used to say, his ass will be grass.

www.urbandictionary.com

#1 | Posted by Corky at 2024-09-09 04:49 PM | Reply

Open Letter from Generals Blames Trump for Afghanistan Loss

Clearly, they are GINOs. (I really hope that Trump uses phrase.)

#2 | Posted by censored at 2024-09-09 07:48 PM | Reply | Funny: 3

... Without involving the Afghan government, [Trump] and his Administration negotiated a deal with the Taliban that freed 5,000 Taliban fighters and allowed them to return to the battlefield, ... Then, he left President Biden and Vice President Harris with no plans to execute a withdrawal, and with little time to do so. ...

If I thought that fmr Pres Trump had an ability to plan, I'd say that he intentionally set up Pres Biden to fail in the withdrawal.

#3 | Posted by LampLighter at 2024-09-09 07:58 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 6

If I thought that fmr Pres Trump had an ability to plan, I'd say that he intentionally set up Pres Biden to fail in the withdrawal.

And had Trump won in 2020, he would have finished the withdrawal exactly how he negotiated the deal with the Taliban, even more recklessly because he would have made the military do it sooner (the agreement was for complete pullout by May 2021).

And when the fubar eventually happened, Trump would have laid full blame on the generals - just like he did with the first military action he took after becoming President which cost the life of a Navy Seal.

#4 | Posted by tonyroma at 2024-09-09 08:16 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Just this week an unmanned remote-controlled aircraft filled with explosives made in Iran and purchased by Russia as part of their invasion of Ukraine crashed in Latvia which is now a NATO country and could in Theory trigger a third world war.

We can no longer afford to have foolish old people in the White House.

#5 | Posted by Tor at 2024-09-09 08:37 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 5

This open letter will be mentioned on page A16 of the Thursday edition of the NYT, in a two-sentence line of 3 column article about how Kamala Harris didn't put "Worked at McDonalds" on her CV when she was running for AG.

#6 | Posted by chuffy at 2024-09-09 08:54 PM | Reply

He negotiated the withdrawal without the Afghan Government, set an unrealistic withdrawal date, released 5,000 Taliban terrorists and blamed Biden for the loss of 13 soldiers killed by an Al Qaeda suicide bomber.

FDT is a dishonorable man.

#7 | Posted by chuffy at 2024-09-09 09:00 PM | Reply

@#7 ... He negotiated the withdrawal without the Afghan Government, set an unrealistic withdrawal date, released 5,000 Taliban terrorists ...

While i mostly agree with the part of your comment I posted, I do have one concern....

Was there an Afghan Government in place?

At the time I saw little of anything resembling a government in Afghanistan.

And that was a significant problem there.

It seemed to be the Taliban, or no government.




#8 | Posted by LampLighter at 2024-09-09 09:08 PM | Reply

Was there an Afghan Government in place?

Sort of. That's who owned all the former US military hardware that was left there. And who released the 5,000 Taliban prisoners.

#9 | Posted by REDIAL at 2024-09-09 09:22 PM | Reply

Don't forget that Dotard also refused to brief the incoming Biden Administration on anything, thus leaving them with no idea what they were stepping into on COVID, or in the Middle East and Afghanistan, etc. He drew down our troops in Afghanistan to an unsustainably small number, 2500 if memory serves and abandoned all but one airfield. He left the Biden Admin with no good choices, either he could surge more troops into Afghanistan to help make the withdrawal more orderly, but miss the deadline or stick to the deadline and get what we got, which was honestly a miracle in spite of the troops that gave their lives. It was entirely the fault of Dotard for leaving Biden no good options. It was Dotard's plan, and intended to he a poison pill for President Biden.

#10 | Posted by _Gunslinger_ at 2024-09-09 09:36 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 7

@#9 ... Sort of. ...

So, no?

#11 | Posted by LampLighter at 2024-09-09 09:50 PM | Reply

Ashraf Ghani escaped into exile when he found out that the FDT Admin brokered the release of the Taliban terrorists. It's not certain that he would've been effective, regardless, but letting the Taliban loose sealed the deal. Bro decided he wanted to take a few bags of cash and keep his head on his neck...

#12 | Posted by chuffy at 2024-09-09 10:27 PM | Reply

The Islamic Republic of Afghanistan was the established government from 2001 to 2021.

As I understand it, there was really nothing anyone could do about the Al Qaeda suicide bomber. That was a terrorist attack, not related to any military activity, it was just an easy target during the amazingly successful withdrawal of troops.

FDT did everything he could to kill our troops to "make Biden look bad." I'm surprised he wasn't fragged as CiC.

#13 | Posted by chuffy at 2024-09-09 10:37 PM | Reply

This is the stupidest thing ever.

On his first day in office Biden undid all sorts of Trump EO's pertaining to the border.

Biden/Harris we're on no way bound to anything Trump put in place and have bragged about that.

Further, it was Biden/Harris who had 100% control over HOW the evacuation was handled and structured.

#14 | Posted by BellRinger at 2024-09-10 02:51 AM | Reply | Funny: 2

#14 | Posted by BellRinger

So you're just like Trump, eh? He "knows more than the generals" too

Geesh

#15 | Posted by AMERICANUNITY at 2024-09-10 03:59 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

#14
FLAG: Sad

#16 | Posted by Doc_Sarvis at 2024-09-10 06:57 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

On his first day in office Biden undid all sorts of Trump EO's pertaining to the border.
#14 | Posted by BellRinger

"Without involving the Afghan government, [Trump] and his Administration negotiated a deal with the Taliban that freed 5,000 Taliban fighters and allowed them to return to the battlefield"

So, Biden could issue an EO, snap his fingers and those 5,000 prisoners Trump freed that the US had captured over the course of 20 years would teleport back to their cells. Thank you for that delightful analysis.

Let me guess, in your book Clinton was to blame for the WTC attacks nine months after Dubbya took office, right? Just want to make sure the MAGAt blindness goes to your core.

#17 | Posted by censored at 2024-09-10 07:13 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 6

Using reason to deal with American fascists is like talking to a windstorm, it may make one feel good, but the windstorm is not conscious enough for reason to be worthwhile.

#18 | Posted by Hughmass at 2024-09-10 07:45 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

#17. Biden/Harris had 100% control over how the ending was carried out. Cope and deal with it.

#19 | Posted by BellRinger at 2024-09-10 10:42 AM | Reply

strawbringer knows more than the generals! Just like TRUMP!

#20 | Posted by Alexandrite at 2024-09-10 10:43 AM | Reply | Funny: 1 | Newsworthy 1

#17. Biden/Harris had 100% control over how the ending was carried out. Cope and deal with it.

Trump set the conditions that Biden had to function under. Trump lowered our troop level to 2500 before he left office. The Generals told Trump that they needed at least 4500 troops to pull out successfully, but he wouldn't listen.

It's amazing how easily you adopt Trump's infantile mindset. If this were analogized to a chess match, Trump opened the game and promptly lost his queen, a bishop, and both knights while only capturing a couple pawns from the Taliban. Then he left this board for Biden to finish the game, while alter kvetching that Biden lost the game. This is Trump's history in a nutshell. He makes an unholy mess of a situation and leaves the denouement to others and then complains about the often lousy finish.

You can only play with the cards you're dealt - to mix metaphors. You cannot assign 100% blame to either player and you absolutely cannot blame the one following another's lead without any ability to start the entire process back from square one.

This is why those that know are making the opposite case of our leading poster who doesn't know Jack ----- from shinola.

#21 | Posted by tonyroma at 2024-09-10 10:53 AM | Reply | Funny: 1 | Newsworthy 8

while alter

while afterwards ....

#22 | Posted by tonyroma at 2024-09-10 10:54 AM | Reply

Biden/Harris had 100% control over how the ending was carried out. Cope and deal with it.

#19 | POSTED BY BELLRINGER

You can only play the hand you've been given.

Yeah, Trump sabotaged the withdrawal. He had ever incentive to do so and he is, of course, mentally ill.

#23 | Posted by Zed at 2024-09-10 11:09 AM | Reply

Cope and deal with it.

#19 | POSTED BY BELLRINGER

True realists are also honest people.

Deal with it.

#24 | Posted by Zed at 2024-09-10 11:11 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Biden/Harris had 100% control over how the ending was carried out.
#19 | Posted by BellRinger

Trump sprays his diarrhea all over world stage and cripples our military out of incompetence/spite/strategy to hurt incoming administration and our nation.

BellRinger: "Why didn't President Kamala fix this????!?!?! Trump 2024!!!

#25 | Posted by censored at 2024-09-10 11:16 AM | Reply

On his first day in office Biden undid all sorts of Trump EO's pertaining to the border.
#14 | Posted by BellRinger

On day one Biden Administration officials were lucky to be able to get the keys to their offices from Trumps people who were being told Trumpy was still the President.

The Afghanistan withdrawal was obviously a poison pill intentionally left behind by a revenge and retribution president.

Of course Stinkerbell is completely ignoring and pretending the roadblocks Trump put in place to prevent a smooth transfer of power didn't exist. Trumpy refused to concede that Biden was president which filtered down to every agency head. Trump actively tried to make the transition as difficult as possible. Including an attempted insurrection.

"meetings with the outgoing Trump administration were very difficult to set up. When they did set them up, they were often canceled at the last minute. When they weren't canceled at the last minute, the information that was shared was incomplete. And it just so happened that those people were in some of the most incredibly important parts of the transition " specifically, the budget, intelligence, foreign policy, and defense."

#26 | Posted by donnerboy at 2024-09-10 11:27 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

"Biden/Harris had 100% control over how the ending was carried out."

I see our compulsive liar is still lying regularly.

My guess is he'll avoid the salient part, where Trump released thousands of prisoners without consulting Afghanistan.

#27 | Posted by Danforth at 2024-09-10 11:31 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Cope and deal with it.

#19 | POSTED BY BELLRINGER

Looks like we have.

You maga maroons seem to be the ones who can't "deal with it".

#28 | Posted by donnerboy at 2024-09-10 11:34 AM | Reply

Biden/Harris had 100% control

It's hilarious how Kamala was an "invisible do-nothing VP" for 3 years but now she's right up there on the marquee for everything that happened under President Biden. Weird.

#29 | Posted by REDIAL at 2024-09-10 11:39 AM | Reply | Newsworthy 5

#29

Her claim was she was the last one in the room.

For the syrupeans, it means she tried to take credit for it, so she rightly deserves to be attached to it's failure.

#30 | Posted by oneironaut at 2024-09-10 11:53 AM | Reply

LOL Russians can't handle seeing Generals place the blame on trump.

#31 | Posted by Tor at 2024-09-10 12:07 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

Then he left this board for Biden to finish the game, while alter kvetching that Biden ended the game in a stalemate.

Let's not diminish the amazing feat Biden and his military commanders pulled off under the conditions that FDT left them with. Just because Jefffinger spins his logical fallacy wheel doesn't mean we have to accept the entire right wing narrative that he insists on promoting.

#32 | Posted by chuffy at 2024-09-10 12:14 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

I keep hearing people saying that the withdrawal was a failure and a disaster...seems to me it was a remarkable success, given the circumstances that the former president established.

Please give us concrete reasons for why you think the withdrawal was a failure.

#33 | Posted by chuffy at 2024-09-10 12:18 PM | Reply

For the syrupeans, it means she tried to take credit for it, so she rightly deserves to be attached to it's failure.

Being the "last one in the room" only means that the President will seek her counsel before making his final decision. She has the last chance to make her case, but it doesn't mean that her viewpoint will be the one the President chooses. And if he chooses something she didn't like or would have seen go another way, it's still her job to tell the public that she supports the President's decision without ever wavering from it come hell or high water.

That is simply what Vice Presidents do, that is one of the few defined jobs that they have.

And lastly, the part of this argument that is missing is this: Given the same conditions and the same options from the military charged with completing the mission, what precisely would Trump have done differently and how does he deduce that his way would have repelled the bomb attack? It's not like the brass designed different withdrawal plans for Biden than they had for Trump if he remained President. And Trump knows this, and uses the public's ignorance to his political advantage.

It's easy to criticize without offering alternatives, but it's far worse to leave someone else with your pile of crap and then blame them for the smell after you're gone.

PS: The only correct answer based on what we know would have been having more troops in Afghanistan to provide the level of security that wouldn't have allowed the bomber the access that he got. And in no world was Biden going to send more troops BACK into Afghanistan for the ones Trump prematurely removed, which became even less possible because we could no longer support Bagram Airbase - which was far more secure than Kabul International - due to lack of manpower because of Trump's withdrawals prior to his leaving office.

#34 | Posted by tonyroma at 2024-09-10 12:21 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

If Biden didn't hav3 enough troops to manage the withdrawal effectively he could have deployed more troops.

Accountability and personal responsibility are kyptonite concepts for the left.

Biden/Harris had 100% control over how th3 withdrawal was managed and executed. 100%. Thief own 100% of this catastrophe.

It's ridiculuous to even be having this conversation.

#35 | Posted by BellRinger at 2024-09-10 01:09 PM | Reply

It's ridiculuous to even be having this conversation.

#35 | POSTED BY BELLRINGER

So why are you bothering?

President Biden is no longer running and VP Harris had zero control.

#36 | Posted by donnerboy at 2024-09-10 01:24 PM | Reply

" The beginning of the end of Joe Biden's presidency arrived in August 2021.

That's when the president began a catastrophic pullout from Afghanistan that shredded our national credibility and his own reputation. He never really recovered."

www.nationalreview.com

#37 | Posted by BellRinger at 2024-09-10 01:39 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

I thought it was ridiculous to have this conversation?

I guess ridiculous conversations are a thing you like.

"He never really recovered."

Yup. I guess I won't be voting for Joe.

#38 | Posted by donnerboy at 2024-09-10 01:45 PM | Reply

It's ridiculuous to even be having this conversation.

#35 | Posted by BellRinger

You're right about that.

A convo where an online troll who parrots trump talking points all day thinks he knows military matters better than america's generals is quite ridiculous.

#39 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2024-09-10 01:50 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

Accountability and personal responsibility are kyptonite concepts for the left.

#35 | POSTED BY BELLRINGER

You are an un-selfaware joke.

#40 | Posted by Zed at 2024-09-10 01:58 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 5

online troll who parrots trump talking points all day

#35 | POSTED BY BELLRINGER

And yet he will vote for Trump only with the greatest of reluctance. Because he was forced into it and had no choice.

#41 | Posted by Zed at 2024-09-10 02:00 PM | Reply

shredded our national credibility

Posted by BellRinger

I thought that Trump did that in Helsinki when he sided with Putin and Russia over his own country.

You people have interesting internal landscapes. Or, put more simply...

You are so full of ----.

#42 | Posted by Zed at 2024-09-10 02:07 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

shredded our national credibility

Posted by BellRinger

Your party did that when they lied us into iraq, lit 7 trillion on fire, killed hundreds of thousands, and sent waves of refugees into europe.

#43 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2024-09-10 02:44 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 5

He drew down our troops in Afghanistan to an unsustainably small number, 2500 if memory serves and abandoned all but one airfield.

And he released 5000 Taliban terrorists out of prison that eventually toppled the government and killed the Marines with a bomb at the airbase during the chaos.

Now he uses the dead soldiers as a prop to blame Kamala for his failure while simultaneously pissing all over the other interred soldiers graves giving a ---- eating thumbs up.

The man has all the class, wit, intelligence and charm of a rectal thermometer.

#44 | Posted by Nixon at 2024-09-10 03:48 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

Accountability and personal responsibility are kyptonite concepts for the left.

#35 | POSTED BY BELLRINGER

The fanboi of the guy who rapes women, stole top secret documents, obstructed justice, orchestrated an attempt to overthrow the 2020 election and defrauded NYS says so so it mucst be true.

Piss off.

#45 | Posted by Nixon at 2024-09-10 03:51 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

I like it when MAGAts regale us with tales of how Kamala was secretly president for the last four years.

#46 | Posted by censored at 2024-09-10 03:52 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

This is Trump's history in a nutshell. He makes an unholy mess of a situation and leaves the denouement to others and then complains about the often lousy finish.

It's not just donOLD, it's republic*nts in general.

Raygun exploded the deficit.

Bush Sr - recession.

Clinton balanced the budget.

W - spent like a drunken fool and crashed the economy.

Obama - repaired the damage.

Der Dotard - bungled the pandemic resulting in 700,000+ American deaths and destroyed the economy.

Biden - the fastest economic recovery of any Western Democracy and now lead the world in growth.

#47 | Posted by Nixon at 2024-09-10 03:57 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 2

Accountability and personal responsibility are kyptonite concepts for the left.

#35 | Posted by BellRinger

"Accountability and personal responsibility are lawfare! Waaaah!"
- Jeff Bellringer Epstein-Worshipper

#48 | Posted by Sycophant at 2024-09-10 04:03 PM | Reply

#46. She bragged that she was the last person in the room with Biden.

I don't think Democrats can disassociate her from Biden at this late stage of the campaign.

#49 | Posted by BellRinger at 2024-09-10 04:11 PM | Reply

Yeah, Baby!

Being associated with Biden is almost as bad for a Candidate as... what?

Being a criminal/traitor who sold out his country's traditions and laws and values to halt the peaceful transfer of power in this country?

It's almost like people are whining about the small stuff when there are much more important stakes in this contest.

You know, as a distraction.

#50 | Posted by Corky at 2024-09-10 04:19 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

If I know Kamala Harris' personal fastidiousness, Trump might be walking into a ticking timebomb of his own if he he tries to gaslight America like Strawlighter is gaslighting us on this thread:

Kabul airport bomber was an ISIS operative freed from prison by the Taliban

The man who detonated a bomb outside the Kabul airport in August 2021, killing 170 Afghans and 13 American service members, was an Islamic State operative who had been held in a coalition detention facility in Afghanistan but was freed by the Taliban, according to a new U.S. military review that has identified him for the first time.

Some service members who were at the airport that day claimed they had spotted the suicide bomber at the site and were ordered not to engage. But the review found that those service members had the wrong man in their sights, and the strike was not preventable.

The actual bomber was Abdul Rahman al-Logari, according to the U.S. military. A facial comparison analysis determined that al-Logari and the bald man in black could not be the same person, the review found.

The team of military investigators reviewed photos and video taken of the scene before the attack and found no footage of al-Logari. He was determined to have arrived immediately before the blast and blended in with the massive crowd gathered outside the airport.

The officials involved in the review said that given the density of the crowd, the U.S. military members at the scene did not have time to identify him.

Al-Logari was among the thousands of militants released from Afghan prisons after the Taliban seized control of Kabul in mid-August 2021.

Who negotiated the withdrawal agreement which stopped US forces from engaging the Taliban, allegedly, for assurances that Taliban fighters would no longer attack our soldiers on the way out?

Who allowed the Taliban to decimate the American-trained Afghan Army - that basically threw down their guns and refused to fight, knowing that the rickety "government" in Kabul wasn't long for the world - as Trump announced a date certain for our withdrawal - something we did not do when leaving Iraq or any other active theater of war in this or the last century?

And how was Biden supposed to stop an attack by ISIS-K - again, something Trump negotiated on a promise from the Taliban that they wouldn't let ISIS-K to use Afghanistan as a base for terrorism, but with no other security assurances against those ISIS-K already there or in Afghani prisons, being released to attack the remaining US troops?

It's my fervent wish that Harris has these facts ready to counter anything about the withdrawal that Trump will throw at her. And after the debate is over, every single channel - including Fox - will have to admit what's written above is indeed the truth, regardless of what the House GOP smear-job report tries to ignore.

#51 | Posted by tonyroma at 2024-09-10 04:23 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 4

- He makes an unholy mess of a situation and leaves the denouement to others and then complains about the often lousy finish.

That's a Stormy Daniels quote, right?

#52 | Posted by Corky at 2024-09-10 04:24 PM | Reply | Funny: 2

She bragged that she was the last person in the room with Biden.

Scandalous!!!!!!!

#53 | Posted by ClownShack at 2024-09-10 04:26 PM | Reply

It's almost as bad as Trump Hosts Russian Foreign Minister Lavrov And Ambassador Kislyak At White House

#54 | Posted by ClownShack at 2024-09-10 04:30 PM | Reply

Re 51

The man who detonated a bomb outside the Kabul airport in August 2021, killing 170 Afghans and 13 American service members, was an Islamic State operative who had been held in a coalition detention facility in Afghanistan but was freed by the Taliban, according to a new U.S. military review that has identified him for the first time.

My hope is that she is as prepared for that question as you are.

#55 | Posted by donnerboy at 2024-09-10 04:36 PM | Reply

Al-Logari was among the thousands of militants released from Afghan prisons after the Taliban seized control of Kabul in mid-August 2021.

So Trump is ALSO (and maybe even more so) responsible for the deaths of those 13 Americans by his own actions as President. Mistakes were made by both presidents but as usual Dingaling blames it all on Biden.

So much for good people on both sides, eh? .

#56 | Posted by donnerboy at 2024-09-10 04:45 PM | Reply

She bragged that she was the last person in the room with Biden.

#49 | Posted by BellRinger

Before Trump left the White House, weren't you the last person under the Resolute desk?

#57 | Posted by Whatsleft at 2024-09-10 04:51 PM | Reply

So Trump is ALSO (and maybe even more so) responsible for the deaths of those 13 Americans by his own actions as President.

Exactly.

And the worst part? The media continues to allow Trump every opportunity to gaslight voters and even the families of victim soldiers, placing all the blame on Biden when he's the one who set forth the conditions for the Taliban takeover which allowed them to release the very bomber who attacked their loved ones.

And all in service of The Big Lie. Trump refused to allow Biden's transition team to interact with ANY government agencies or personnel until after he was inaugurated. Again, he put his own personal agenda ahead of not only the Constitution, but also our troop's safety and wellbeing.

I hope Harris prosecutes him tonight like nobody's ever seen.

#58 | Posted by tonyroma at 2024-09-10 04:58 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

And let us not forget these inconvenient facts:

Over his last 11 months in office, President Trump ordered a series of drawdowns of U.S. troops. By June 2020, President Trump reduced U.S. troops in Afghanistan to 8,600. In September 2020, he directed a further draw down to 4,500. A month later, President Trump tweeted, to the surprise of military advisors, that the remaining U.S. troops in Afghanistan should be "home by Christmas!" On September 28, 2021, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Milley testified that, on November 11, he had received an unclassified signed order directing the U.S. military to withdraw all forces from Afghanistan no later than January 15, 2021. One week later, that order was rescinded and replaced with one to draw down to 2,500 troops by the same date.

www.whitehouse.gov

So just who left the US short on the numbers of troops needed to 1) Keep Bagram AB open - which was far more secure than Kabul Intl; and 2) Provide the level of security needed to stop the bomber and to keep Afghanis from throwing their lives away by physically attaching themselves to the outside of our planes as they took off?

#59 | Posted by tonyroma at 2024-09-10 05:08 PM | Reply

I don't think Democrats can disassociate her from Biden at this late stage of the campaign.
#49 | Posted by BellRinger

But yet, you have no problem disassociating Trump from being himself (convicted felon, under numerous indictments, found to have raped a woman in a dressing room by a judge, defamed that same woman twice, used to go into teen girls dressing rooms while they were naked, election denying insurrectionist, cheated on his pregnant wife with a corn star, etc...).

#60 | Posted by censored at 2024-09-10 05:29 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 3

I don't think Democrats can disassociate her from Biden at this late stage of the campaign.

#49 | Posted by BellRinger

Republicans relying on the message that the VP has all the power in america. Anyone dumb enough to buy it is already in the cult.

#61 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2024-09-10 05:44 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

...the VP has all the power in america

John Garner said the Vice Presidency was "not worth a bucket of warm piss".

#62 | Posted by REDIAL at 2024-09-10 05:49 PM | Reply

#60. What is a corn star?

:)

#63 | Posted by BellRinger at 2024-09-10 06:02 PM | Reply

John Garner said the Vice Presidency was "not worth a bucket of warm piss".
#62 | Posted by REDIAL

Her deciding vote passed IRA.

That's a pretty big bucket.

#64 | Posted by oneironaut at 2024-09-10 06:06 PM | Reply

Her deciding vote passed IRA.

#64 | Posted by oneironaut

Good!

#65 | Posted by Whatsleft at 2024-09-10 06:26 PM | Reply

Her deciding vote (as President of the Senate) passed IRA.

#66 | Posted by REDIAL at 2024-09-10 06:30 PM | Reply

Her deciding vote passed IRA.

That's a pretty big bucket.

#64 | Posted by oneironaut

IRA is awesome.

But what makes her vote any more "deciding" than anyone else who voted for it?

#67 | Posted by SpeakSoftly at 2024-09-10 06:50 PM | Reply | Newsworthy 1

But what makes her vote any more "deciding" than anyone else who voted for it?
#67 | Posted by SpeakSoftly

It was a tie. Literally the only way VP can vote in the Senate is by being the deciding vote. And that was her.

#68 | Posted by censored at 2024-09-10 11:53 PM | Reply

It was a tie. Literally the only way VP can vote in the Senate is by being the deciding vote. And that was her.

This is how privileged today's Trump-led Republican Party is in the unending demand for minority rule - by THEM.

They never consider any majority against what they want to be legitimate, no matter how overwhelming, and especially so when votes are tight.

How in the world would anyone think that it's a fault for a Vice President to exercise her constitutional role as the Senate tiebreaker? You'd think that she was the one who violated the Constitution if you only listened to them.

#69 | Posted by tonyroma at 2024-09-11 07:21 AM | Reply

Trump lowered our troop level to 2500 before he left office. The Generals told Trump that they needed at least 4500 troops to pull out successfully, but he wouldn't listen.

Well yeah, he wanted to sabotage it because he lost.

Doesn't matter who had to die in the process, it was all about him. Just like everything is.

Just like the pandemic.

Just like the Israel hostages.

Just like the Ukrainian civilians.

Just like Paul Whelan.

He care about nothing but himself. If civilians have to die for him so be it.

#70 | Posted by Nixon at 2024-09-11 11:13 AM | Reply

The child-raping orange jizzfart deserves credit for not starting a brawl at the 9/11 memorial this morning.

#71 | Posted by reinheitsgebot at 2024-09-11 05:25 PM | Reply

biden&Co did not follow trumps plan, but it's his fault - only dems, and their complicit libbie media can promote that BS with a straight face..

#72 | Posted by MSgt at 2024-09-11 07:16 PM | Reply

Re 72

Guess you missed that little part of Trumpy's best plan ever where Trumpy agreed to release 5000 Taliban prisoners (with nothing in return).

One of which turned out to be the actual bomber that killed 13 American soldiers.

Thumbs up! & Smile!

#73 | Posted by donnerboy at 2024-09-11 08:05 PM | Reply

One of which turned out to be the actual bomber that killed 13 American soldiers.

That's not exactly right as I know it, but it's close. The bomber wasn't one of the 5000, but he was released by the Taliban only 2 weeks before the bombing, when they took over the government as the 300,000 Afghani troops we trained turned tail, leading to the elected government in Kabul to run for the hills as well. The Taliban took over the government without firing a shot in anger in Kabul.

Then, the head Taliban released prisoners that the elected government were holding in their prison. One of them was an ISIS-K member who then blew himself and many others in his suicide bombing.

#74 | Posted by tonyroma at 2024-09-11 08:17 PM | Reply

blew up

#75 | Posted by tonyroma at 2024-09-11 08:18 PM | Reply

"The bomber wasn't one of the 5000, but he was released by the Taliban only 2 weeks before the bombing"

Tony

Thanks for the correction. Don't want to mislead but if that's true it was still a prisoner released by the "plan". If he and the 5000 hadn't been released (at least until we were gone) those Americans would most likely still be alive.

#76 | Posted by donnerboy at 2024-09-11 08:25 PM | Reply

If he and the 5000 hadn't been released (at least until we were gone) those Americans would most likely still be alive.

Oh, it's all on Trump. He pulled the pin out of the grenade and handed it to Biden.

Maybe you missed this thread. It contains the whole story and was released by the White House last year. Our media has never widely published the information.

#77 | Posted by tonyroma at 2024-09-11 08:34 PM | Reply

"A day after the attack, ISIS-K, an Islamic State offshoot based in Afghanistan, identified al-Logari as the bomber. The new review marks the first time U.S. officials have said they have independent confirmation.

Al-Logari was among the thousands of militants released from Afghan prisons after the Taliban seized control of Kabul in mid-August 2021."

I may have mistaken the timeline but he was one of the prisoners released and there is no way we should have ever trusted them or given them such a free rein at the end. Not until we were out of country. It was a disaster by both administrations. And it's offensive to try and blame it all on Biden.

#78 | Posted by donnerboy at 2024-09-11 08:35 PM | Reply

It reminds me of the Bay of Pigs fiasco when JFK first came into office. He did not like the plan that had already been developed by the previous administration but he went with it anyway.

And we know how that turned out too.

#79 | Posted by donnerboy at 2024-09-11 08:38 PM | Reply

I may have mistaken the timeline but he was one of the prisoners released and there is no way we should have ever trusted them or given them such a free rein at the end.

I think you're conflating the situation. The government in Kabul that we've propped up for 20 years FLED. We were no longer fighting alongside them against the Taliban out in the provinces. There was open public discussion on how long they'd last before the Taliban advanced to Kabul. So the Afghani army figured out that they were dying for an already dead government and simply quit fighting and went home. So the Taliban took Kabul weeks before the estimated dates and replaced the old government.

That's how they came to releasing the prisoners that weren't a part of the negotiated Trump deal since we thought the old government would have kept them under lock and key until after we'd left. This was all a part of the Doha agreement that Trump negotiated which did get the Taliban to stop targeting the troops we had left in country. So the Taliban was already in control of Kabul and the country's infrastructure and government during the entirety of our evacuation process.

#80 | Posted by tonyroma at 2024-09-11 09:03 PM | Reply

#79

Exactly. Except Trump left no plans whatsoever because he never approved any - or if he did, they didn't share them with Biden.

Trump set the conditions, troop levels, and by proxy our ability to defend and protect the 2500 left if the Taliban reneged and decided to attack us again.

#81 | Posted by tonyroma at 2024-09-11 09:11 PM | Reply

This whole discussion has become circular.

Biden/Harris we're not bound by any of Trump's agreements. Biden/Harris were advised by military leaders that in order to have an orderly withdrawal mor3 troops needed to be deployed and keeping Bagram secure was critical. They were completely ignored by Biden/Harris. The actual withdrawal was an unmitigated disaster on just about every level. 13 soldiers dead because of a lack of security. Hundreds of US citizens and Visa eligible Afghans left behind. $60 billion of military equipment abandoned and gifted to the Taliban. The retaliatory response to the terror bobbing that killed 13 of our soldiers and dozens of others? A drone strike on an innocent family. All of that is 100% on Biden/Harris. They were in complete control.

After this unfettered disaster, not a single person in the administration was fired or held acco7ntable in any way that I recall.

#82 | Posted by BellRinger at 2024-09-11 09:43 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

Biden/Harris we're not bound by any of Trump's agreements. Biden/Harris were advised by military leaders that in order to have an orderly withdrawal mor3 troops needed to be deployed and keeping Bagram secure was critical. They were completely ignored by Biden/Harris.

You're lying again and the White House released all the details of their deliberations and discussions at this link. Nothing that you just made up is factual. There was no earthly reason to put troops back in to Afghanistan and put their safety at risk, only to pull them back out. At the point Trump left the military, more personnel only meant more opportunity for terrorist attacks, and you don't put combat troops back into a theater you're leaving. The reasons why are clearly articulated in the PDF.

Do yourself a favor and read the complete chronology of events documented for Congress and the public. Democratic presidents don't do half-ass with the military because Republicans always accuse them of being bad CICs no matter what they do. Even with all the former generals critical of Obama, I've not seen any flag-level criticism of Biden's deliberations on the withdrawal. We knew who the bomber was and we knew he'd be there that day. We had our troops looking for the exact bomber and there were reports that he was sighted, but it was another man unrelated to the bombing. We simply didn't have enough troops to locate him in the crowd before he detonated the bomb.

It's all in the White House report.

#83 | Posted by tonyroma at 2024-09-11 10:00 PM | Reply

This is excuse-making to the nth degree.

Stay with it if it makes you feel good, but sorry, not sorry. Biden/Harris we're 100% in charge. Trump was out of office. They were not bound by any agreements Trump made unless they were ratified by the Senate, which they weren't.

They had the power and ability to redeploy troops to Afghanistan. Remember in Iraq when Bush instituted "the surge"? It was unpopular but effective.

#84 | Posted by BellRinger at 2024-09-11 10:13 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

This is what constrained Biden's choices vis-a-vis troop levels after his inauguration:

As a result, when President Biden took office on January 20, 2021, the Taliban were in the strongest military position that they had been in since 2001, controlling or contesting nearly half of the country. At the same time, the United States had only 2,500 troops on the ground - the lowest number of troops in Afghanistan since 2001 - and President Biden was facing President Trump's near-term deadline to withdraw all U.S. forces from Afghanistan by May 2021, or the Taliban would resume its attacks on U.S. and allied was clear, that if we did not leave in accordance with that agreement, the Taliban would recommence attacks on our forces."
So putting more troops back into Afghanistan meant that we were escalating the war, and the Taliban would have recommenced attacking them again. If Biden breaks the agreement, the Taliban starts attacking us again.

Just where is a more preferable option you seem to think Biden should have chosen?

#85 | Posted by tonyroma at 2024-09-11 10:19 PM | Reply

You're a moron Strawlighter. Reality is calling and you refuse to answer because you exist in fantasy land. It's sad actually.

Bye bye.

#86 | Posted by tonyroma at 2024-09-11 10:20 PM | Reply

They had the power and ability to redeploy troops to Afghanistan.

Hell, they could still be there! Wouldn't that be fun?

#87 | Posted by REDIAL at 2024-09-11 10:38 PM | Reply

Re 80.

Thanks for clarification on that. Did some more reading to refresh myself on the timeline and I see now that the prisoner release in question was after the Taliban retook Kabul.

I also see that bullbringer still thinks VP Harris was somehow in charge and making decisions only months after Biden got elected.

#88 | Posted by donnerboy at 2024-09-11 11:18 PM | Reply

" So putting more troops back into Afghanistan meant that we were escalating the war, and the Taliban would have recommenced attacking them again. If Biden breaks the agreement, the Taliban starts attacking us again."

That is hypothetical nonsense. The Taliban had no ability to do anything other than guerilla war stuff and probably weren't going to try with an increased troop presence explicitly there to properly manage the withdrawal. Better to sit back, wait for the US to leave then roll back into town and take over. These people are backwards but are not stupid.

I don't fault the decision to withdraw. I vociferously fault how it was carried out and that is 100% on Biden/Harris.

#89 | Posted by BellRinger at 2024-09-11 11:19 PM | Reply

" I also see that bullbringer still thinks VP Harris was somehow in charge and making decisions only months after Biden got elected.

#88 | POSTED BY DONNERBOY AT 2024-09-11 11:18 PM | FLAG: "

She is welcome to come out and bash Biden for how the withdrawal was handled and explain what she would have done differently. She hasn't done so and openly bragged she was the last person in the room with Biden when the decisions were made. The only conclusion I can draw from all o& that is she fully supported it both then and now.

#90 | Posted by BellRinger at 2024-09-11 11:22 PM | Reply

" You're a moron Strawlighter. Reality is calling and you refuse to answer because you exist in fantasy land. It's sad actually."

Reality is POTUS is commander in chief. Period. At the time this happened Biden was CiC. He had complete control.

But at least lefties are now shifting from claiming it was an overwhelming success to it was bad and it's all Trump's fault even though he was out of office and had zero control. Baby steps, I guess.

#91 | Posted by BellRinger at 2024-09-11 11:26 PM | Reply

At the time this happened Biden was CiC. He had complete control.

You forgot to say Biden/Harris.

#92 | Posted by REDIAL at 2024-09-11 11:27 PM | Reply | Funny: 1

The Taliban had no ability to do anything other than guerilla war stuff and probably weren't going to try with an increased troop presence explicitly there to properly manage the withdrawal.

By refusing to read the pdf you continue to make absurdities wholly disconnected from the truth. All anyone who really wants to understand this in excruciating, documented detail needs to do is read the pdf.

I'm not going to debate your ignorance. There is another thread exactly about the withdrawal and the facts surrounding it. you simply don't have a viable clue why the bombing happened as it did and what deliberations were done before finalizing the plans for withdrawal.

Soldiers die and get injured in war as a matter of its course. These soldiers were in a war zone controlled by the Taliban. A known bomber overcame our search for him by blending into the immense crowd of Afghanis trying to flee the Taliban. This is the fog of war that really wasn't that foggy. We simply were unable to stop his suicide attack on the airport. But it wasn't due to lack of planning or being asleep at the wheel.

No one has to believe me, just read the pdf.

#93 | Posted by tonyroma at 2024-09-11 11:31 PM | Reply

The only conclusion I can draw from all o& that is she fully supported it both then and now.

#90 | POSTED BY BELLRINGER

lol

The ONLY conclusion eh?

How about not wanting to air our dirty laundry and the mistakes that BOTH administrations made in front of our enemies who will happily use it against us?

#94 | Posted by donnerboy at 2024-09-11 11:33 PM | Reply

Wanna know why there were hoards of Afghanis hanging onto our planes as they tried to take off because they couldn't get visas to legally enter the US?

When President Biden took office, the Special Immigrant Visa (SIV) program for Afghans who had worked with our soldiers and diplomats required a 14-step process based on a statutory framework enacted by Congress and involved multiple government agencies.

The Trump Administration's disregard and even hostility toward our commitment to Afghan allies led to a massive backlog of over 18,000 SIV applicants. Despite drawing down troops and committing to a full withdrawal, the departing Trump Administration had all but stopped SIV interviews. Refugee support services had been gutted and personnel dramatically reduced, lowering admissions to historic lows and forcing more than 100 refugee resettlement facilities in the United States to close.

And the Federal career workforce had been hollowed out. In November 2020, as President Biden was preparing to take office, the Department of State employed 12 percent fewer employees than it had four years earlier, leaving critical gaps.

This is what happens when you leave a reprobate in charge of your country's bureaucracy.
Immediately after taking office - and even before he had made a final decision to leave Afghanistan - President Biden instructed departments and agencies to begin doing the necessary work to increase capacity, in part to facilitate a withdrawal on the timeline required. During his first two weeks in office, President Biden signed Executive Order 14013 requiring departments and agencies to surge resources and streamline the application process for SIV applicants. On February 2, the Department of State resumed SIV interviews in Kabul. State doubled the number of SIV adjudicators at Embassy Kabul and quintupled the number of staff processing SIV applications - from 10 to 50 - in Washington, D.C. As a result of this surge, the United States went from issuing 100 SIVs a week in March to more than 1000 a week in July, and, working with Congress to streamline the process, reduced the average SIV processing time by more than one year. In July, the United States issued a record number of SIVs to our Afghan allies and began running the first ever SIV relocation flights.
Yeah, definitely Joe's fault, right?

#95 | Posted by tonyroma at 2024-09-11 11:53 PM | Reply

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